Why do I even bother?

[groove100]

can you guys clarify what SA and raking means.

Im thinking of the Abe Laboriel technique when i hear raking, is it the same thing?

[Howard K]

Strict Alternation, index-middle-index-middle, etc

Raking, raking either finger down the strings, like playing rest strokes basically, so if you play a major arpeggio from the 5th down to root you play just two finger strokes, rather than three. two strokes on the top string to play the 5th and 3rd, then you 'rake' the finger through the string to play the root on the string below.

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Howard K

How can you honestly say that 'a technique' is bad? Tools for the tool box surely? We are talking about making music here aren't we? If people didnt do things differently it'd be pretty damned boring, would it not?

As for 'not wanting to brag' you did a pretty good job!

You starting this thread is a joke right?

A technique is bad if the result is your playing is the poorer for it. Hey, if you think you can rake and play as well as anyone out there, then go for it. But from what I've seen, the people who can play well raking when they should be SA'ing are few and far between.

As for the bragging, everyone who brags about themselves adds in "not wanting to brag" as a way of trying not to make themselves look like a blowhard, which I may very well be. But as the old saying goes, it ain't bragging if you can back it up. I don't ever brag about myself as being the greatest bassist who ever lived, but I do brag about myself as knowing my stuff, and I can back it up in spades.

And no, this thread wasn't started as a joke. It was started because of all the nimrods who, when trying to discuss something seriously, chime in with the most inane crap they can think of, or the people who ask for advice, get the advice, then reject it because it's too much like work. Well if you didn't want to know the answer, why did you ask? However, I will agree that it's kind of turned into a joke now, and a darn funny one at that, and the sillier it gets, the more I enjoy it. If that makes me a bad person, then I'm a bad person.

[Howard K]

Actually, and for the record, I try to use SA as much as possible. I find it yields better results for me once I put in the effort to actually learn something properly. However, dissmissing raking as a 'bad technique' just seems pointless and bloody minded to me. It's a tool, it has a different sound to SA, surely it's just as valid on that basis?

As for the bragging, everyone who brags about themselves adds in "not wanting to brag" as a way of trying not to make themselves look like a blowhard, which I may very well be. But as the old saying goes, it ain't bragging if you can back it up. I don't ever brag about myself as being the greatest bassist who ever lived, but I do brag about myself as knowing my stuff, and I can back it up in spades.

Whether you can back it up or not, it's still crass. Why bother? Do you need to back up your point of view with your achievements? I just dont think it's neccessary, or helps in any way.

..and that old saying is crap, it's still bragging whether you can back it up or not.

If I learn something from someone, on TB or otherwise, the fact that they happen to play with 'someone great' doesnt make the lesson any more valid.
Perhaps I'll sit up and listen a bit closer if I know someone is very experienced, but equally I'll turn right off if they harp on at me about how great they are. Put it this way, of the all fantastic musicians I've had the fortune to meet, most of which have been in a learning capacity, none have ever boasted about any aspect of their playing.

TB is great because of the amazing pros that use it and their, very often, invaliable advice, but I'd rather go without any advice if it comes wrapped up in a whole load of ego. I'm definitely NOT saying that's you btw, I'm just saying

[Cambass]

I've learnt from this thread that some people need to get over themselves.

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

However, Brad, I do have to apologize to you. You have shown in the past that you do have a good sense of humor, and I shouldn't have said you didn't.

No problem, Jimmy. Everyone has buttons (including me) and apparently I inadvertently pushed one.

On the SA vs. raking, I do both indiscriminately, which ever one gets me from point A to B with the desired results. Sometimes I rake descending, sometimes I don't. It's all about the desired results and how I feel I can get them. Bottom line, IMO it's about touch. I'm all about that.


And I've been playing over 30 years so I must really be right
Score 15 points for me.



But I don't do this for a living so how serious could I be about my instrument? Deduct 4 points.


This is hard. No it isn't.


On the touch tip, I did a rehearsal last week, took a little rig and a bass. During the rehearsal the drummer and keyboardist asked how I was getting my bass to sound like a fretless.

"That's the way I'm playing it". Might've sounded like a smartassed answer so I expanded on it.

Trust me , I understand the frustration you're talking about but I don't let it get me down. Occassionally I'll offer advice when people are asking which compressor they need to buy to even up their sound when they go back and forth between slap and fingerstyle. Invariably someone will get upset when I suggest that none is needed, that they can control it with their hands, with practice. That then invariably turns into me making a blanket condemnation of compressions (it isn't), then when they find out that I don't use effects either, a blanket condemnation of any device that comes between the bass and the amp (it isn't). People read what they want to read and see what they want to see sometimes. Oh well, just trying to help.

Just remember, the next time you're trying to help, if it's met with resistance or whatever, just shrug it off and remember, you tried... and that's all you can do. The cool thing is that I get pms all the time from folks who didn't balk in those threads, tried what I mentioned and were pleased with the results.


Sometimes raking is just an easier way to descend and if you really work on it, sonically it's the same... at least for me. Along with really getting your muting together, if it works, it works. Now someone may disagree with that for THEMSELVES, which of course is cool. For ME, this is what works.

Back on the chicks thing... if picking them up really was an issue, I think it's a heck of a lot easier to just get a good enough job so you can buy or lease an extremely nice car, nice enough that it might somehow overcome whatever physical or emotional defects one has. I've seen a lot of older Ferraris on eBay for well under $50k.

[Bruce Lindfield]

There was an interview with Marcus Miller in the last issue of UK Bass Guitar magazine that is relevant to this debate, talking about how there are two types of people, those who see music as a sport and those who se it as saying something - here's the relevant part :

"...it's really about using the technique to say something and a lot of guys never really make it up to that level. Everything they do, you can feel it's about the physicality of playing an instrument.

If you were a carpenter, you could bring in your toolbox and empty it out and say :"Look at my tools man,nice huh??"

You might think that's cool, but you would see the other guy say "Look at the house I built" and you don't even care about his tools!!

You might enjoy seeing him build the house up, but there has to be a house at the end."

[Bryan R. Tyler]

Great post, Bruce!

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Cambass

I've learnt from this thread that some people need to get over themselves.

Maybe, but I know one thing...I'll never get over you!