The Thrash Bass Tip Thread

[bluefrog988]

I'm a relatively new bassist and a bit of a newbie when it comes to theory, but I've been interested in getting into writing and playing thrash metal riffs. So I figured I'd reach out to the talkbass.com community and see what tips you guys might have in composing and playing thrash metal.

By thrash bass I mean styles such as Metallica, Slayer, Anthrax, Exodus, Kreator, Megadeth [[although I must admit I'm not a huge fan]], ect...

[makanudo]

well thrash is mostly about speed.. listening to some of those bands will give you a better idea, just listen and watch closely what both guitar and bass do, most of the time ull be playing what the ugitar is playing..

[Greevus]

I played thrash for about a decade. I used a pick to cut through and tons of volume to compete with the guitars. I tried being different than just using fast root notes, but thrash is pretty much based around speed. Cliff Burton is a cool player, but his best parts to me were the slower melodic ones. He gets buried by the chunk of old Metallica. I loved early Megadeth because the bass was very complimentary and had different lines than just repeating the guitar parts. I love early Maiden too, which is the precursor to thrash really, and Steve Harris plays all sorts of great stuff that cuts through. I suppose my advice would really be to explore your neck more than "holding it down" for thrash. You will be playing those thick parts enough in that style. You can be really effective by playing an arpeggiated lick underneath a chord, or a walking type run instead of all the notes. Many thrash bassists would "cheat" as I called it, and play one note to a flurry of guitar notes. These were mostly finger players, but it can be really effective too. I would refer to maybe the band Death's early stuff for a good example. As for theory, learning the guitar chords you are playing over really helps. You can play a 3rd, 4th, 5th, or octave note to complement the chord and this can really increase the tension, or color the sound more. I would also say just experiment and don't limit yourself to what I say or anyone else. Pay attention to the drums and guitars and lock in with both to give you more ideas. Play what sounds good and feels good to YOU and don't let all the rules limit you. Get very loud gear and crush those guitars!

[makanudo]

^^
This

[bluefrog988]

You can play a 3rd, 4th, 5th, or octave note to complement the chord and this can really increase the tension, or color the sound more.

In my experience playing thrash on the electric guitar I've only seen 5th chords or slight variations of the 5th chord used...would it be theoretically acceptable to use 3rd, and 4th notes behind a power chord? Also I've attempted to alternate between the root and the 5th to back power chords and was not fond of the results.

I guess what I'm getting at is does anyone have suggestions for implementing notes other then just the root in thrash? [[or just metal in general]]

[thrashard340]

Learn some scales as well. Cliff Burton was classically trained and ingrained a lot of theory into his song writing. For Tom Araya of Slayer, it was much more simpler. It almost seems like Slayer couldn't find a bass player and Araya just needed something to do besides sing.

[Audiophage]

Originally Posted by bluefrog988

In my experience playing thrash on the electric guitar I've only seen 5th chords or slight variations of the 5th chord used...would it be theoretically acceptable to use 3rd, and 4th notes behind a power chord? Also I've attempted to alternate between the root and the 5th to back power chords and was not fond of the results.

I guess what I'm getting at is does anyone have suggestions for implementing notes other then just the root in thrash? [[or just metal in general]]

If you know which third to use then yeah, in the right context it works. The 4th might get kind of muddy though. Once again though, in the right context it could work. Harmonically speaking, most thrash doesn't really rely on a lot of chord progressions. You're typically just playing riffs that are maybe based off of one chord or a polychord. Obviously there are exceptions.

[DoomandHeavy]

Play around with tritones, better known as the devil's note. I use them a lot, and I must say they add that sinster edge to a riff.

[bluefrog988]

Play around with tritones, better known as the devil's note. I use them a lot, and I must say they add that sinster edge to a riff.

Could you expand on that a bit. Sounds bad ass, I tried goggling it and I got a bunch of standing bass lessons and what not.

[BeerBeer]

Originally Posted by thrashard340

Learn some scales as well. Cliff Burton was classically trained and ingrained a lot of theory into his song writing. For Tom Araya of Slayer, it was much more simpler. It almost seems like Slayer couldn't find a bass player and Araya just needed something to do besides sing.

