Tone is in the fingers - how?

[Lichtaffen]

So by now we've all heard the "tone is in the fingers of the player" statement here on TB. Most of us believe this to be true. Most GAS can be avoided by believing in this. We've all heard the story about how an interviewer asked Bernard Edwards what kind of strings he used to achieve his unique tone, to which he replied "what kind of strings come on a Musicman bass?"

What I'd like to do is open a discussion on various techniques you believe helped develop and enhance your personal "tone".

[JTE]

Biggest one is WHERE on the string you hit them. There's a huge variaition one can extract just by moving from the bridge saddles up to the last fret.

Then there's how hard you hit the strings.

And then there's what part of the finger you use, and how you let the string release from the finger tip.

And we haven't even talked about the fretting hand!

Plus, a lot of "the tone is in the fingers" is that the tone is in the ears. I have a range of sound in my head and I'll (probably subconsiously) tweak the amp settings, alter my physcial approach, etc. to get as close to that sound as I can.

John

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Lichtaffen

So by now we've all heard the "tone is in the fingers of the player" statement here on TB. Most of us believe this to be true. Most GAS can be avoided by believing in this. We've all heard the story about how an interviewer asked Bernard Edwards what kind of strings he used to achieve his unique tone, to which he replied "what kind of strings come on a Musicman bass?"

What I'd like to do is open a discussion on various techniques you believe helped develop and enhance your personal "tone".

This topic is often discussed, although it is probably hard to do a search on it, since it pops up in the middle of a lot of threads.

Each player (at least those that can play at a 'professional' level) has his/her own sound. This becomes very clear at GTG's, and much is due to how much 'meat of the finger' is used in a given person's technique, the absolute strength of the right hand, the clean-ness of the left hand, and where the player's right hand gravites (i.e., closer to the bridge or the neck).

However, a given player will also sound quite different through different rigs, different instruments, etc. You can't ignore any of this stuff, IMO, and matching your playing style and volume needs with an appropriate rig can REALLY make a difference.

[Ron Plichta]

In addition to attack, position, etc., different players have different ways of "phrasing" which add to their style.

[Dbassmon]

All the points made previously are right on...
a little more on phrasing because this is important... music is a language and the bigger your vocabulary, the better you will be able to express yourself...
how long the notes are held (staccato or legato), time feel, ghosted notes and musical ornaments such as vibrato, trills, pull offs or hammer ons. These elements form the basis for the individual interpretation of the musical line and hence create a unique expression of the music..."your sound, your touch" These elements are created with both hands.
The more command one has over this vocabulary of articulations and the greater ones ability to summon them instantaneously, the more one can create a connection between ones soul and the instrument. The term touch is literal and abstract, we touch the string with our fingers, we touch the music with our souls.

[DeluxeRed]

Good gear makes it easier to get a tone your are seeking, and some gear falls below the threshold of getting a usable sound. That said...

When I hear or say "in the hands", I'm thinking "in the head". When I am trying to get to another tone, or to get "my" tone out of a particular rig, I find it is a matter of concentration. Listen to the sound, and will it to change. Then I find my hands start to make the changes to get to what I want to hear, using everything mentioned above: my right drifts toward or away from the bridge, my left hand gets more or less precise on fretting or pressure. Sometimes I don't know what to change, so I start playing and listening, and find the range of tone that rig can give me, and then start working towards where I want to go. I think "too thumpy" and my attack gets sharper. I think "too jangly" and my fretting gets more precise. I think "smoother", and sometimes I start playing with my thumb.

So I think it's a matter of getting familiar with the range YOU can produce, and then apply that to your current rig/circumstance. Remember, most of your playing comes from part of your brain not directly connected to your conscious stream of thought, so you have to dig for it a bit and trust it a lot.

[THand]

To me hearing an answer that is essentially in your head, begs the question, "where did the sound in your head come from?"

I imagine many simple 4 stringers like myself are trying to emulate players/sounds we have heard from others and we want to reproduce them or slightly flavor them only a little...but,

what about the more adventurous(creative, talented, etc) of you? the guys/gals playing ERB's or folks who developed new or unusual techniques? To the people who try to(or do) break new ground, what is your muse? I don't think it could really be money or fame because that type of talent is rarely appreciated outside of circles like TB, IMO.

