pick or no pick?

[sethlow3]

Originally Posted by dmusic148

Tupac's post = FACEPALM

Face palm indeed. So long as you are playing Music any technique can have a place.

[Duke21]

Originally Posted by Tupac

The only time you should be allowed to use a pick is when trying to emulate someone who uses a pick. New players are attracted to them because they can make you play great with little effort... yet there's little room for improvement. They're a crutch really. You can play fingers on anything that was made for a pick, but you can't play pick on anything made for fingers. Just ask Alex Webster. They also dilute your unique sound as a bass player by putting plastic between the bass and you, it's hard to sound unique with a pick (although though Chris Squier did). And I also get the impression that gung-ho pick players are people who started bass as an ignorant kid and just imitated guitarists without knowing fingers were even used. Sorry if I'm offending anyone, I just hate those things!

Can't agree to several points. You can always improve on any technique. I can't see how playing with a pick is easier, less demanding or a path to no improvement.
Fingers do not give more unique sound then the pick, been very general, I could say most fingers players sound about the same just as it is with pick players, at least from the common listener point of view.
Tony Levin had lots of problems playing Chris Squire bass lines, as he said it, the share amount of notes and precision on Close To The Edge almost made him sick.
I play pick because my idols did so, thus Chris Squire, Mike Rutherford, etc. I knew were my fingers was, but liked better the tone of the pick. I did play fingers actually when I've started playing bass because it was easier as a beginner, but after some training with the pick I've changed to pick style. I'll like to learn a bit more finger style, but I still feel I need to put more effort into pick technique.

[bongomania]

I suppose all of those pick-using guitarists must have only childlike skills and no dynamics.

[bongomania]

Also, if the "issue" is that people are emulating their idols, doesn't that mean they are doing what famous, successful, popular, wealthy, talented, and professional bassists are doing?

[lunarpollen]

Fingerstyle can easily sound heavier than pick style... Picking tends to sound harder, but not necessarily heavier. You can usually get a much thicker sound with fingers. Using a pick gives you a unique attack which can be more dynamic. It all depends on the sound you want for the song or the part of a song. Personally I use pick most of the time, but fingers for certain things that a pick can't do.

[spaz21387]

I dont like that clanky sound I get with fingers. I use picks for most of what I play. I can do finger style just as well as playing with a pick though.

[Rich Lee]

I've played for thirty-three years, always fretless,and always with my fingers, monster heavy to jazz light, and everything in between. I have, over the years, picked up the pick to pick the bass and just like Solomon and Cracked Machine I toss the pick across the studio. I'm old and set in my ways, but I never herd anyone complain,(I also leave my hearing aid at home)

[Epitaph04]

I kind of laugh when people say that playing bass with a pick is "easier." It's damn well harder for me to play bass with a pick!

[Means2nEnd]

I play with a pick and with fingers and I can tap and I can funk with my thumb. I play in an original heavy at times and mellow at times band. I play with what the song sounds best with for me and my tone. I have been playing over 28 years and I don’t claim to be incredible but I can hold down the low end and I get asked to play often by other respected musicians in my area. I don’t feel less than when I use a pick or fingers it doesn’t even enter my mind. Anyone who bashes a technique or a means of playing in a full generalized way has a lot to learn about being open minded and having some professional respect.

For me to even address another player because he made a stupid comment about fingers or picks or whatever is so much a waist of my time they don’t deserve me to even acknowledge them and frankly I don’t care what they think or if they gig or sit in their bedrooms doing nothing. They are stuck in a mindset they feel they need to defend or to be able to put something down because inside they truly don’t have full confidence in their own playing or knowledge of music or what it is to be a musician. I hope only that they will grow into a more professional or wider minded prospective but chances are they won’t and that’s ok too. Enough about small people with small thoughts.

As to what sounds heavier it depends on many factors and is more than just simple plectrum or not. First regarding the fingers or pick the attack and percussive sound of a note played by a pick can vary how you hold the pick. If you choke up on it only leaving the tip exposed it can smooth and fast especially when playing closer to the neck. Letting more of the pick exposed and playing closer to the bridge can get a very hard percussive punch. Chris Squire actually hits the string with the edge of the pick and the edge of his thumb and has a completely unique way of playing with a pick and has his own tone and sound completely. Versatility is also huge as it is with many forms of finger playing.

My Warwick NT 5 string thumb to me when I play it sounds huge with my fingers and wimpy when I play that bass with a pick definitely on the D or G string. My Zon Sonus with humbuckers sound freaking killer either way. I get the overall feeling that when I play a bass with humbuckers or MM pickups they tend to lend themselves better to a pick and single coil or stacked jazz pickups sound better to me with fingers. So I actually put as much thought into what bass I’m going to use with what strings as I do with I am going to use a pick or fingers. All so very subjective and unique to the individual player.
As an overall statement on famous players doing whatever on a bass just remember one thing they are famous and most likely you are not. So try to learn something from them rather than cast judgment. They too as I would imagine don’t care what you think of them and how they play even more so than I don’t. I will say there are many guys who can shred and play faster with fingers than with a pick. I can play more notes in a shorter time with my fingers but for me like many players I hear playing fast with fingers they must play lighter and the notes get lost and sound weak to me sometimes. Alex Webster and Billy Sheehan can play mind blowing speeds and have total accuracy and sound full and bad ass they are not the only ones but they stick out in my mind as the guys doing it right as far as fast, articulate, and most of all what you asked heavy. There are many more but this is already too long.

