Wireless XDS series vs. Relay G30

[gillento]

Hi Line6 people,

How do the new Relay series compare to the XDS series ?

Are they the same thing packaged for the non-US market or do they have other specs/features?

- Will the G30 have a variable output?

- What about battery life? I owned both the XDS95 and XDSPlus and neither of these kept going for mor than 3 hours (as opposed to the advertised 5-6 hours)
This was kind of a deal breaker for me, as my band usually plays 4 hour sets.

- Will there be more models to come than the actual G30?

[richrenken]

Originally Posted by gillento

Hi Line6 people,

How do the new Relay series compare to the XDS series ?

Are they the same thing packaged for the non-US market or do they have other specs/features?

- Will the G30 have a variable output?

- What about battery life? I owned both the XDS95 and XDSPlus and neither of these kept going for mor than 3 hours (as opposed to the advertised 5-6 hours)
This was kind of a deal breaker for me, as my band usually plays 4 hour sets.

- Will there be more models to come than the actual G30?

I think Aaron could answer better than me. I cover amps and effects and the future of Variax.

I do know the Relay will work all over the world whereas the X2 was for the US market only because of frequency restrictions.

[Bassorama57]

Found some information from the Line 6 UK site - appears to be a stomp box unit? (Which is good, that's what I was looking for)

Not to be cheating, but: http://uk.line6.com/relayg30/specs.html from your UK sight has good information.

[Bassorama57]

As an update, I put down cash at AMS in advance of availability, but I'm hearing from them now it won't be available in the US.

[Fergie Fulton]

Hi Rich and Aaron, great product in the Relay G30.
Took delivery of one the other week and what a great system this is.

Point 1/ The use of a 1/4" jack to jack rather than the usual moulded 1/8" lock in has been a long time coming. I for one have allways found these things a problem with any system that uses them. To that end a new lead or having it hard wired in has been a way of solving the problem. On the relay the 1/4" jack to jack now means this is never going to be a problem as it can be replaced with a cable off the shelf.

2/ The use of the cheaper and better 2xAA batteries is so much better than the single 9 volt. The battery warning lights are great and simple to see so no problems there with dead battery during a gig.

3/ The transmitter is a great size and shape to be used on strap or clip on the belt/back pocket. Its information on battery life ( a three step colour guide) is simple, as is the signal information. The choice of 6 channels to choose from is a great option.

4/ The reciever is a great size for floor use or to put on or behind the amp. Along with the same info on battery and signal power as the transmitter as on the reciever there should be no excuse not to see a problem. The cable tone switch is great and can really help the tone. As i some times use different length cables depending on whether i sit it on the amp or use it stage front, this really does help with the tone, i don't know how but it does LOL.

5/ As for the over all use, great. drop out is gone and i mean gone for me, and the noise between guitars (i have guitars the are singe coil, humbucker and active) is noiseless, even standing next to the amp and unit. Previously i had an issue till i moved away from the rig, this unit not a problem.

All in all a great piece of gear and well done with it i look forward to having in my rig with the HD400.

Downside, feels a bit light and fragile in plastic, moulded rubber would be better and rugged. Rather than a big flat cardboard box, a good case to protect the transmitter and reciever would be better at the point of shipping as they are the most important part to protect. Guitar case size would be cool, the jack lead and power supply don't need that much protection so don't really figure as the can be replaced of the shelf. On that issue if they sits in a fittings case or bag the could be damaged, if they have a sturdy case problem solved, maybe an option or extra to consider?
I'll let you know how it survives the road LOL

But if that's all i have to moan about, then i'm being picky, as it will be in my amp flight case, but not all have an amp flightcase.

Great product and well thought out for practability and use...well done.

Below in the link is what happens when a tranceiver does not work. I used a cable for this gig, stood on it and unhooked my bass at about 2.05 and then had to recover, then mess about with the jack socket on the bass as it got damaged by the lead being stood on when the strap came off...not impressed first song in LOL

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dd3bcsyc4U8

[Colonel_Claypoo]

great review, thanks.
is there any noticeable latency?