[Lichtaffen]

Back when I was a guitard I played in a band with a very unique and skilled bass player. He used to play a Pedulla with the highest action I've seen and I'm pretty sure he used very heavy strings. He was so solid when he played, I can't describe it. He had extremely strong hands and could play the most interesting phrases. His biggest inspiration was John Taylor of Duran Duran. Abstractly speaking, he had a certain confidence in his hands that I can't explain. He was so precise and articulated so well. He played a very underpowered amp and a small Bag End 15, but he sounded commanding when he played. He had a definite tone to his playing and I know for a fact that when I switched to bass a few years ago, his playing was a subconscious inspiration even though I hadn't heard him play in over 10 years. This is what I'm talking about when I talk about tone.

I'm not sure if this makes the question any clearer.

[fdeck]

Here's what I suggest. Ditch the amp for a while, and practice without it, listening carefully to the acoustic tone that your bass produces. Explore how much control you have over your tone with plucking, muting, phrasing, anything and everything that affects your tone. Have fun with it.

I only suggest doing this without an amp because, if you are constantly changing your amp settings, it will be harder to figure out what's going on just between you and your bass. Of course your technique will improve too, simply because you are practicing.

I think this exercise will give you more tonal flexibility in general, even after you plug the amp back in. And whatever new tones you develop might be enough to get over the GAS for a while.

I am one of those "tone is in my hands" guys, and for me it just means that I am in fact satisfied with a fairly generic tone that I use for most of my playing situations. But this can either work or not, depending on what genres you are into, and your personal tastes of course. It's certainly not the only way to proceed.

[two fingers]

Originally Posted by JTE

Biggest one is WHERE on the string you hit them. There's a huge variaition one can extract just by moving from the bridge saddles up to the last fret.

Then there's how hard you hit the strings.

And then there's what part of the finger you use, and how you let the string release from the finger tip.

I agree with all of this. That's why I move my plucking hand back and forth from the neck end to the bridge end for various tones. I pluck pretty hard with the very tip of my fingers and release like a bow string. That's what works for me.

[bobm2112]

Steve Harris is a perfect example of tone is in your hands. Listen to how precise and clean his gallop is on The Trooper and how hard and percussive it is on Power Slave. he was going for two distinct tones using the same bass with the same obvious hands

Geddy Lee has used quite a few basses over the years but every one still sounds like Geddy Lee

Me personally, I went the first few years of my life playing without an amp. I had to "spank" the strings real hard to hear myself. Now years later my sound has a bright sound because of the way I hit the strings

[tranceFusion]

one thing about playing without an amp.. just make sure you don't get in a habit of playing harder than necessary so you can hear it..

[MarkTAW]

I had an upright bass for a while. I brought someone over my house - a very good bass player, much better than me. When he played the URB a completely different tone came out of it than when I played it. He wasn't used to an upright & his tone was much thinner than mine, less self assured, though every bit as loud.

Electric bass removes some of the "tone is in your hands" factor that you can get from a good acoustic, especially with frets - the tone you get from your left hand is also reduced.

I've had basses that sounded great in the store but didn't sit in the mix in the studio - though I'm the only one that noticed. I've had basses that sounded amazing in the mix, but won't be winning any tone awards. By now I have a decent sense of what's a good bass & what will work live & what will work on recording.

I met a bass player who had played a Sadowsky trough an Acoustic Image through some sort of high end 4x10 (maybe a berg, I don't remember). He told me "the instrument doesn't matter, the tone is all in your fingers" to which I replied "then why do you play $4,000 Sadowsky through a $1200 head through an $1000 cabinet?" He had no answer to that.

Bass is a tremendous part of the tone, without the bass there is no tone. Fingers play a role, but an ever diminishing one as we go from upright to electric to fretted to active electronics and so forth.

[MarkTAW]

Originally Posted by tranceFusion

one thing about playing without an amp.. just make sure you don't get in a habit of playing harder than necessary so you can hear it..

