[ask]gospel bass

[jb_kid]

Hi everyone, i'm from indonesia and i'm very attracted with gospel song, with their unique bass line and riff... could anybody tell me the basic to create that kind of bass line and how to get such a groovy play like that... thanks..

[onlyclave]

Originally Posted by jb_kid

Hi everyone, i'm from indonesia and i'm very attracted with gospel song, with their unique bass line and riff... could anybody tell me the basic to create that kind of bass line and how to get such a groovy play like that... thanks..

I second that question. What are the chord progressions and voicings that are in the gospel tradition that give it that specific sound?

[fountain boy]

This guy here explains it a little.

http://live.bassplayer.com/Artist.as...&video=gouche4

[DWBass]

Please check out www.learngospelmusic.com

[fountain boy]

Has any of this info been informative?

I found it interesting that many have the same questions about gospel bassist's, then to hear one of their own at the helm saying that it's something that really cannot be taught theoritically, but is morseso a lifestyle, something that you just have to live & breath.

How do you'll feel about this?

I'm curious, please indulge me.

[Eublet]

I think all music is like that. Since it's a language, you have to learn by listening and trying to speak it. I think anyone can learn to do some simple gospel riffs, but to make it all fit in the context of the venue is something entirely different. What I've seen in gospel are bass players who are way too busy trying to make it interesting, or they are too repetitive and it loses life. Many of the great gospel players are a little sloppy, but not so much that it makes it sound bad. In fact, it adds to the feel and experience. It's just hard to explain, but if you aren't listening and trying it'll never come.

As with any music form that uses more than 3 chords though, a decent understanding of theory goes a long way. Otherwise, you better have ears the size of an elephant if you want to hang.

[T-MOST]

Originally Posted by fountain boy

Has any of this info been informative?

I found it interesting that many have the same questions about gospel bassist's, then to hear one of their own at the helm saying that it's something that really cannot be taught theoritically, but is morseso a lifestyle, something that you just have to live & breath.

How do you'll feel about this?

I'm curious, please indulge me.

As a gospel bassist I feel it's true. Most of what you do comes directly from inspiration. The inspiration comes from the holy spirit and you can't teach that. Sure I can show you a few basic lines but they will sound like "basic" lines. Also the more you listen to this music hopefully the more you start to hear the possibilities of where the bass can go. You have to flip and change them up as "you" feel it.

Many of the great gospel players are a little sloppy,

I can't even begin to agree with that.

[bottomzone]

Originally Posted by T-MOST

As a gospel bassist I feel it's true. Most of what you do comes directly from inspiration. The inspiration comes from the holy spirit and you can't teach that. Sure I can show you a few basic lines but they will sound like "basic" lines. Also the more you listen to this music hopefully the more you start to hear the possibilities of where the bass can go. You have to flip and change them up as "you" feel it.

Many of the great gospel players are a little sloppy,

I can't even begin to agree with that.

+1000000!!!!!!! Listening to as much gospel and other genre's of music with a strong groove element as you can is essential! As far as great gospel bass players being sloppy-????????? Two of the most amazing bassists of any genre are Darrell Freeman and Simeon Baker. These cats have chops and technique for days and groove like crazy!!!!!!!!! Check out Simeon Baker in these clips:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lU19ZQSstBE (Poor audio/video quality, but he's still killing it!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnhMevm_dDI

Here is Darrell Freeman:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TO2p7RE0v4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqqwLIyQO5U


If these brothers are sloppy, I WANT TO BE REAL SLOPPY!!!!!!!!!!!

A Groove is a Terrible Thing to Waste!

[Eublet]

I didn't say ALL the gospel players are sloppy, but many of them are. So name the top guys all you want. Most guys at the top in any genre aren't sloppy. If you have been down in the trenches around them and listening to them, then you know what I mean. Go to your average urban church on a Sunday morning, and chances are the playing is fairly sloppy but is still groovin' very hard. Deep pockets doesn't mean you have to play clean.