[Fergie Fulton]

Originally Posted by Colonel_Claypoo

great review, thanks.
is there any noticeable latency?

None at all within my ranges so far. I have some more festivals to do soon, so i will find out its exact range before latency kicks in, but i expect the usual "line of sight issues" will always be there for any system.
Its the systems ability to keep the tones of the bass that impressed me, as it is not a "bass" but a guitar system. The B on the 5 string sounds as good as a cable, with its active pick-ups i thought that one would be the problem, but no, as good as the other basses. It is the Precisions that benifit most, they get a noticable boost in signal using the "cable tone switch" in the form of tone and...well i would not say gain but it does give the Precision a nice edge.
I use the HD400 amp and like a bit of drive in my sound, since i introduced the Relay G30 i have backed the drive on the amp back a notch, but that is mainly with the Ibanez which has a humbucker.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OrruZs_7cc

(sorry Rich, but getting the HD400/750 is not widley available in Europe to sound companies, unless i take mine i use an Aguilar DB750 which is second amp on my gear rider.)

[Colonel_Claypoo]

good to hear that it even does the low B well.

what i'm interested in is latency. i know, will be a little, maybe unnoticeable but measureable. is this also true for UHF and VHF systems? and how about cable? is there a lataency at all?
always wanted to know that.

thanks

[Fergie Fulton]

Originally Posted by Colonel_Claypoo

good to hear that it even does the low B well.

what i'm interested in is latency. i know, will be a little, maybe unnoticeable but measureable. is this also true for UHF and VHF systems? and how about cable? is there a lataency at all?
always wanted to know that.

thanks

I have found no measurable latency in the Relay G30. A lot of the lines i play are walking and figure based, rather than root pounding. I have found no problems with timing, as has anyone in the bands i play in, my lines are clear, audable, and latency free.

As for the cables the one you get supplied with, i changed to a cable made by my amp tech.
Reason for that, i trust no moulded cables in my rig or set-up. Because the Relay G30 is 1/4" jack to jack you can have the cable of your choice, to the quality you want and trust.
Don't get me wrong here, what i want is the units to work and be reliable, hence the previous point on a case for the units. If the units get damaged or fail i have to send them off, if a cable gets damaged i replace it...then and there.
The cables are my responsibility not Line 6 so to me that is a no brainer.

I have use both UHF and VHF systems and had trouble free use.
The problems arrives from venues and stage conditions, that is a fact of life for any wireless system. Some handle the problems better than others.
The system that failed me at Moulin Blues in the clip that i used a cable and un-hooked my bass was a UHF. There was dead spots on the stages so i could not use it, and found the problem at other festival venues in Europe so elected to use a cable for all. Obviously i have to wait to compare the results when i play festivals again in Europe, but to date no problems.
I have noticed a difference as have some great sound engineers that know my set-up. Maybe its just my rig and bass LOL

[Line6Aaron]

Originally Posted by Colonel_Claypoo

good to hear that it even does the low B well.

what i'm interested in is latency. i know, will be a little, maybe unnoticeable but measureable. is this also true for UHF and VHF systems? and how about cable? is there a lataency at all?
always wanted to know that.

thanks

For the Relay G30, the latency is very low: a shade under 4ms...one way to articulate what 4ms would "sound like" is to simply add 2 feet of distance from your amp playing with a cable. So playing a G30 standing 3 feet in front of your amp "feels like" playing your amp with a cable at 5 feet. Except you look cooler

UHF/VHF systems and cables don't have latency...well, technically they do but it's speed of light so you can consider it negligible.

Our research has indicated that the most highly trained ears can only start to detect latency at 5-6 ms and most musicians don't notice latency until it reaches 10ms.

Hope this helps, and let us know how you like the product if you get to try it!

[Colonel_Claypoo]

thanks so much aron that practically sold me. i will order a G30 and see how free i will feel

[gillento]

Originally Posted by Line6Aaron

For the Relay G30, the latency is very low: a shade under 4ms...one way to articulate what 4ms would "sound like" is to simply add 2 feet of distance from your amp playing with a cable. So playing a G30 standing 3 feet in front of your amp "feels like" playing your amp with a cable at 5 feet. Except you look cooler

UHF/VHF systems and cables don't have latency...well, technically they do but it's speed of light so you can consider it negligible.

