So I have tendonitis..

[thrash_jazz]

I think I can name a few but one in particular would be Alex Webster of Cannibal Corpse (yes, it's that metal stuff again ). I've seen them live three times and the guy is blazing for pretty much the whole set (although they do have some slower parts as well). And he plays with his fingers, not a pick.

Bear in mind that I do not only listen to metal. I listen to pretty much everything, but I've never heard anything quite as fast and intense as some metal bands. Of course speed isn't everything (and most of them do play with feeling, even if that feeling is obviously rage) but I find it interesting. That's just me though

Interesting topic - now that I think about it I've always wondered how his hands don't fall off!

[Howard K]

yes, but is he playing 16th at 180bpm!

just a 10bpm drop on that tempo, or a 16 bar break into 8ths, or a 16th note FEEL for a few songs, would make all the difference to the RSI factor... Garrett did say that he kept up that pace for 45 mins per day!

anyway, so your point that "Lots of pro bassists do it night after night" is possibley an exageration then?

Metal is the ONLY form of music that I can envisage this sort of pace being required fairly frequently, and even then there arent that many bassists who perform those tempos in the grand scheme of things, are there?!

[thrash_jazz]

Originally posted by Howard K
yes, but is he playing 16th at 180bpm!

just a 10bpm drop on that tempo, or a 16 bar break into 8ths, or a 16th note FEEL for a few songs, would make all the difference to the RSI factor... Garrett did say that he kept up that pace for 45 mins per day!

Good point, there are a LOT of changes in that sort of music - sometimes higher than 180bpm and sometimes lower. What I meant was that that is probably the AVERAGE. In that, my post was a bit misleading... sorry!

I think this probably what Garrett meant as well (true or false?). He made reference to some old Metallica songs off the album "Kill 'Em All" which do top off at about 220 bpm at times, but 16ths don't go on for the whole song, and certainly not the whole album!

[Howard K]

16ths at 220bpm! - i gotta hear that player with fingers!

did newsted play that? he used a pick didnt he?

[thrash_jazz]

Originally posted by Howard K
16ths at 220bpm! - i gotta hear that player with fingers!

did newsted play that? he used a pick didnt he?

That was the late Cliff Burton, who did play with his fingers. I believe the song in question is "Metal Militia". IIRC there are parts (albeit brief ones) with 16th-notes, but it has been a while since I've heard that song so I could be wrong.

I guess Newstead would have had to be able to do that one live. He does use a pick.

[Howard K]

heard a lot about cliff burtn, need to check some of his stuff out me thinks..

a mate of mine is well into metallica - or at least he was up until the album with enter sandman on it. he also says that newsted is completely cack and that they buried him so far down in the mix on his first few albums with the band that you couldnt tell he was there!

i expect they did the same live if he's as cack as i;v heard a few people say?

you must listen to metallica, is newsted cack, in your opinion?

[thrash_jazz]

Well, IMO Newstead's playing with Metallica isn't a true show of what he can do. I'd heard some of his old stuff with Flotsam and Jetsam - much better playing, much higher in the mix.

Haven't heard much live Metallica but supposedly the bass is higher in the mix than it is on the albums.

Same story with Burton - he is doing some great stuff a lot of the time but it is VERY low in the mix! To the point where it's a great ear training exercise to figure out his lines; once you can do that you can also hear the grass grow and paint drying

It's kinda hard to gauge Newstead's Metallica work because, according to all accounts they basically told him what to play... and you can guess what a guitarist would want a bassist to play!

Myself, I stopped listening to Metallica after "Load" came out...