Steady Eighth Notes

Murphbass · #1 02-04-2009, 06:14 PM

I've been playing 22 years, consider myself mildy proficient or better in a variety of styles. Yet, playing eighth notes that don't sound uneven or grooveless eludes me. I'm not talking swung 8ths, but rather very straight rock 'n roll 8ths (think indie rock/alternative). Fortunately, it's not often that I have to use them. But, I'd like to get better.

Any suggestions other than sit down with a metronome or drum machine to practice them? Are there exercises that you've found helpful?

I seem to remember my cello teacher taking passages and practicing them with a swung rhythm, and then practicing the same passage with the opposite rhythm (16th followed by a dotted 8th).

Edinburgh_Bass · #2 02-04-2009, 06:19 PM

Hi, do you play mostly finger style or with a pick?

smogg · #3 02-04-2009, 06:24 PM

Steady eight notes for rock listen to AC/CD, the master of down picking eight notes.

Murphbass · #4 02-04-2009, 06:42 PM

I'm mainly concerned with fingerstyle 8ths, but I want to work on my pick technique, too.

rarisgod · #5 02-04-2009, 06:53 PM

Not necessarily rock, but I'd recommend some Tower of Power. Rocco Prestia is well-known for his steady 8th notes.

RDUB · #6 02-04-2009, 08:51 PM

Lots of good suggestions to listen to... My approach to improve even finger technique is really simple. Play and eighth note figure with your index finger on the one beat. Then play the same figure with your middle finger on the one. Concentrate on making them sound even, and exactly the same. When you want to expand and get more finger independance, try running some scales, strictly alternating your two fingers. Start with the index first, then repeat with the middle finger. With some shedding, it'll start to feel natural to use either finger, and then when you play the 'U2 eighth notes until you die' song, it'll come out much more even!

von buck · #7 02-04-2009, 09:15 PM

One word, metronome.

Andy

Craig_S · #8 02-04-2009, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rarisgod

Not necessarily rock, but I'd recommend some Tower of Power. Rocco Prestia is well-known for his steady 8th notes.

Rocco is mostly known for his 16th note funk grooves.

Murphbass: I honestly don't understand your dilemma. Can you play straight (sustained) quarters? Double up. Count 1 and 2 and 3 and 4 or double the tempo of the song on your metronome and play it at regular speed (I read your post, but...). I think you might be making more of it than it really is.

daffy · #9 02-05-2009, 01:27 AM

I agree with the OP - churning out a tight stream of straight 8th notes is not easy, and people like Ed Friedland agree in his various books. It takes a lot of concentration to keep them coming regularly and evenly.

I found a couple of things really helped my timing in this respect:
1. Metronome
- use a metronome and set it **slow**, like 20-30bpm. Then play a single note (any note) in straight 8ths to it, but focus on making your volume even with both fingers, and maintaining rock solid tempo. Make sure you hit those metro beats bang on.
- now switch between playing scales or runs of notes to the slow tempo, or playing single notes at a faster tempo.
- now try single notes, slow, and do long notes for a while, then short staccato notes for a while, then short/long combos trying to get a pumping groove like the groove in Sly Stone's Everyday People, If You Want Me To Stay, or Wanna Take you Higher.

The important thing is to learn how to get control of the time and feel of the 8th notes and bend them to your will, not the other way round!

The last thing I found really useful is to set the metronome to hit every 2, 4, 6 or 8 beats, and then play your 8th notes, making sure you nail the metronome hit when it comes.

Good luck!

downneck · #10 02-05-2009, 01:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by von buck

One word, metronome.

Andy

QFT

JamesTaylor85 · #11 02-05-2009, 01:59 AM

i play them a fair bit and whenever ive wanted them to sound even and grooveless, i jus move my fingers closer to the bridge, the strings have less movement there and i find it gives me nice even straight 8's. but metronome is a good tool, cant think of anything better for straight 8 practice just starting it off slowly and building it up. but im sure you can do 8's anyway playing for that long. but yeah i just move closer to the bridge and i rest my thumb on the pick up for leverage.

Edinburgh_Bass · #12 02-05-2009, 05:07 AM

One thing I like to practise and use:

Play 8th patterns alternating between your Index and Middle finger

Count 1 (index)
Count 2 (middle)
Count 3 (index)
Count 4 (middle)

Then switch the Middle and Index pattern over - stating on the middle finger for Count 1.

Then switch to your Middle and Third finger, and repeat the same 2 exercises.

Then switch to your Index and Third finger, and repeat the same 2 exercises.

If you were feeling really adventurous, you could add you Pinkie finger into the mix too!

For me, the key to steady 8th notes (or 16th's - or anything actually) is a solid alternate finger technique. It's efficient and sounds consistant when applied properly.

The next level would then be to drop in double hits with a single finger with an "upstroke" / "downstroke" action for emphasis and adding a little variance. The downstroke will sound tonaly different as you can hit the string with your finger nail.

Hope this helps!

JimK · #13 02-05-2009, 05:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edinburgh_Bass

For me, the key to steady 8th notes (or 16th's - or anything actually) is a solid alternate finger technique. It's efficient and sounds consistant when applied properly.

I don't disagree. Although-
I have heard more than a few guys say they will use only one(1) finger for straight/steady 1/8th notes. The same guys will also say the tone is more consistent with the one(1) finger.

nysbob · #14 02-05-2009, 08:21 AM

Playing solid, pumping eighth notes is a fundamental skill that you MUST master.

If speed isn't the issue, you can use one finger on the right hand...otherwise alternation is in order. I think it's helpful to articulate 1/8ths with the left hand as well as the right - lift a tiny bit between EACH NOTE to give a good pumping feel, rather than just holding the note down.

Make every note a jewel and significant.

If you don't play with drummer, by all means work with the metronome.

slybass3000 · #15 02-05-2009, 08:23 AM

One finger: index! That's the sound of even 8ths.

Sly

debassr · #16 02-05-2009, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slybass3000

One finger: index! That's the sound of even 8ths.

Sly

+1 or use a pick.

Jake of Bass · #17 02-05-2009, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimK

I don't disagree. Although-
I have heard more than a few guys say they will use only one(1) finger for straight/steady 1/8th notes. The same guys will also say the tone is more consistent with the one(1) finger.

When recording I always do this, for both reasons you've mentioned. Live though, always alternate so I can dig in and give it a bit more bite.

Brick Top · #18 02-05-2009, 08:47 AM

I like to use songs with steady 8th's to practice alternating my first two RH fingers. Ac/dc and ZZ Top are good for this. Usually using Guitar pro. But I find for the best even tone...using my index only sounds best.

Cheers,
BT

ysand · #19 02-05-2009, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slybass3000

One finger: index! That's the sound of even 8ths.

Sly

Not necessarily.
Proper technique is the answer...
...Which means starting from positioning your hand correctly and then much practice!

Edinburgh_Bass · #20 02-05-2009, 08:59 AM

Still don't agree with any of the single finger technique suggestions - but it is all down to personal taste.

I still firmly believe that SOLID alternative finger technique is far more efficient, less clumsy, smoother and adaptable (same technique for 16th's/32nd's) than plugging away with an index finger.

We've not even mentioned crossing strings...