Bass Solo/Improv over "Blue Bossa"

[kynoch]

I am learning the tune "Blue Bossa" playing the chords and the bass line and then trying to come up with something interesting over the top....I am using the minor pentatonic and using several arpeggios too....I am also employing the flattened 5th of the blues scale.....so I am wanting this to sound interesting...but so far it doesn't....any tips....when my teacher plays through this it sounds amazing and he is just using the same options as me but DAMN it sounds good.....I wanna get something good down before my next glass so any help/tips advice would be really cool...I just want my improv to sound as good as his

[OliverH]

I've been learning the Pat Martino guitar solo from his version of Blue Bossa (admittedly slowed down a bit), and I'm finding that has opened my eyes to a whole lot of patterns and harmonies. Maybe you can try the same.

Or try learning a solo from a completely different instrument. They tend to have a completely different approach and can give you some new insights.

[Jim Nazium]

One idea is to sing a solo (over an Abersold record or Band-in-a-Box track), record yourself singing, then play it back and learn to play what you sang. By singing, you will free yourself from thinking about scales & chords and express your musical ideas. Then you can learn how to express those ideas through your bass.

[Zombbg4]

First and foremost you need to listen to some jazz. Its impossible to speak the language well if you don't study it often.Listening to some other players (not bass players) and see how the approach it and try to emulate that. As for notes, use the proper scale to each chord.

[Febs]

The minor pentatonic scale is probably not the best choice for this song. Here are the basic changes:

[:  Cm      |  Cm       |  Fm        |   Fm        |
                             
|   Dm7b5   |  G7       |  Cm        |   Cm        |
                                
|   Ebm7    |  Ab7      |  Db        |   Db        | 

|   Dm7b5   |  G7       |  Cm        |   G7       :]

Bars 1-8 are in Cmin. The Cmin pentatonic scale would work there, but the C minor scale (C D Eb F G Ab Bb C) would probably be a better choice.

Measures 9-12 are a ii-V-I progression in the key of Db Major. Try a Db major scale there (Db Eb F Gb Ab Bb C Db), but pay attention to the chord tones in each chord. For example, over the Ebmin7 chord, the chord tones are:

Db Eb F Gb Ab Bb C Db

Over the Ab7 chord, the chord tones are:

Db Eb F Gb Ab Bb C Db

Over the Db, the chord tones are:

Db Eb F Gb Ab Bb C Db

Thus, for example, a Gb would work well over the Ebmin7 and Ab7, because it is a chord tone in each of those chords. However, even though Gb is in the Db major scale, the Gb does not work well over the Db major chord.

Another way to think of measures 9-12 is to use an Eb dorian scale in measure 9 over the Ebmin7, an Ab mixolydian scale in measure 10 over the Ab7, and a Db ionian (major) scale over the Db.

Bars 13-16 are basically a ii-V-i in Cmin. C harmonic minor (C D Eb F G Ab B C) would work over those measures.

[HaVIC5]

Here's a video I made up answering your question. It might be above your head if you haven't watched my other videos on soloing, but there's a lot of stuff in there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llGxqg_rCYw

[quale213]

Originally Posted by Jim Nazium

One idea is to sing a solo (over an Abersold record or Band-in-a-Box track), record yourself singing, then play it back and learn to play what you sang.

That is fantastic advice that I have never thought of or done, thanks

[HaVIC5]

Originally Posted by quale213

That is fantastic advice that I have never thought of or done, thanks

A better kind of overarching strategy that's along the same lines, IMO, is to sing everything you play back once you've played it (or along with your playing if you prefer). But thats still a good idea.

[onlyclave]

Welcome back, HaVIC5.

[Dennis Kong]

Originally Posted by Zombbg4

First and foremost you need to listen to some jazz. Its impossible to speak the language well if you don't study it often.Listening to some other players (not bass players) and see how the approach it and try to emulate that. As for notes, use the proper scale to each chord.

Have you heard the original?
Suggest you listen to several versions of the tune. Joe Henderson has nice solo on it.

The other suggestion is study some other minor blues progessions that relate to it.
IE: Stolen Moments, MR PC, FootPrints.
all use a form type of Cmi blues changes.

I took learned some parts of Joe Henderson's solo for ideas for my solo ideas to start.

