Adam Smale's new approach to scales

[bassictraining]

Is anyone familiar with this? Adam claims that all scales can be broken down to two different patterns thus saving lots of time and quickly improving playing....

I wondered if anyone has any insight here.

http://www.NewApproachToScales.com/

[mambo4]

I call snake oil, especially for 19.99. My guess is he speaks of tetrachords.

there are no "new" or "time saving" patterns to be discovered in diatonic western music.
anything less than a solid , practiced understanding of all 12 notes, intervals, scales, and the chords will be lacking in some regard.
if you keep at it long enough you realize it's all a single pattern, just selectively applied.

[onlyclave]

Yeah, Fergie Fulton will tell you all about that for free.

[the_stone]

100% percent snake oil. There are no shortcuts to learning to play music - just hard work.

[BassChuck]

tetrachords are a fine addition to anyones understanding of scales. As a time saver.... questionable. For $19.95 not worth it. Buy music and listen.

[Chrispurchase]

This is pretty good lesson on tetrachords if you are wondering what they are: http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2010/03...-combinations/

[JetBlackJazz]

i just play notes, complex or simpe as they are, and they sound just as fine as any other technical player...minus all the brainconsuming, worthless knowledge....theyre using old techniques for avant-garde nature. I just play

[Chrispurchase]

Originally Posted by JetBlackJazz

i just play notes, complex or simpe as they are, and they sound just as fine as any other technical player...minus all the brainconsuming, worthless knowledge....theyre using old techniques for avant-garde nature. I just play

I disagree, it's like the old saying give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day, teach a man to fish and he'll eat for a lifetime!

[AdamSmale]

Hi to all on this post. I stumbled upon this post by accident and thought I would chime in, partly to defend my book and my "New Approach" method, and partly to just have join in on a healthy discussion.

Yup, I sell my book for $19.99, but it certainly is not over priced. I compared similar books and feel that the 2 years of work I put into this self-published release is quite fair for a book of around 180 pages.

I can see where mambo4 but be apprehensive in the fact that I have discovered a "re-arranging" of the fretboard, all in standard tuning. But I assure you, I am not a snake oil salesman. I truly believe I have stumbled across something really cool that I want to share with fellow guitarists & bassists.

It is NOT a re-hash of same old scale stuff that has been published before. Sure, it's the same notes of the same scales we already know, it's how the organization, and how you think of scales matched to chords is what's different than all the other books.

bassictraining is correct. The way the fingering patterns work out, there is in fact only two basic patterns for each scale. And because there is only two, and not 7, it works out to over 70% less work of learning and practicing the same scale in the traditional way.

I have to assume if you are a person who may think I'm trying to pull one over on people, than you haven't taken the time to check out the preview of the book. I'll post a link to it if you want. Or you can do a web search yourself. (New Approach to Scales for Guitarists: A Practical Modern Direction)

I realize that it may seem unbelievable unless you look further. I would be skeptical myself before I discovered this. You are free to dismiss my hard work if you want, but maybe I just have stumbled across something new. You'll never know unless you have a look first. And to be fair, I do understand that the date of the original post happened before my book was made available, and before there was a preview available as well. The book just came out June 30, 2011.

I am happy to answer anything anyone wants to ask me. Oh and by the way, no. It's not just tetrachords.

Thanks,

Adam Smale

[Fergie Fulton]

Originally Posted by onlyclave

Yeah, Fergie Fulton will tell you all about that for free.

I think no one can criticise anyone selling their knowlege, or their view of it, that's the business we are in. I for one will always encourage information and learning presentations, because the presentation is as much of a skill as the information it teaches.

As for Tetrachord being free, there is a lot of information for free, but it is information in context that benifits the student best. I have spoken before about how with all the mediums out there, the presentation of theory gets out of sync and context. So we have students looking at harmony, with out the knowledge of scales and chords to support the harmony lessons they are reading. I learned Tetrachord theory as one of my first lessons in an afternoon (it is not hard) so we would have an understanding of why certain musical ideas are so ( why sharps and flats appear in scales,keys and chords, cycle of 5ths, 4ths etc), and will always be amazed when i hear that it is not taught as a matter of course.

I came from an age where the only information/instruction i got came from my teacher and their staff, no other teacher/instructor would interfere, contradict, or undermine what i was learning with their ideas or opinions. If i questioned another teacher about an idea, i would be told to go back to my teacher. Because we had different teachers and instructors through the years and depending on you level and proficiency, the information was kept in context so each new idea built on one that we already knew.
We could not go and search the internet, or look on youtube for new ideas. Every one of use learned from the same textbooks and took the same exams. Once we reached the accepted level then things took a different turn with books and music being recommended reading and listening, and the techers/instructors willing to answer questions from any student.

So i would see this book by Adam as information being presented in context...i would hope, and in that if its content has proven worth then seeing a new presentation is no bad thing.