I believe Mr. Lemmy K sounds pretty freaking heavy as well as Jason Newstead, Justin Chancellor, John Campbell, Jeordie White, are a few getting it done right heavy with a pick. Get all your basses and play them both ways and decide for yourself and ask they guys your playing with what they like better. Using both is cool then you don’t sound the same all the time. If you can’t remember to bring a pick to a gig you probably can’t remember much of anything. Good luck use your ears.

[Stumbo]

Another pick vs. pluck thread? Oh no you di'ent~!

I always used a pick for a few decades until I happened upon TalkBass, Jamerson, Prestia and all the other great players who didn't use a pick.

Playing with a pick made easier for me to get a cleaner tone with the amps/cabs(Sunn) I was using. Playing in echo chamber venues, the bass players I heard back then seemed muddy and undefined. Turns out it was mostly their amps and 18's but I got my tone (with JBL's) and 120watt tube amps to sound like Pete Cetera of Chicago when Terry Kath was with him.

I wood shedded a bit a couple of years ago until I got the pluck down and now I can do both w/o a problem. I can also cut the treble/bass and boost mids a bit on my active 3 band eq. Ibanez Musician P/J and no one can really tell the difference between pick and pluck when we jam.

Life is good.

[88persuader]

As has been mentioned very good players have used both techniques. For me it's strictly fingers because I feel I can get more variation in tone from my fingers. (Hard tip of the fingers for bright tone, meat of the finger for warmer tone, thumb for slapping ... slap a da bass) I've used a pick when I was just learning and on rare ocasions when I need that sound or I get a bad blister on my fingers on a gig. You can also get tonal variation from a pick however you need to depand more on electronics if you really want warm tones. One other thing I feel is true, a bass player who plays finger style can always use a pick to get THAT sound but a bass player who always and only uses a pick is at a tonal disadvantage. My PERSONAL opinion is bass players use fingers, guitarist who play bass use picks.

[iamthebassman]

Originally Posted by Tupac

The only time you should be allowed to use a pick is when trying to emulate someone who uses a pick.

Believe it or not, I don't feel compelled to do what you say, and in fact, I play however I wish.

I always find it strange that "pick" players usually reply to these silly threads with something like "I use a pick to get the sound I like", where as "fingers" players usually say something like "Anyone who plays with a pick is an idiot". Funny ain't it?

Why do I look at these stupid threads?

[Pilgrim]

Originally Posted by THE HIPPIE

Just curious why do most bassists use bare fingers when playing bass when you can use pick to sound heavier?

First, "heavier" is not a very meaningful term. How you sound is all a matter of technique. Use of a pick can sound "heavy" (whatever that means) and also sound quite bright and light, as in some surf music.

Bass players should have multiple techniques and the ability to use both pick and fingers. They are simply tools, and depriving yourself of a whole range of sounds that can be accessed by either tool (pick or fingers) makes no sense.

[Kentucky Ryan]

depends on the style. for my progressive band i use a pick, in my rock band i use fingers.

[Fullback32]

Originally Posted by Tupac

The only time you should be allowed to use a pick is when trying to emulate someone who uses a pick. New players are attracted to them because they can make you play great with little effort... yet there's little room for improvement. They're a crutch really. You can play fingers on anything that was made for a pick, but you can't play pick on anything made for fingers. Just ask Alex Webster. They also dilute your unique sound as a bass player by putting plastic between the bass and you, it's hard to sound unique with a pick (although though Chris Squier did). And I also get the impression that gung-ho pick players are people who started bass as an ignorant kid and just imitated guitarists without knowing fingers were even used. Sorry if I'm offending anyone, I just hate those things!

Wow, I think John Paul Jones, bassist for Led Zeppelin (one of the greatest rock bassists ever), would disagree with a lot of this. He used both pick and fingers. He said it depended on the song and what sound he was trying to get. My playing style is admittedly heavily influenced by him and I do the same thing....some songs finger; some songs pick. It all depends on what sound I want.

If you don't like or want to use picks, cool, but if Chris Squire is good with them (as you mentioned), who are any of us to argue?

[Ric5]

Learn as many styles as you can. Have pick playing as part of your tool box. I can play faster with more control with a pick. Some songs sound better picked and some don't.

[AlvarHanso]

If it's good enough for Phil Lesh, John Entwistle, Mike Gordon, Chris Squire, John Paul Jones, Paul McCartney, Roger Waters, and many many others, I don't see how it's possibly bad technique, or easier than fingerstyle. Telling Phil Lesh he should put down his pick would be like telling Mark Knopfler he had to start using a pick. If it accentuates the musical experience, why is it bad or wrong? Just because you don't like it? Well then, grow the hell up, because the world doesn't revolve around you or any one of us. Opinions on pick playing don't change the amazing music created with a pick.

[aseksysasquatch]

I think you should do both.... its always good to know a little bit of everything!

[Duckwater]

Originally Posted by Epitaph04

I kind of laugh when people say that playing bass with a pick is "easier." It's damn well harder for me to play bass with a pick!

Agreed

I LOVE the sound of a bass being played with a pick, many of my favorite tones come from pick players (Chris Squire, Roger Glover, Greg Lake, Paul McCartney, Peter Giles, JPJ, Mel Schacher, etc). But I cannot play with a pick for more than a minute without my right hand cramping terribly (I have practiced many different techniques, it just doesn't work for me). I can get reasonably close with low action, mid-present strings, and a forceful attack, but it isn't the same.

[beebassdude]

depends on the style. both can be necessary for certain styles. theres no rules as to what you can play the bass with. if youd like to line your fingers with thimbles and go to town, have at it. if it sounds good who gives a **** haha