Do I have Perfect or Relative Pitch?!

[johndough247]

Not getting into the whole "how to achieve perfect pitch" argument but I've always been confused as to which one I have, maybe one of you guys has the answer:

-I've always been good with recognizing pitches since my dad gave me a keyboard around 3 years old; I feel like I was born with this skill.

-Nobody in my immediate family is a musician (1 or 2 cousins, but nobody older than me and definitely nobody in my house), my parents didn't have an extensive music collection either (lived only with mom, visited dad, no siblings).

-Started piano lessons at 4 years old.

-I have clear memories of several 80's/early 90's songs I heard as young as 3-6 years old on the radio that I hadn't heard in decades but could sing (and later on play on bass or piano) in their original keys note for note.

-I actually found out the name to an old NES game my God-brother played maybe a handful of times in front of me back in 1990-91 (I was 5 or 6) by asking an online forum (fast-forward to 2007) what it was; I actually sequenced the whole song note for note to help identify it. It was the very first level of "The Guardian Legend" for you gamers out there. Looked the game up on YouTube and to my amazement other than one rhythm being slightly off, the notes were spot on.

-My friends (including my musician friends) in elementary and high schools always found it surprising that I could figure out piano parts to songs from just listening.

-Met a guy in HS who was a beast on tenor sax, was shedding Coltrane and Parker solos almost effortlessly. He told me about perfect pitch and how he's trying to learn it (this is after he's transcribed some of these solos on paper already)

-Started memorizing the names of pitches by using a combination of things:

1) songs I listened to a lot during that time period (didn't sit down and listen to it for hours, just assigned a song to a note from memory and kept the ones that stuck):. "Aja" - Steely Dan is in B major so that's how I learned that note.
"knocks me off my feet" - Stevie wonder = C
"over the hills and far away" - Led Zeppelin = G
"love will never do" - Janet Jackson = A flat

2) listen to the tuning pitch from HS concert band, we always tuned to B flat.

3) tuning my bass hundreds of times taught me E A D and G


-I don't have all the notes based on this method, but I used the ones I do have to get to all the others pretty fast. I can recognize most of the notes I "learned" instantly by hearing the song/sound associated with it in my head.

-Also note that I started learning the names of pitches AFTER all the things I listed above. I don't get irritated or uncomfortable if the whole song is perfectly out of tune (I.e. if everyone is tuned to be 25 cents off of A440, as long as there's no horribly dissonant chords like 1 of six guitar strings slightly off from the others, I'm usually good).

That's it. The definitions of perfect and relative always seem to fall in between where I am, thus my confusion.

OK GUYS AND GALS, WHAT DO I HAVE? PERFECT PITCH OR RELATIVE PITCH?

[DiabolusInMusic]

Relative pitch.

To find out if somebody has perfect pitch hit them a couple five note chords in a row and have them identify each individual note struck. If they get them 100% they have it, if you can only tell the chord quality, you have relative pitch.

[williamk]

relative

[johndough247]

Originally Posted by DiabolusInMusic

Relative pitch.

To find out if somebody has perfect pitch hit them a couple five note chords in a row and have them identify each individual note struck. If they get them 100% they have it, if you can only tell the chord quality, you have relative pitch.

So you're saying a person with perfect pitch will never get 5 chords wrong, every note will be on the money? and exactly what kind of chords are we talking here? Cause I can do that too...but if you're throwing some crazy voiced chords like a D flat 9 b7 (#11) on piano with at least 7 notes in the chord...hey, i'm only human dude, I might miss a few. Still relative pitch?

[Kwesi]

If it were perfect pitch, this wouldn't even be a question. Either way, you've got yourself a badass ability!

Also, you cannot learn perfect pitch. You either have it or not. Some folks have developed their relative pitch to the point where it's very close but it's still not the exact same thing.

[joebar]

forget about the label; all that matters is that you have a killer advantage over other musicians. enjoy.

[electracoyote]

If I can walk up to you, and you have no instrument in your hand, and I ask you to hum an Ab above middle C, or an F two octaves below middle C, or ANY note in your vocal range, and you can do it, you have perfect pitch.

Or the chord example above.

I have heard perfect pitch can be taught, it relies on the ability to memorize target notes or something, maybe that's a myth?

