RIght hand technique

[Road Bull]

Hi all,

I am new to TB community and have a question or two. I am a drummer that has started to play bass. I really dig it as I can not play drums with my current living situation and still love making music and learning. I like the sound of playing with fingers. So what feels natural to me is playing with three fingers. Maybe it is all the galloping Iron Maiden I listened to as a kid.

So I was wondering, when I begin on the 1, I noticed I am starting with my ring finger. Like when you are taping your fingers on a desk. From pinkie to index. On one hand, I feel that things will work themselves out. Oh the other hand, I want to start on with a solid foundation that I will not have to correct later on. I guess it would be easier if I just used two fingers, but I had a bass player friend years ago tell me that if I were to pick up bass, that I should try to use 3 fingers. Anyway... here I am.

For those of you that play with 2 or 3 fingers, what is your "lead" finger. Do you use the index to drop the on the one, or middle, or other?

Thanks in advance!

[JimmyM]

My index is my lead finger but I know plenty of folks who use their middle and even their ring finger. Makes no difference.

[Mark Perry]

I use two fingers and let my middle finger lead. The method i learned from (Bass for beginners by Glenn Letsch) reasons that since that finger is the longest, it's tends to already be resting on the string.

Edit: Oh, and when crossing to a lower string it tends to make sense to use the same finger again.

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Mark Perry

Edit: Oh, and when crossing to a lower string it tends to make sense to use the same finger again.

Not if you want to play fast stuff it doesn't. Doing that is what's known as "raking," and is one of the biggest causes of people who are trying to play fast licks not being able to play them smoothly. I don't know why, but people who like to rake always want to give me crap about it when I say it, but I don't know of anyone who has stopped raking and gone to strict alternation and doesn't prefer alternating.

[Mark Perry]

Different strokes for different folks. Do you let your fingers bounce off the string below rather than rest? I'm giving that a quick go, and i can see strict alternating making sense in that context.

[Road Bull]

So it looks like it would be worth being consistent with running all three fingers in order. Sound like it will help down the road with playing fast runs.

Is it more common for bassists to just use two fingers then?

[chaosMK]

I've worked on my RH technique so extensively over the last 10+ years (fingerstyle prog metal) that I don't have to think about things... complex or super fast rhythms just happen naturally. If I have to think about it, I probably lead with my ring. If I am doing extended fast 16ths or need serious accents, I slap T-R-M-I.

Steve Harris actually uses only 2 fingers. I always felt like 3 was the most natural way to play the rhythm that he uses in every song.

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Road Bull

So it looks like it would be worth being consistent with running all three fingers in order. Sound like it will help down the road with playing fast runs.

Is it more common for bassists to just use two fingers then?

Yes but 3 finger technique has been gaining in popularity in recent years. Can't do it myself, unless I'm galloping, which on a gig is never

[FretlessMainly]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Not if you want to play fast stuff it doesn't. Doing that is what's known as "raking," and is one of the biggest causes of people who are trying to play fast licks not being able to play them smoothly. I don't know why, but people who like to rake always want to give me crap about it when I say it, but I don't know of anyone who has stopped raking and gone to strict alternation and doesn't prefer alternating.

You've posted this several times, and I'm here to tell you that the absolute nature of your position on this matter is not valid.

[MisterWraith]

For the first few years that I played I used the strict alternation of my index and middle fingers I was taught. Eventually somewhere around 1989 or so I decided to start working with three fingers, which is how I've played the majority of what I play since that time. There are definitely times (such as crossing strings, certain changes in rhythm etc.) where alternating my index and middle fingers is still smoothest, and where I hit these spots the transition has just become an automatic aspect of how I play. My index finger is my lead finger, followed by my ring finger, and then my middle. I've seen it done all sorts of ways, and can't say that my way is "right", but it's worked very well for me for around 20 years now.

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by FretlessMainly

You've posted this several times, and I'm here to tell you that the absolute nature of your position on this matter is not valid.

Oh I believe it is 100% valid. I used to rake, now I SA. I am a LOT smoother now at fast tempos with a lot of string skipping than I ever was before. Not even close. Those I've talked into trying it report the same results. The only ones who don't are the steadfast rakers. Can you rake and play fast with a lot of string skipping? I suppose. But having been on both sides of the equation, I find it greatly easier to be smooth and in tempo by strict alternation. Raking takes your fingers out of the rhythm they've built up.

[Lesfunk]

Jimmy's right. However Strict alternation requires practice to develop it and discipline to execute it consistently. I've developed too many bad habits over the years and don't spend enough time practicing to fix them.
I guess that makes me a proponent of the raking tecnique.
To the Original point I don't think it matters how many plucking fingers you use as long as you have the ability to play with equal volume on all digits and have an alternating system that feels smooth to you.