[Dr_Funkdamental]

Originally Posted by Eublet

I didn't say ALL the gospel players are sloppy, but many of them are. So name the top guys all you want

Noooooo, you said

Originally Posted by Eublet

Many of the great gospel players are a little sloppy

Which is why he put up TOP guys. I would think "great" means top of the line, unless your adjectives are of lower standard than most.

Originally Posted by Eublet

Most guys at the top in any genre aren't sloppy.

Thats quite hypocritical to your previous statement dont you think?

Originally Posted by Eublet

If you have been down in the trenches around them and listening to them, then you know what I mean. Go to your average urban church on a Sunday morning, and chances are the playing is fairly sloppy but is still groovin' very hard. Deep pockets doesn't mean you have to play clean.

First off, you have GOSPEL players responding. I for one have been a gospel player for more than 15 yrs and your statement is not a fair assessment. You cant make a horrible generalization about the BEST players, then punk out. What are you basing your statements on? Do you visit alot of churches or are you judging off Youtube? And tell me, whats an average urban church?? If YOU have been "down in the trenches" (that statement makes me laugh everytime I read it) you'd realize that there are different demoniminations which require different types of play. Also, you never know if the bassist there has been playing 2 months or 20 yrs. Most of the "great" gospel bassists you arent going to find at your "average urban church" anyway. If you gonna say something stand by it. You cant change what you said when its on a PUBLIC FORUM. Its just unfortunate that your opinion/bad generalizations got called out.

Originally Posted by bottomzone

Two of the most amazing bassists of any genre are Darrell Freeman and Simeon Baker

And I can easily name 5 more that will go with that. But those wont count LOLOL. However, you MIGHT run up on a young cat like this one somewhere "in the trenches" of your "average urban church". LOL

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9dwi52Ra0s

[lmfreeman9]

Originally Posted by Eublet

I think all music is like that. Since it's a language, you have to learn by listening and trying to speak it. I think anyone can learn to do some simple gospel riffs, but to make it all fit in the context of the venue is something entirely different. What I've seen in gospel are bass players who are way too busy trying to make it interesting, or they are too repetitive and it loses life. Many of the great gospel players are a little sloppy, but not so much that it makes it sound bad. In fact, it adds to the feel and experience. It's just hard to explain, but if you aren't listening and trying it'll never come.

As with any music form that uses more than 3 chords though, a decent understanding of theory goes a long way. Otherwise, you better have ears the size of an elephant if you want to hang.

They may be sloppy in Alabama but I attend church in both Miami and Chicago where both bass players are top pros. In big cities there is way too much talent to allow for sloppiness at a paying gig.

[Eublet]

I've been in the trenches, meaning REAL, average American churches were gospel exists, for over 36 years, playing bass guitar in them for 21 of those. I've seen churches around the country, but specifically in the Southeast, Alabama, Mississippi, Florida, Georgia, Louisiana, etc. Playing quality hasn't varied a bit in my travels. Some is great, some is average regardless of north south, so spare me the Alabama comments. Most of the GREAT gospel players I would name no one would know. I reject the big name mentality being required for a player to be great. I've been inspired by a lot of players that don't have record deals, don't have any formal education, are mostly self taught, and who can play the fool out of a bass guitar. And yes, they are often a bit sloppy.

Just because YOUR experience is different, don't be so arrogant as to call me out on mine. I haven't any time for it.

[PocketGroove82]

I like gospel bass players!
I don't like Eublet.

[Eublet]

Originally Posted by PocketGroove82

I like gospel bass players!
I don't like Eublet.

You don't know me from Adam, but say that if you want. I just get bothered when people here want to call someone out over everything, as if they know their experiences, background, or whatever.