Tom Araya started playing bass at the age of eight years dude

imo he is a better player than cliff anyway ^^

[Greevus]

man i love tom araya, but i used to have soundboard and rehearsal tapes of him from just before "hell awaits", and he was very sloppy with his right hand fingers. he switched to picks around 'reign in blood' and he's waaay tighter now. i wouldn't say he was better than cliff. cliff was creative more so than tons of bassists. i love tom's voice though. you don't have to learn scales necessarily. you can take the guitar chord and play around with the various notes in the chord and just see what tone 'colors' you get. if you listen to slayer, kreator, testament, etc, you can hear various harmonies, especially 3rds, creating more tension. maiden will use more 4ths and 5ths and you get a more 'melodic' feel. thrash is power and speed music. you don't want to clutter up the riffs or get in the way in most cases. i think your attack and how cleanly you pick mean a lot in thrash.

[Unrepresented]

Originally Posted by bluefrog988

Could you expand on that a bit. Sounds bad ass, I tried goggling it and I got a bunch of standing bass lessons and what not.

One string higher, one fret higher.

[cassanova]

Originally Posted by bluefrog988

I So I figured I'd reach out to the talkbass.com community and see what tips you guys might have in composing and playing thrash metal..

The theory behind writing music is relative to all styles of music.

Most music is written around what are called familiar chords, (including most thrash) The I-IV-V chords. It's the arrangement of notes and rhythms that give the music its different vibes.

Learn all the major/minor scales. Learn each chords arpeggio, and make sure you learn each notes interval in all the scales. Since you're wanting to get into songwriting, I'd also advise you learn the key signature too. I'd recommend anyone learn that anyway, but all these simple things will help you learn how to compose functional songs. Once you get comfortable writing in the familiar chord progressions experiment and mix things up a bit.

[makanudo]

listen to some testament, greg christian is really good

[thrashard340]

Originally Posted by BeerBeer

Tom Araya started playing bass at the age of eight years dude

imo he is a better player than cliff anyway ^^

Not bashing Slayer because I have just as many Slayer CD's as Metallica. But if Araya is that articulate of a bass player, it doesn't show up on their recordings. I've seen Slayer live 3 times between 1990 & 1995. I've only watched Cliff's stuff on video. Slayer puts on a killer show overall but Araya doesn't impress me as a bass player. I only wish that I could've witnessed Cliff play when he was alive.

Just my opinion though.

[thrashard340]

Originally Posted by makanudo

listen to some testament, greg christian is really good

+1

[Vamposaur]

Originally Posted by BeerBeer

imo he is a better player than cliff anyway ^^

This made me laugh.

[Metal Mitch]

Originally Posted by Greevus

i think your attack and how cleanly you pick mean a lot in thrash.

+1... this is a lot more important than knowing scales and chords. All you need to know is how to play the riff - the rest is execution. It doesn't matter if you're an expert at music theory if you can't execute the picking patterns cleanly at speed.

Learn a lot of covers. Start with 30, then go to 50. Thrash is all about the picking patterns. It's harder to master 20 different picking patterns with speed and control than it is to play 2 or 3 patterns at higher speed ala death and black metal.

[TheFrogPrince]

I really shouldn't say this because the Cliff fanboys will spazz out, but whatever. If you take away his distortion, Cliff really isn't all that tight in his playing. Listen to the Ride and Kill 'em master tapes and you'll see that.

Yes, I realize that sometimes the bass track sounds a little hairy by itself but it really does show how tight you skills are as you can clearly hear everything. Guys like John Moyer from Disturbed and Flea sound really good much of the time, for example.

Arraya doesn't bring anything special to bass playing in general but he is proficient, sounds good and can pick as fast as pretty much any guitarist.

As far as tips go: Learn to play with a pick like it's a natural extension of your hand. Not everyone is Alex Webster etc. It helps you cut through and hear yourself with ultra-loud, distorted guitars. Work with a metronome until you can put it at like 40bpm, shut the metronome off for a couple minutes. When you turn it on again, you should still be in time.

If you can do that with a peice of plastic in your hands, you will easily be able to do it with your digits.

[jmiller]

you want to be a "thrash/metal" bassist? my advice: quit playing bass......