[Fergie Fulton]

+1 to Jimmy because raking is part of the the technique that allows the same finger to use the string underneath it lands on, a different matter to having to go back to a sting above of miss a string out. Alternate picking means you can move either way.

As for what finger dominates ,that is no an issue. Do you start with the dominate finger each time for example is you play through rests or sycopation, again not an issue so much, but getting the brain and the fingers to alternate as a matter of technique is everything to being smooth and fluent. Remember it is your brain telling you what is the strong beat in a song or piece of music, so it will try and set the dominant finger to it. Thats why players double hit or rake because they want to end up with the dominant finger on the string beat during runs or odd number note values. It pays off big time to be able to alternate at will......raking then is a technique choice to use, not a habit of not having the choice.

[FretlessMainly]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Oh I believe it is 100% valid...Raking takes your fingers out of the rhythm they've built up.

I don't doubt that you believe that it's 100% valid, but my position is that in any artistic endeavor, the mere concept of 100% is a tenous position to adopt. As for me, the raking helps maintain the rhythm rather than taking it away. I would add that my playing style typically involves extensive use of pull-offs and hammer-ons, so my right hand is only functional intermittently anyway (e.g., in a ten-note run, I'll only pluck 3-4 of them).

I don't doubt that SA can be a good technique for speed, but after 31 years, my hands are locked into one another and it's not time to change what I've built up.

[JimmyM]

I changed my approach after 20 years of playing...just sayin'

Anyway, if in a 10 note run you only hit 3 or 4 of them, that's a fully different technique, a more legato technique. But try a 30 or 40 note run of 16th notes at 150 bpm, and then the difference becomes more apparent.

[FretlessMainly]

Well, I pretty much top out with sixteenths @ 132-138 bpm, so maybe I don't hit the "fast" zone. If I ever need to do more (which I doubt), I may look into SA further.

[Bassorama57]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Oh I believe it is 100% valid. I used to rake, now I SA. I am a LOT smoother now at fast tempos with a lot of string skipping than I ever was before. Not even close. Those I've talked into trying it report the same results. The only ones who don't are the steadfast rakers. Can you rake and play fast with a lot of string skipping? I suppose. But having been on both sides of the equation, I find it greatly easier to be smooth and in tempo by strict alternation. Raking takes your fingers out of the rhythm they've built up.

-> aligns self with Jimmy, though I'll admit that raking is the lazy man's way. Really tho, it's a different sound, raking gets that "bu-dum" sound, as opposed to SA, which is (just what Jimmy says) smoother and more precise aka Rocco P & TOP.
-> on the topic under discussion, I lead with the social finger, not sure why, but the middle is lead.
On the general topic of old with bad habits, if nothing else, to forestal mental degredation (which at my age I'm overdue for), I purposely try to do things I can't do in practice just to remind my brain that it's the boss of my fingers.

[FretlessMainly]

Originally Posted by Bassorama57

...I'll admit that raking is the lazy man's way. Really tho, it's a different sound, raking gets that "bu-dum" sound, as opposed to SA, which is (just what Jimmy says) smoother and more precise aka Rocco P & TOP.

I wouldn't consider 31 years of techique work that happens to arrive at raking once it's actually thought about by the player (me) as "lazy." And I'll tell ya, my lines are much more "bu-dum" than da-da-da-da.

Until the past couple of months when I read threads about this here, I never really thought about it, but having examined my playing in this context since then, I think raking has helped me to develop my style, which is a rich mix of syncopation, pull-offs and hammer-ons.

I've played Cherokee live at 1/4 = 320 on double bass with a straight walking style that I'm sure included raking (I don't play DB much anymore), but on electric bass, fretted or fretless, my style is so non-downbeat as to consider SA something I'd prefer to avoid. There's no need for it in my style, at least at this point, and at 47, I don't foresee too many changes in the future.

[Ironderby]

it just goes to show you should do whats most comfortable for you, this doesnt really help your technique i know, but i pick with 3 fingers in this order
(when im galloping) R=ring, M=middle, I=index: r,i,m,r,i,m. Odd, but i find it easiest

[JimK]

Originally Posted by Road Bull

For those of you that play with 2 or 3 fingers, what is your "lead" finger. Do you use the index to drop the on the one, or middle, or other?

FWIW-
95% of what I play is with the index & middle (the thumb would be my "3rd" digit...no tone coming out of my Ring finger).
That said, as a drummer, have you considered thinking of your index & middle fingers as a pait of drum sticks? I'm sure you have some paradiddle exercises that you could apply here. IMO, this is something you can "practice" (no amp required) while you watch the NFL on Sunday afternoons (if you're so inclined).