Harder than necessary is part of my tone.

[wittynamehere]

Recently, it seems like the harder I work on getting the tone I want, or even a tone I like, out of my fingers, the worse my tone gets I don't know if it's because I am overanalyzing, or listening harder or what but it seems like I can't get rid of this "thup thup thup" noise from my plucking fingers. Maybe I just need to raise my action some and dig in like it was a bowl of ice cream.

[mike costelow]

Originally Posted by Dbassmon

All the points made previously are right on...
a little more on phrasing because this is important... music is a language and the bigger your vocabulary, the better you will be able to express yourself...
how long the notes are held (staccato or legato), time feel, ghosted notes and musical ornaments such as vibrato, trills, pull offs or hammer ons. These elements form the basis for the individual interpretation of the musical line and hence create a unique expression of the music..."your sound, your touch" These elements are created with both hands.
The more command one has over this vocabulary of articulations and the greater ones ability to summon them instantaneously, the more one can create a connection between ones soul and the instrument. The term touch is literal and abstract, we touch the string with our fingers, we touch the music with our souls.

+1 I have known a few players in my time that just defied logic! I know of 2 guitar players and 1 bass player who play thru what would be considerd by most,subpar gear and just make it sing.one plays thru a 20 watt solid state peavey,the other thru a mid 80s solid state g.k 20 or 30 watt, these players know how to communicate with their instruments and sound fantastic whatever they are playing thru!I have seen both, players who have great gear and great technical ability and players who play from the soul,know how to express it through their instrument and can plug into any playable guitar and amp and just blow your mind. get on youtube and checkout some of the street musicians.

[seanm]

Originally Posted by tranceFusion

one thing about playing without an amp.. just make sure you don't get in a habit of playing harder than necessary so you can hear it..

I go half way and use a mixer (set flat) and headphones. I never practice with the amp unless I get new gear

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by THand

To me hearing an answer that is essentially in your head, begs the question, "where did the sound in your head come from?"

I imagine many simple 4 stringers like myself are trying to emulate players/sounds we have heard from others and we want to reproduce them or slightly flavor them only a little...but,

what about the more adventurous(creative, talented, etc) of you? the guys/gals playing ERB's or folks who developed new or unusual techniques? To the people who try to(or do) break new ground, what is your muse? I don't think it could really be money or fame because that type of talent is rarely appreciated outside of circles like TB, IMO.

More likely than not, not limiting yourself to thinking about bass in the traditional sense. There are people who are quick to tell you what you can't do and then there are people who don't have that baggage.

Listening to other instruments or even vocals helps.

[zagralin_arf]

One thing to look at in addition to how hard someone plucks and where he plucks is HOW he plucks. You watch videos of Jaco and he had such a nimble tip of the finger pluck, Billy Sheehan actually pulls through the string, Steve Harris's fingers come down on his strings like little Hammers of Thor...

Then you gotta think about the callus buildup on the part of the finger they use, how many fingers they use with different calluses and sounds...

It all adds up to the unique sound of every player.

[Alvaro Martín Gómez A.]

Originally Posted by bobm2112

Steve Harris is a perfect example of tone is in your hands. Listen to how precise and clean his gallop is on The Trooper

With all the due respect since I'm a big Iron Maiden/Steve Harris fan (and IMHO, YMMV, etc...), I think his galloping on the original recording of The Trooper is neither precise nor clean. IMO, this is by far an example of how a great band with a great producer (even more important in some cases, I think) can blend into a tight unit. The Trooper's isolated bass master track is the basis for my statement:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSYuse9o8KI&fmt=22 (At least, that's totally incongruent with my idea of "precise" and "clean" if we are talking about a rhythmic pattern of one eighth followed by two sixteenths notes)

And, if you are curious, here are the rest of the master tracks for "The Trooper":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmIQ-j3YrrY&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4Qb3vTRtYI&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8L27BRDNu3M&fmt=18

Again, I truly admire Mr. Steve Harris' accomplishments, both as a bassist and bandleader/composer, so I'm in no way trying to bash him. UP THE IRONS!

(It's not my intention to derail the thread. Just wanted to point this out)