[DukDukGuus]

I would say you have relative pitch. Here's how I think of it:

If you're trapped on an island, with no music of any kind, and I drop anchor and come ashore with a guitar, you could instantly tell me all the notes to tune. Or, you could sing the notes in perfect relation to the accepted note, spot on, for example A=440. That would be absolute or perfect pitch. The ability to sing, play or recognize a perfectly tuned note, with NO reference point.

Now, if you're trapped on that island, and I drop anchor just long enough to GIVE you a starting note, and then you can figure out all the other tunings, in relation to the reference note, you've got relative pitch.

Lots of musicians develop a pretty accurate relative pitch over years of playing, practicing, listening and tuning. Some pretty famous guitarists (that I won't name) have what I think is a "tin ear" and often don't even know they're playing out of tune. I've only known one PURE absolute pitch musician; she could tell if the old oscilloscope tuner had to be calibrated. I've heard that Mariah Carey has absolute pitch; it's exceptionally rare in vocalists, as they usually have to "tune" to an instrument, band or orchestra while singing.

[johndough247]

Originally Posted by electracoyote

If I can walk up to you, and you have no instrument in your hand, and I ask you to hum an Ab above middle C, or an F two octaves below middle C, or ANY note in your vocal range, and you can do it, you have perfect pitch.

Or the chord example above.

I have heard perfect pitch can be taught, it relies on the ability to memorize target notes or something, maybe that's a myth?

I can do the hum thing.

I can do the chord thing (again, to some extent as explained above...I can tell you the exact chord but tensions may take me a few seconds more to pinpoint...and by pinpoint I mean giving a name to it, I can hear it just fine).

Again, my brain has no issue with knowing the notes, it's that I never thought to try connecting the names to the pitches until I heard of perfect pitch and the practical applications of such a skill.

I don't mind not knowing what the "official label" is, but I thought I'd ask the board for s**** and giggles. Love this ability, wouldn't trade it for anything.

[Gaius46]

Originally Posted by DiabolusInMusic

Relative pitch.

To find out if somebody has perfect pitch hit them a couple five note chords in a row and have them identify each individual note struck. If they get them 100% they have it, if you can only tell the chord quality, you have relative pitch.

I believe this is incorrect. Perfect pitch - aka absolute pitch - is the ability to identify or reproduce a pitch without a reference pitch. It has nothing to do with recognizing single vs multiple notes except that recognizing all the notes of a chord is something people with perfect pitch can do.

Its also a two edged sword as people with perfect pitch apparently are bothered at the slightest intonation error ( I know this from personal experience).

[johndough247]

Originally Posted by DukDukGuus

I would say you have relative pitch. Here's how I think of it:

If you're trapped on an island, with no music of any kind, and I drop anchor and come ashore with a guitar, you could instantly tell me all the notes to tune. Or, you could sing the notes in perfect relation to the accepted note, spot on, for example A=440. That would be absolute or perfect pitch. The ability to sing, play or recognize a perfectly tuned note, with NO reference point.

Now, if you're trapped on that island, and I drop anchor just long enough to GIVE you a starting note, and then you can figure out all the other tunings, in relation to the reference note, you've got relative pitch.

Lots of musicians develop a pretty accurate relative pitch over years of playing, practicing, listening and tuning. Some pretty famous guitarists (that I won't name) have what I think is a "tin ear" and often don't even know they're playing out of tune. I've only known one PURE absolute pitch musician; she could tell if the old oscilloscope tuner had to be calibrated. I've heard that Mariah Carey has absolute pitch; it's exceptionally rare in vocalists, as they usually have to "tune" to an instrument, band or orchestra while singing.

Ok...was I stranded on the island in my current state (i.e. someone kidnapped me and dropped me off there today)? Yes I could tune your guitar.

What is the standard definition of a reference point? Cause my reference is inside my head, not any external source playing a note. Does that count as reference? I don't think so, as Perfect pitch ppl would have to use their mind as well (i know, big duh right?)

Will my tuning be spot on accurate to A=440...my internal reference might be within 10 cents off from true spot on A=440, but spot on the mark with a strobe tuner perfect, probably not.

Hmm, never tried that though (never checked to see if it's perfectly spot on)...I'm gonna go loosen my electric guitar completely and retune it, then check it to a strobe tuner. Will let you know in a few minutes.

[Floyd Eye]

I do not have perfect pitch. I can however slack my guitar off and retune it to within 10 cents. For the last few years all my basses and guitars have been tuned down 1/2 step though so those are the notes I hear in my head now. lol

[Fireguy]

Originally Posted by Gaius46

I believe this is incorrect. Perfect pitch - aka absolute pitch - is the ability to identify or reproduce a pitch without a reference pitch. It has nothing to do with recognizing single vs multiple notes except that recognizing all the notes of a chord is something people with perfect pitch can do.

