slap bass not cutting through

Fishbrain · #1 03-23-2007, 07:46 AM

As far as I'm aware I'm ok at slapping, (maybe stretch to good if im not too modest

)

when I'm on my own everythings fine but when I play in a band situation when I switch to a slapping riff the bass seems to disappear from the whole sound.

I play in quite a heavy riff based rock/metal band if that helps.

Is this my technique or is it more of an EQ issue?

I play a warwick corvette FNA through an svt3pro an two warwick cabs (4x10 1x15) if that makes any difference.

thanks.

TeeMartin · #2 03-23-2007, 07:49 AM

Kinda weird. I get louder when I slap. Buy a volume pedal?

Fishbrain · #3 03-23-2007, 08:09 AM

iv been thinkin bout gettin a volume boost pedal but if its a problem with me I'd rather fix it that way than buy a pedal!

iplaybassguitar · #4 03-23-2007, 08:22 AM

same damn thing happens to me. boost your mids right before you start slappng, if possible. i know usually "slap tone" has kinda scoped mids, but boosting them a bit will help cut through a bit.

Deacon_Blues · #5 03-23-2007, 02:00 PM

I also own a Warwick Corvette, a passive one with Bartolinis I installed a few weeks ago. I have always experienced the same as you when slapping - there seems to be a volume loss compared to fingerstyle playing. When I've been analyzing this phenomenon in my playing, there's a few things I've found that IMO explains this issue:

- The frequency spectras between a slapped and a plucked note are very different
- The volume curve over time is different - When slapping, the attack is stronger (louder) than in fingerstyle playing, but the volume right after that attack is (for me) lower. Or so it sounds at least... a plucked note "ring out with a higher volume" (if you know what I mean) than a slapped note
- There is a volume difference in the simple fact that you speak about two completely different playing styles
- You pluck and slap the string on who different locations on the string - This affects the frequency response (or spectra)
- The way the bass is setup might affect this as well (not sure about this)

My way to solve the problem is to use a compressor if I know I will use some slapping in a particular song. The bad thing with that is that it also makes it much harder to play dynamically...

(I mean the dynamics during the fingerstyle parts, don't really know how "dynamics" is defined in slapping...

)

(Think I just found the reason for why I've never been very fond of the mysic by mr. Wooten and mr. Miller... hehe...)

Audiophage · #6 03-23-2007, 07:32 PM

I think part of it is technique, and part of it is equalisation. Try experimenting with various combinations of those.

IconBasser · #7 03-23-2007, 10:06 PM

make shure you're compressors aren't on. With the power spikes that come from slapping, my amp always mutes it unless the compressor is off.

Deacon_Blues · #8 03-23-2007, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IconBasser

make shure you're compressors aren't on. With the power spikes that come from slapping, my amp always mutes it unless the compressor is off.

That's what happen if the compressor is not setup correctly (which is a rather tricky thing). The compressor also helps me to play fingerstyle with a lighter touch, which is a big advantage when playing faster stuff.

As the compressor is only a compromise, the best way to solve the volume difference issue is to use two different sound settings that you can switch between with a stomp box. But I don't have the equipment to do that quickly (I need a midi controller first, and I have not had any strong need for that yet).

All_¥our_Bass · #9 03-24-2007, 01:10 AM

Don't scoop your mids. In fact boost them more than seems nessicary.

Joe Nerve · #10 03-24-2007, 01:55 AM

Glad some people are finally saying not to scoop the mids. I never quite got that. Scooping the mids always made for a crappy slap sound for me. Whenever I see a slap switch on a bass or amp, I know that means it's a sound I'm never going to use.

The bass and amp really have a lot to do with it. I vaguely remember slap getting lost when I owned a warwick. Bongo did a much better job for me. Just got a new Stingray and GK rig, and the 2 of them things together were made for slapping. Lots of midrange, and lots of crispy, thumpy sounds that cut bigtime with barely hitting the strings.

I put a sample on this page, but really got it goin with the gk. www.thenerve.info/stingray

I think if you fiddle lots with your EQ you'll find something in there that works - although I never learned to tame my warwick. It never did what I wanted it to and it sounded incredibly different in every room I played it in.

Fishbrain · #11 03-24-2007, 02:59 AM

thanks for all the advice!

Nitto · #12 03-25-2007, 12:23 AM

Fishbrain, check your amp. if it's already cranked and then you switch to a slap technique, you'll be putting it through a huge amount of gain, which if your amp has a small power supply in it, it won't take it and it'll flatten off.

also, try messing around with different strings and action, i've heard halfrounds have more punch, that might help you get your slap sounding boomy

chaosMK · #13 03-26-2007, 09:09 AM

Get rid of the "smiley" looking EQ. Push low mids. Make the midrange a little more aggressive.

I use a preamp (sansamp) to run a great slap tone that cuts through, and switch it off when I want a less aggressive tone.

Fishbrain · #14 03-27-2007, 02:42 AM

can u usea sans amp pre amp with a normal head or do u need to have a seperate pre and power amp?

Kalyptic · #15 03-27-2007, 04:49 AM

I think Its ur technique, if u want bass volume when u slap, slap overhand, whereas if u want a more percusive sound with less bass slap above the neck

Fishbrain · #16 03-27-2007, 04:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kalyptic

I think Its ur technique, if u want bass volume when u slap, slap overhand, whereas if u want a more percusive sound with less bass slap above the neck

i dont understand?

Burg · #17 04-18-2007, 01:23 PM

I'm having this same problem, there's a part in one of my bands songs where I switch from finger style to slap, and I can barely hear the slapped part. My EQ set up is +4db boost at 250hz and about the same again at 3khz. I like the sound, but not the drop in volume, I've also been wondering if a compressor could help with this.

middy · #18 04-18-2007, 01:50 PM

Quote:

when I play in a band situation when I switch to a slapping riff the bass seems to disappear from the whole sound

And this is a bad thing how?

Infernal Affair · #19 04-18-2007, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fishbrain

I play in quite a heavy riff based rock/metal band if that helps.

Is this my technique or is it more of an EQ issue?

I don't think anyone's mentioned this, but maybe it's the band? If they play a lot of heavy riffs, then more than likely the guitars are dipping into your frequencies and drowning out your upper harmonics and mids. Slap is a percussive sound, and it generally isn't very legato. If a slap line has to compete with heavy, drop tuned riffs, I doubt it'd be heard.

This isn't to say that slap can't be in metal or hard rock. Billy Gould from Faith No More had some great slap lines. It's just the band gave him a lot of room when working them.

Fishbrain · #20 04-19-2007, 02:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Infernal Affair

I don't think anyone's mentioned this, but maybe it's the band? If they play a lot of heavy riffs, then more than likely the guitars are dipping into your frequencies and drowning out your upper harmonics and mids. Slap is a percussive sound, and it generally isn't very legato. If a slap line has to compete with heavy, drop tuned riffs, I doubt it'd be heard.

This isn't to say that slap can't be in metal or hard rock. Billy Gould from Faith No More had some great slap lines. It's just the band gave him a lot of room when working them.

i've not thought of that, how do bands such as mudvayne get away with it though?