[bearshimmy]

try focusing on emphasizing the 3ds and 7ths of each chord, those are the golden notes that will make it sound like you are changing chords and not just wiggling your fingers.

[HaVIC5]

Originally Posted by onlyclave

Welcome back, HaVIC5.

I never left, haha. Although I did need some inspiration to make some more videos, and this thread gave it to me.

[Hoover]

Think of the melody.



Now.



Yes, right now, think of the melody to "Blue Bossa". Now sing it to yourself (in your head, or out loud, whatever you're comfortable with). Can you do that?

If not, make that your first goal. Not memorizing which chord-scales go over which changes, not checking out a dozen other people's recordings of the song...if you don't know how "Blue Bossa" the composition goes, nothing you play during your solo will be "Blue Bossa" ...it'll just be you blowing. In more ways than one.

If you can sing the melody to "Blue Bossa", now play it on your bass. Listen to how it fits the chords. Listen to how it moves. Listen to how it creates a sense of place, of time, of aboutness.

Now...when improvising, let your familiarity with how "Blue Bossa" goes -- and how "Blue Bossa" feels, fits, moves, the aboutness "Blue Bossa" conveys -- let all of that inform what you play.

Now you're playing "Blue Bossa" ...and not just playing over it.

[HaVIC5]

Yes, definitely, the melody is important in soloing, and can be a huge help in giving a cohesion to your solo. Many drummers will sing the melody along in their heads to keep their place in the tune, and it informs them (as it should inform you the bass player) of the climax of the tune, how each harmonic phrase leads the next, and how you can get from chorus to chorus.

However, I will say this. Sometime people OVERemphasize the importance of incorporating the head melody in teaching jazz head-solo-head performance. In practice, the head is typically just a vehicle for the improvisation. A huge number of bebop and post-bop heads are like this - when was the last time you heard somebody develop the melody of Donna Lee in their solo? What's most important is crafting a melody yourself, creating your own material, borrowing from the head melody or other melodies that fit the changes (the often-used and often-too-clever practice of "quoting"). Study the melody of the sake of studying how the melody works (antecedent/consequent, sequences, contour, etc), then use those principles in your own improvisation.

[Hoover]

Originally Posted by HaVIC5

Sometime people OVERemphasize the importance of incorporating the head melody in teaching jazz head-solo-head performance. In practice, the head is typically just a vehicle for the improvisation. A huge number of bebop and post-bop heads are like this - when was the last time you heard somebody develop the melody of Donna Lee in their solo? What's most important is crafting a melody yourself, creating your own material, borrowing from the head melody or other melodies that fit the changes (the often-used and often-too-clever practice of "quoting"). Study the melody of the sake of studying how the melody works (antecedent/consequent, sequences, contour, etc), then use those principles in your own improvisation.

Right: note that there is a big difference between incorporating the melody, and letting the melody inform your improvisation.




...or maybe there isn't, and it's just semantics.

[Mike Dimin]

1. Knowledge of the melody is vital in developing a good solo. It is part of the source material, along with arpeggios, scales and modes, phrasing, etc. In fact the melody of Blue Bossa is comprised of a number of melodic sequences, not to recognize and use that both rhythmically and melodically is a handicap to developing the solo. Finally, the melody can give hints to what the scale/mode you are using.

2. The Dm7b5 going to the G7 is a minor II-V. So where you can play the C natural minor over the first 4 measures, the Dm7b5 comes from the 6th degree of the Melodic Minor Scale built on F. The scale, the Locrian #2, provides all the chord tones as well as the natural 9. The easiest way to approach the G7 is to play C Harmonic Minor (the raised 7th, "B" is the 3rd of the G7 chord). But there are 2 more ways (at least) that might sound a bit more hip - you can use the G Lydian b7 scale (which comes from the 4th degree of the D Melodic Minor Scale) or the G Altered Scale which comes from the 7th degree of the Ab Melodic Minor Scale.

A COOL thing to do over the Minor II-V is to play a line using the F Melodic Minor (Locrian #2 on the Dm7b5 chord) and play the same line up a minor third in Ab Melodic Minor (Altered Scale on the G7 chord). You can also play the same line DOWN a minor 3rd in D Melodic Minor (Lydian b7 Scale on the the G7)

Of course let your ears be the judge

Mike Dimin
Author "The Art of Solo Bass"
Mel Bay Publications