Its also a two edged sword as people with perfect pitch apparently are bothered at the slightest intonation error ( I know this from personal experience).

One of the guys I work with has perfect pitch, or at least I think he does, and it is very true that he is absolutely annoyed by the slightest intonation error. He will comment on things that I think sound pretty darn good and then identify the problem. All the while making comments like "Gheez that is harsh".

But then again, I think I am pretty much deaf.

[CrashClint]

I have a good friend who is a guitarist and he has both perfect pitch and relative pitch. To him, it is a gift and a nuisance as music that is played the slight bit out of tune is like dragging your fingernails across a chalkboard, he is a tune freak. I have tuned my bass and started playing and he has walked over next to me and tweaked my tuners. Just from his experience, I think I would rather have perfect relative pitch over perfect pitch.

[MNAirHead]

There is also a less popular "perfect recall"

I'd never heard of this until entering freshman college music theory....

Basically if someone goes on the piano and plays a chord (or note) ... and you can "recall" it from another song memory.... you can match the two together.... you can recall a chord.

Example... someone can play a G chord... you then go... Hmmn... same chord as the first one on Alman Brothers "Stormy Monday" ... you then can say "G"... someone could hit a D... you think "first chord of Margaritaville" --- "D"...... Contrary to what people say you can develop this talent -- bit depends on your mental jukebox ability.

[Big Brother]

Originally Posted by MNAirHead

There is also a less popular "perfect recall"

I'd never heard of this until entering freshman college music theory....

Basically if someone goes on the piano and plays a chord (or note) ... and you can "recall" it from another song memory.... you can match the two together.... you can recall a chord.

Example... someone can play a G chord... you then go... Hmmn... same chord as the first one on Alman Brothers "Stormy Monday" ... you then can say "G"... someone could hit a D... you think "first chord of Margaritaville" --- "D"...... Contrary to what people say you can develop this talent -- bit depends on your mental jukebox ability.

I do this, I never thought it was unusual.

[johndough247]

That's the other part i'm not sure on either...irritated by off tuning...let's say a trumpet, trombone and clarinet play a song together.

First rehearsal: they all tune to separate tuners, assuming everyone has their tuner set to A=440. Mr. Clarinet set his to A=436 by accident. Everyone tuned their instrument spot on. YES that will irritate the hell outta me.

Second rehearsal: Mr. Trumpet decides we'll all tune on one tuner, set to A=440. Clarinet guy's instrument has an issue and can't properly tune spot on to A=440, he's approx -10 cents everytime. So the group agrees to compensate by everyone tuning down -10 cents off of 440 so that they all are perfectly out of tune. If all the other notes of the instruments stay true to the tuning, it wouldn't drive me nuts if everything is uniformly 10 cents off. Are you saying perfect pitch people go crazy over example 2 as well (given all my criteria are met)?

[Nev375]

I have a blind friend who plays piano that has perfect pitch. He can hear and identify different tones and name them in the same way that you or I can easily identify different colors and name them.

He also tunes pianos by ear. No tuning fork, no pitch pipe, not comparing one note to another... just his ear. He listens and quickly adjusts right to the note. It is that accurate.

[electracoyote]

Originally Posted by johndough247

I can do the hum thing.

Then you may have perfect pitch.

If you turn your back to a piano, and I play a random note, could you accurately name it and its position?

[johndough247]

Also, I notice people always make the comparison of perfect pitch as the ability of "you and I" to tell colors apart. I always found this interesting.

Yes, if you wanna say 'being able to tell B flat from E is like telling red from blue" then fine, I'll accept that.

But then when people start talking about Perfect pitch is having the ability to tell a slightly out of tune A to a perfectly spot on A=440, then it's more like "Here's 30 slightly different shades of red, tell me which one is PURE red; no white or black hues in it". How many of us with 20/20 or better vision can truly say we can pass that color test every time?

People keep talking about reference points like the perfect pitch crowd doesn't have a reference in their mind either...and what if their childhood reference was out of tune? I've heard a perfect pitch person actually said their piano was slightly out of tune as a kid so he has imperfect perfect pitch lol.

My theory is (subject to change of course), the somewhat relative pitch people like myself and the perfect pitch people aren't that different; it's all relative to the source.

Thoughts?