Big list of song keys?

[Ace Marconi]

Has anyone ever seen a web site, spread sheet, or text file listing song, artist and key, for a humongous number of songs?

[MalcolmAmos]

Originally Posted by Ace Marconi

Has anyone ever seen a web site, spread sheet, or text file listing song, artist and key, for a humongous number of songs?

As no one has jumped on this. Yes there are sites that will lists songs with chord progressions and or treble cleft thus the key - on the Internet. Some list the artist some do not.

Google can take you to the Internet site, once there help yourself to what is listed.

Google -- Guitar chords, "name of a song" The comma and the quote marks do help. http://www.google.com/search?sourcei...+cold+heart%22.

What/why are you wanting this, perhaps there is something else that will help better, faster, etc.

[the yeti]

why a list of song keys? just curious.

[Ace Marconi]

I have a tape recorder memory for what I hear, and have heard over the years. Unfortunately, I do not posses perfect pitch. I use a netbook for my sheet music, etc. however, a list of song, artist, and opening key would let me teach the people I jam with, on the fly, and in the right key, without internet support.

I do have 7000+ songs in the Ipod, but even that is not really enough to be a proper human jukebox.

You did ask.

[the yeti]

Originally Posted by Ace Marconi

I have a tape recorder memory for what I hear, and have heard over the years. Unfortunately, I do not posses perfect pitch. I use a netbook for my sheet music, etc. however, a list of song, artist, and opening key would let me teach the people I jam with, on the fly, and in the right key, without internet support.

I do have 7000+ songs in the Ipod, but even that is not really enough to be a proper human jukebox.

You did ask.

fair enough. i take it you disagree with the idea the the right key is the one all the players agree on?

[PJSShearer]

If you have a singer in the band, they should know what key they sing a particular song in as they need to pitch the song to fit in their vocal range.

Similarly with Brass and Reed players - they have ranges they feel comfortable playing in and, depending on their standard of competance, they would also have preferences for "simple" keys as too many sharps or flats can cause them problems.

Generally this is "same key as rhe record", but not always :-)

For Instance "Spanish Eyes" is normally played in "G" (in the UK) but sung in "C" (it might be vice-versa - it's been a while!) and picking the wrong one, as has happened, can get dangerous around the line: "Bringing you all the Love your Heart can Hold" (Ouch!).

[the yeti]

^yes.

[Ace Marconi]

I deal with both kinds as required. The big country band leader (Drummer) insists on original key only, as does another guitarist I have my sites on. When I'm playing with the Capo kids, they will move anything, and even the 5 string banjo picker uses a Capo, and modulates with ease.

However as noted above, it can get dangerous!! Mostly looking for a very fast look up reference, which can be printed out, with only the minimum information.

Merry Christmas from Canada, Eh!

[PJSShearer]

I recall being in a jazz-type piano trio where we'd play a song in a different key occasionally just to alleviate the boredom!!. We used no charts and the piano player would call a key and launch into a song. Sometimes at the end I'd ask him "what was that one called?". Whereas the guy who had the gig before him presented me with a ring binder with all the songs witten out and numbered!!.

One thing to think of - what is the orignal key? - if you look at the sheet music for Free's "All Right Now" - it's in "G" AND the chords are different!. I was in a Band where we agreed to learn "Just the way you are" for the next rehearsal. the Keytard learned it from Barry White's record (Bb), not Billy Joel's (D).

[Ace Marconi]

Well, fast forward a year, and, to quote the song, "I still haven't found what I'm looking for". I have begun the project, only to find out that it just isn't as simple as I thought. Surprise ?

I started out with a list of about 150 tunes I do with two or three groups, and I began to notice some funny (weird) things. Most times, the starting note/chord/root, and the key are the same, but not always. Those ones are easy.

There are some songs that have obvious key changes part way through. I think the correct term is modulating. I usually mark this on the set list. Again, no sweat.

I listened carefully when some of the elders in one of the groups discussed key determination, based on starting, and ending chords/progressions. The concept seemed to be that in the absence of a wholesale key change, this would indicate the key.

Unfortunately that still doesn't cover everything. Listing the starting note helps, but if that isn't the actual key, and someone changes the intro slightly, we're touring the ditch again.

Finally, there were some songs on the list where I honestly could not decide between several possible keys. I am now at a loss as to how to list them, unless I actually jot down a bar or two of music. I just ain't that good yet.