Our research has indicated that the most highly trained ears can only start to detect latency at 5-6 ms and most musicians don't notice latency until it reaches 10ms.

Hope this helps, and let us know how you like the product if you get to try it!

Any precise specs regarding battery life?
Is it noticeably longer than the XDS? I play 4 hour gigs and the XDS didn't last that long

[Fergie Fulton]

Originally Posted by gillento

Any precise specs regarding battery life?
Is it noticeably longer than the XDS? I play 4 hour gigs and the XDS didn't last that long

Try some battery info,

http://www.batterysavers.com/Compare-Batteries.html

[Line6Aaron]

Originally Posted by gillento

Any precise specs regarding battery life?
Is it noticeably longer than the XDS? I play 4 hour gigs and the XDS didn't last that long

The battery life spec on Relay G30 is approximately 8 hours, so we should have your 4 hour gig covered easily.

Cheers,
Aaron

[Line6Aaron]

Originally Posted by Fergie Fulton

Downside, feels a bit light and fragile in plastic, moulded rubber would be better and rugged. Rather than a big flat cardboard box, a good case to protect the transmitter and reciever would be better at the point of shipping as they are the most important part to protect. Guitar case size would be cool, the jack lead and power supply don't need that much protection so don't really figure as the can be replaced of the shelf. On that issue if they sits in a fittings case or bag the could be damaged, if they have a sturdy case problem solved, maybe an option or extra to consider?

I understand how the casing of Relay G30 is lightweight and I agree that it can feel like plastic, but G30 is actually made of polycarbonate, a thermoplastic that is stronger than cast aluminum.

An advantage of using this material, besides its strength, is that all of the antennae (such a funny word) are contained inside so there’s nothing to break off. If the box were metal you would need to have external antennae...

[Fergie Fulton]

Originally Posted by Line6Aaron

I understand how the casing of Relay G30 is lightweight and I agree that it can feel like plastic, but G30 is actually made of polycarbonate, a thermoplastic that is stronger than cast aluminum.

An advantage of using this material, besides its strength, is that all of the antennae (such a funny word) are contained inside so there’s nothing to break off. If the box were metal you would need to have external antennae...

LOL thanks Rich, hi-tech in the casing....i should have knowing. Most of the damage i have ever encountered comes from the reciever. It gets dropped and knocked just from the fact it gets handled more often and is so portable. Whether on a strap, belt, or hooked on a back pocket it is in the fireing line for potential damage LOL The main damage if it is on the transmitter is the ariel/ariels, so two problems solved there.

So far quite a few fellow musicians have shown an interest in it, one in particular a harmonica player, so i will keep you informed of its applications if i hear of them.

[gillento]

Originally Posted by Line6Aaron

The battery life spec on Relay G30 is approximately 8 hours, so we should have your 4 hour gig covered easily.

Cheers,
Aaron

Nice Thanks a lot!

[richrenken]

Originally Posted by Fergie Fulton

LOL thanks Rich, hi-tech in the casing....i should have knowing. Most of the damage i have ever encountered comes from the reciever. It gets dropped and knocked just from the fact it gets handled more often and is so portable. Whether on a strap, belt, or hooked on a back pocket it is in the fireing line for potential damage LOL The main damage if it is on the transmitter is the ariel/ariels, so two problems solved there.

So far quite a few fellow musicians have shown an interest in it, one in particular a harmonica player, so i will keep you informed of its applications if i hear of them.

LOL, you can call him Aaron. He is jumping in now, so everyone welcome Aaron.

Great posts btw, Aaron.

[Bassorama57]

When will this item be available in the US?

[bebass]

Originally Posted by Line6Aaron

The battery life spec on Relay G30 is approximately 8 hours, so we should have your 4 hour gig covered easily.

Cheers,
Aaron

So I am gonna ask also, "Is this going to be available in the USA? If so, when?"