As for top paying gigs, that's not where gospel came from. Gospel grew out of the black churches in urban and even remote areas. That is what I call the trenches. It's the local guys who aren't known, yet they were responsible for giving the genre it's life and keeping it afloat. Most of the top big-name gospel players had their start in such places, and can probably tell you a lot about what I'm talking about. It's not about mega churches with paid musicians. It's about the volunteer guys around the country doing it for love of God and music. If some people here don't know what I'm talking about, then that's fine. No biggie. I grew up in and around it, so it bothers me when people tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about, or that they want to say it's somehow because of where I live. I'm just a bit bothered by this whole thread. It sounds like most people here are looking at recording artists and not the meat-and-potatoes guys who are making it happen in churches every week.

[Dr_Funkdamental]

For the record, I was one of THE first few gospel bassists around my city back in the day (which is swarming now), so I know a LIL somethin . But as for me, I didnt call you out on experiences, I called you out on your STATEMENTS (which you tried to retract and redirect). Lets be real. If I put up a thread asking who are the "great" rock bassists, best believe Entwistle, Geddy, Claypool, Sheehan and some others will definitely be stated. Same goes here. You cant make a statement like that and not expect to be challenged. And I'll say Ive been to many a country churches (Im dirty south all day everyday) where Ive seen many bass players that will "cleanly" tap dance around major names, so. Maybe I havent been to a REAL average american church (which is yet a bigger generalization that cant be explained LOL).

[bottomzone]

As brothers in and for Christ, I am sure that we can have a good debate without making it personal. It may help, brother Eublet, it you could give us examples of the great gospel bassists are who are, in your opinion, a little sloppy and give us your definition of sloppy.


A Groove is a Terrible Thing to Waste!

[fountain boy]

I got an even better idea!!!!

Why can't ya'll brothers make a clip of yourselves playing (youtube or google)

Not in a competitive way, i'd just like to see how we all are differing & growing. Besides, i love hearing gospel runs.

[DWBass]

I have observed one thing in following the current state of urban gospel and it's bassists. They will defend this style of 'busy' playing in a heartbeat. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that or the playing. I think we all can agree that some of us like it and some of us don't. I also agree with the statement that there are a ton of unknown players who would run circles around some of these top names (search out DoniJai and see what I'm talking about). I'd also like to know who Eublet thinks is sloppy and what his definition of sloppy is. I haven't found any to be sloppy at all but that's just in my experience.

[Eublet]

I'm just saying that the greats in many of the average churches (I'm referring to average meaning number of congregants) tend to be sloppy. Missed notes, sliding around excessively, overdoing fills, etc. It stills grooves very hard, and it just feels right. Kinda like if you were recording it, isolating the tracks, it would come back sloppy. Lots of string noise when slapping, etc. It's not like I mean it as an indictment. The description fits across the board, and "business" is a part of the genre that makes it work.

[Dr_Funkdamental]

Originally Posted by Eublet

I'm just saying that the greats in many of the average churches (I'm referring to average meaning number of congregants) tend to be sloppy. Missed notes, sliding around excessively, overdoing fills, etc. It stills grooves very hard, and it just feels right. Kinda like if you were recording it, isolating the tracks, it would come back sloppy. Lots of string noise when slapping, etc. It's not like I mean it as an indictment. The description fits across the board, and "business" is a part of the genre that makes it work.

See, there you go again. Let me help you out.

I'm just saying that the greats in many of the average churches that Ive visited(I'm referring to average meaning number of congregants) tend to be sloppy.

Im curious, what do you mean by description across the board? The sloppiness? Check it out. My ONLY issue in what youre saying (notice that I actually havent dissagreed with your opinion) is that you are horribly generalizing. Theres a difference if I say "Fenders suck" and "the Fenders that IVE played suck". I think everyone's experiences should be respected, because thats what makes TB great, but when it comes to vast generalizations, Im like . Partly because generalizations can produce stereotypes. And theres always exceptions to everything. Just as in this case, our experiences greatly differ.