Apart from tabs, or lead sheets, who has a good shorthand method of reminding yourself where you played a particular tune, after several months. As well, what are the real rules (if any) to label the key of a tune (apart from the key signature on the sheet music, which really just tells you how to read the sharps and flats anyway).

I could accept that there really is no simple answer, but I'm sure ready to learn as many tricks as my low end brethren care to pass along.

[MalcolmAmos]

Originally Posted by Ace Marconi

..............
Apart from tabs, or lead sheets, who has a good shorthand method of reminding yourself where you played a particular tune, after several months. As well, what are the real rules (if any) to label the key of a tune (apart from the key signature on the sheet music, which really just tells you how to read the sharps and flats anyway).

I could accept that there really is no simple answer, but I'm sure ready to learn as many tricks as my low end brethren care to pass along.

The key you will play the song in is not the issue. That can change at the drop of a hat. The chord progression or how the chords move within the song is what you are looking for. That is going to stay the same regardless of what key is being used. If the song is Pop, Rock or Country the chord progression is going to be pretty close to I IV V7 I. If you want it in the key of C that's the C-F-G7-C chord progression, however if the song is to be played in the key of G that will be G-C-D7-G. In both cases the chords follow the I IV V I order So......... that is what you are looking for, not the chord name or the key name but what chord follows next in the song. That is done using either Roman or Arabic numbers.

You want the Nashville Number System. Instead of your cheat sheet, fake chord, lead sheet (whatever) having chord names that can change. You need sheet music that has the chord's number, aka I-vi-IV-V7-I. Armed with this it does not matter what key is called you mentally make the adjustment. And your fake chord sheet music is good for what ever key is called.

I use the Roman numbers I-vi-IV-V7-I for my rhythm guitar fake chord music and 1-6-4-5-1 for my electric bass fake chord music. Rhythm guitar I'm strumming chords, but with the bass I'm playing individual notes and building bass lines using the major scale box - long story - I find it easier using Roman numbers when strumming and Arabic numbers when playing bass. Depending on which instrument I'm playing. For example:

(1) I don’t hurt any (4) more, all my teardrops have (1) dried.

No more walking the (5) floor, with that burning (1) inside.

Google Nashville Number System Guitar Notes: THE NASHVILLE NUMBER SYSTEM I think this is what you are looking for. Nashville session players use this as each vocalist probably is going to ask for a different key. This way they only have to have one copy of the sheet music. Not one copy for every possible key.

[Ace Marconi]

Thanks MalcolmAmos!

I've known about that for quite a while. Unfortunately it's not the solution I'm looking for. I remember songs very well, once I pick a root note for them. Moving them around on the fretboard is pretty automatic at this point.

I am looking for a way of jogging my memory to the original recorded key, based on the song as it's heard on the radio. Most people who are not regular singers, but have become chemically brave enough to attempt to "sing one with the band" have picked one they sing along with. They often hit the right pitch without hints. However, most will need you to start in so they find their cue. They get really confused if you start in a key that they cannot sing it in !

I need to quickly look up the song, and know what root to start on, or what chord it starts in. At present, I find the tune on the Ipod headphones & get the key, then give the drummer his rhythm, and the guitarist his chords. If its something I know is coming for that night, a request, I will have played it, and know where it starts. Likewise if its in current band rotation. Having a quicker lookup would give them less time to get cold feet.

Per my comments above, I need to understand how others might handle this for times when the Ipod, and my memory have both failed. Its easy to remember that Badfinger Baby Blue is in B, until its half past midnight, with the basses loaded.

[the yeti]

why not just build a spreadsheet?

[Ace Marconi]

Essentially I am now building a spreadsheet, in a book on paper, since I cannot find the information to download and print out. The new wrinkle is the songs that start on a note other than the main key, or have a hard to define key. I am unsure of all of the rules that define key, apart from the printed music.

For example, how would you remind yourself of the starting position of "You didn't have to be so nice". It seems to change keys right off the start. I just want to be consistent, so that six months later I know what I meant.

I may have to use a whole phrase to define some songs. I am hoping to find out how the rest of the music world solves this problem in their personal fake books.

I like the computer idea, of course, as a dyed in the wool techie nerd, however books don't run out of batteries.

[MalcolmAmos]

Originally Posted by Ace Marconi

I may have to use a whole phrase to define some songs. I am hoping to find out how the rest of the music world solves this problem in their personal fake books.

I've never run into someone that wants what you do. I think that is why you have not received a lot of help from us. We do not relate to the need.

You may find an answer on a vocalist forum. Sorry do not know of a specific site. Good ole Google ........

Good luck.