[sigmafloyd]

Go to Barnes and Noble and every guitar lesson book is over $20. Not sure why this is any different. $20 is a small price to pay to learn something new. Is it revolutionary in terms of reshaping the way everyone plays scales? I don't know, haven't read it . That being said, if it's new to you it's new.

[mambo4]

I am simply skeptical of any marketing speak that claims a teaching method to be "new", "easy" or (seen elsewhere)to contain "tricks of the pros" etc: my experience is that they may have some substance but contain nothing exceptional. Implying that anything short of sincere effort and study will suffice is misleading -but that's advertising for you.

However, I have no objection to anyone trying to make a living, it's hard enough for musicians. And sigmafloyd is right: It certainly will be new and informative to somebody...

[GeoffT]

If you want the best bang for your buck in terms of time spent/results study harmony (chord tones - arpeggios and inversions starting on each finger) not scales. Scott Devine and Adam Neely have some great vids on their websites and youtube.

[AdamSmale]

Thanks Fergie and sigmafloyd. It was really nice to see your comments. Well said, both of you!

First off, fellow musicians, I am not reinventing music. However, I did stumble across a new, yes new, way of looking at scales and organizing it in a different way on the fretboard. No tricks.

GeoffT, I agree completely with what you say: "study harmony (chord tones - arpeggios and inversions starting on each finger)..." But those each are just one slice of the over-all picture, just like scales are one slice of the over-all picture. My book is not a thorough study in music as a whole, just a new way to map scales on the fretboard, and to start thinking of scales more like chords, and relating them to chords, instead of just "scales".

I also think that when someone hears the word scales they think of something boring, something that doesn't make a direct link to a real-life playing situation. That is EXACTLTY what I'm trying to change!

As far as I know, this is new. I have never heard anyone teach it, never read this in a book before. However, my quest for my own sound, listening to master musicians, transcribing, composing, and from study from other books over the years, has caused me to stumble upon this concept. And I do say stumble. As I said, I'm not revolutionizing music, just another way people can start to look at scales besides what has come before.

Regards,

Adam Smale

[Papa Dangerous]

Originally Posted by AdamSmale

Hi to all on this post. I stumbled upon this post by accident and thought I would chime in, partly to defend my book and my "New Approach" method, and partly to just have join in on a healthy discussion.

Yup, I sell my book for $19.99, but it certainly is not over priced. I compared similar books and feel that the 2 years of work I put into this self-published release is quite fair for a book of around 180 pages.

I can see where mambo4 but be apprehensive in the fact that I have discovered a "re-arranging" of the fretboard, all in standard tuning. But I assure you, I am not a snake oil salesman. I truly believe I have stumbled across something really cool that I want to share with fellow guitarists & bassists.

It is NOT a re-hash of same old scale stuff that has been published before. Sure, it's the same notes of the same scales we already know, it's how the organization, and how you think of scales matched to chords is what's different than all the other books.

bassictraining is correct. The way the fingering patterns work out, there is in fact only two basic patterns for each scale. And because there is only two, and not 7, it works out to over 70% less work of learning and practicing the same scale in the traditional way.

I have to assume if you are a person who may think I'm trying to pull one over on people, than you haven't taken the time to check out the preview of the book. I'll post a link to it if you want. Or you can do a web search yourself. (New Approach to Scales for Guitarists: A Practical Modern Direction)

I realize that it may seem unbelievable unless you look further. I would be skeptical myself before I discovered this. You are free to dismiss my hard work if you want, but maybe I just have stumbled across something new. You'll never know unless you have a look first. And to be fair, I do understand that the date of the original post happened before my book was made available, and before there was a preview available as well. The book just came out June 30, 2011.

I am happy to answer anything anyone wants to ask me. Oh and by the way, no. It's not just tetrachords.

Thanks,

Adam Smale

Damn, reminds of those times in school where you say something to a classmate at the exact time everyone else gets quite and you get busted.

As for a new approach to viewing scales, it seems pretty interesting. I have tried to take a variety of looks at the fretboard and think of comprehensive ways that seem to work. I do not think I came up with 180 pages worth of material, but I have bounced a few ideas that seem to make sense.

My only thing is, is it really new? To me, new means it has not been done before, and thus implies you are familiar with everyone who has ever looked at a fretboard and understand their approach to it.

I will check some reviews though, it certainly does seem like an interesting bit of information considering that you are so adamant about it.

As for 19.99 being a lot of money for a book.. Have you ever looked at a guitar/bass method book? Some can be found for 10 bucks, but I see most around 19.99, and up to 29.99.

[GeoffT]

Originally Posted by AdamSmale

GeoffT, I agree completely with what you say: "study harmony (chord tones - arpeggios and inversions starting on each finger)..." But those each are just one slice of the over-all picture, just like scales are one slice of the over-all picture. My book is not a thorough study in music as a whole, just a new way to map scales on the fretboard, and to start thinking of scales more like chords, and relating them to chords, instead of just "scales".

