6/8 and 4/4

Kitschead · #1 10-06-2008, 08:03 PM

How can you tell if a song is in 6/8 or 4/4. The song I have in mind is "Feeling Good." I guess this song could be counted in either. So why is it counted in 4/4 instead of 6/8? I would've thought it would be easier to count it in 6/8.

kingbee · #2 10-06-2008, 10:31 PM

Yeah, you can count along either way with that one. The ambiguity comes from hearing triplets played in 4/4 and simultaneously hearing fast 6/8 with an emphasis on beats one and four. Either way, the decision to go with 6/8 or 4/4 is really a question of the convenience of notation and counting. Writing out all those measures of 6/8 (and counting them as you play) might seem more precise but there are so many strong beats and chord changes on the 1 and 4 and so much space in between that it makes more sense just to interpret it as 4/4. Otherwise, you're rushing yourself through the song. Try just tapping your foot on every beat in 6/8 and you'll probably start to lose the groove. Now ifyou just try tapping it in a slower 4/4, you still have room to feel those triplets between each beat but they don't become distracting.

funkydanbass · #3 10-06-2008, 10:40 PM

I don't know the song, but based on the above post I would assume the song was in 12/8... Which is the compound equivalent of 4/4.

Jactap · #4 10-06-2008, 10:43 PM

+1 on 12/8

Kitschead · #5 10-07-2008, 01:49 AM

So do you think that a 6/8 song would mostly be slower than that?

BassChuck · #6 10-07-2008, 04:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kitschead

So do you think that a 6/8 song would mostly be slower than that?

6/8, 4/4, 12/8 etc etc are meters and are a way of communicating how the beats are grouped in measures and how they are sub-divided.

Tempo has to do with the speed of the beats.

The point at which tempo as an impact on the meter comes with the ease of keeping track of the notes. In other words a fast suffle might be best to think of in 4/4, but if you were to slow it down a good bit, one might find that thinking in 12/8 is better. Slower still, the beats could be thought of as measures and then you would be thinking in 3/4.

kesslari · #7 10-07-2008, 08:42 AM

For a great, single song example of the difference between 6/8 and 4/4, listen to John Hiatt's "Cry Love".

The main part of the song is in 6/8, but the drummer puts such a strong backbeat into it that you don't notice (unless you're counting).
then at the coda, the band kicks it into 4/4, and you go "WHOA, what happened?"

Download, listen, count, enjoy.

fretlessman71 · #8 10-07-2008, 08:52 AM

Hmmm... the main part of the song feels like 3/4 to me, kesslari. Doesn't 6/8 imply two subdivisions of 3 instead of 3 subdivisions of 2?

Kitschead · #9 10-07-2008, 08:29 PM

I'm afraid I have to disagree with both Kesslari and Fretlessman. This song doesn't have a strong emphasis on the fourth beat like a song in 6/8 should (and if we're thinking in 3/4 it doesn't have an accent on beat one of every second bar.). I think that this whole song is in 6/4.

kesslari · #10 10-08-2008, 12:23 AM

Quote:

Doesn't 6/8 imply two subdivisions of 3 instead of 3 subdivisions of 2?

No. There are a lot of ways to phrase 6/8. Listen to Moroccan and Persian musics - those cats LIVE in myriad 6/8 variants.

Quote:

I'm afraid I have to disagree with both Kesslari and Fretlessman.

And that's the beauty of music - there are a lot of ways to conceptualize the same thing.

fretlessman71 · #11 10-08-2008, 12:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kitschead

I'm afraid I have to disagree with both Kesslari and Fretlessman.

That's fine - so long as you're okay with being wrong.