I didn't say scales were useless, I was replying as a bass player with respect to playing bass (holding down the groove and outlining the harmony as it's core function). The wording of the orginal question made me belive that the person asking it was in the beginner to intermediate range because he/she wanted to save time and greatly improve his/her playing, so I replied with what I belive to be the best advice for a bass player with that experience level.

Your reply is the exact reason I said to learn chord tones, scales are not like chords, they are like scales, they do not outline the harmony, chord tones do. After mastering chord tones and inversions, learning to use chromatic and whole step approaches to them covers pretty much every note available. It can also be explained in far less than 180 pages which I think would be a bit overwhelming for someone in that range of experience. Note choices then become about what sounds good to the player based on their experience using this foundation and it maintains the core job of outlining the harmony. It can also be used quite effectively for soloing. This is not a slice as you called it, it is the majority of what is expected from a bass player.

I understand how to construct my scales and modes and it can be very useful for fills and such but often only in small sections (3-5 notes max.) otherwise it just sounds like scales. This kind of application accounts for a very small percentage of what a bass player does. Spending a lot of time learning scales up and down the neck before really learning the approach I mentioned above will make them good at playing scales up and down the neck not save them time or effort as far as becoming a better bass player.

Edit: After reviewing my post I see that people could think that I have issues with Adam's method, I do not, I have not seen it. My personal opinion is that $19.99 for a 180 page book seems like a pretty good deal actually. It is less than the cost of a lesson with an instructor so I would expect that it easily contains more information than one could get from a single lesson. I disagree with the general claims of snake oil since those people have not seen the information, the fact that Adam actually knows something about marketing would give me reason to believe that he is both thorough and intellegent and that his method would be as well. The fact that he is here and has offered to answer questions would seem to back that up too.

[jallenbass]

Since no one so far has said that they have purchased and at least glanced through said book it seems that they should before giving their opinion about Mr. Smale's approach.

[fearceol]

Originally Posted by jallenbass

Since no one so far has said that they have purchased and at least glanced through said book it seems that they should before giving their opinion about Mr. Smale's approach.

I agree. I think that this thread is a bit futile as people are offering opinions on something they have not yet seen.

[Fergie Fulton]

Originally Posted by fearceol

I agree. I think that this thread is a bit futile as people are offering opinions on something they have not yet seen.

Ahhh but the thread is mainly discussing the use of the word "new" in the title rather than any content the book may hold...so this thread has the potential to run and run just on that premise alone. I tried an on-line download but lost connection, so i will try later on today. Looked at the previews and its layout with the use of notation, tab, and box diagrams seems to be very concice.

Originally Posted by GeoffT

Your reply is the exact reason I said to learn chord tones, scales are not like chords, they are like scales, they do not outline the harmony, chord tones do. After mastering chord tones and inversions, learning to use chromatic and whole step approaches to them covers pretty much every note available. It can also be explained in far less than 180 pages which I think would be a bit overwhelming for someone in that range of experience. Note choices then become about what sounds good to the player based on their experience using this foundation and it maintains the core job of outlining the harmony. It can also be used quite effectively for soloing. This is not a slice as you called it, it is the majority of what is expected from a bass player.

I understand how to construct my scales and modes and it can be very useful for fills and such but often only in small sections (3-5 notes max.) otherwise it just sounds like scales.

On this point one the function of scales is to build a dexterity, stamina and fluency on the hands to move between notes. They should be considered exercises to tone and train the hands, because the intervals of tones and semitones, particularly on a bass, can be found in patterns due to the instruments tuning (all in 4ths).
One of the reasons we study chords, harmony and melody later on in our studies is because we have done the ground work to support them at the start by "running scales". In this simple act we also learn notes, and in those notes contain chords and chord tones.
Yes chords and chord tones later but start with scales which have all the information (usefull and useless if you want) and start building a solid foundation to build the rest of your playing own.

Its is easier to start with scales then introduce chords, than it is to start with chords and harmony then introduce scales. What i see are players and students wanting to learn and understand fast. Jumping scales studies in favour of chord and harmony studies is just that very thing of diluting the information.
I am not say you will not study chord tones and harmony, i am saying be prepared for them when it comes, by getting in and understanding your scales studies.

I do not believe that learning chord tones in any way helps support scales study for a student. Playing is just not knowledge, it is the physical skill of playing the musical ideas a well. Watching players struggle with the simple job of playing Billy Cobhams Stratus, shows that they lack the physical skill that playing scales would help build. There is nothing to gain from chord, melody or harmony study that will help you play this song (or songs like it) better...it is a physical song.

So a book like this has my interest and will make good reading to see how what i know holds up and maybe, just maybe make my teaching life a bit easier. Knowing something and knowing how to explain it well are two very different skills.

[fearceol]

Originally Posted by Fergie Fulton

Ahhh but the thread is mainly discussing the use of the word "new" in the title rather than any content the book may hold.
.

Ahhh, but how can they form an opinion on the word "new" without reading the book ? Any reasonable discussion has to be based on fact. Maybe the guy has discovered something new, maybe not. None of us will know for sure till we read the book.