Dominant 7?? Doesn't sound right!
I'm trying to spice up my line and throw in a Dominant 7th when the chord calls for it but, damn....sometimes it just doesn't sound right to me.
Cm7.......Throw in a Dom 7 in there somewhere right? I don't know, doesn't sound right sometimes. Am I missing something.
When this happens to me -- with any chord -- I check with my band mates to find out what they are playing. Sometimes there is a surprise...
What, like THEY'RE playing something wrong??
Yes, I think you are missing something.
Whatya mean? There ISN'T a Dominant 7th in a m7th chord????? It's certainly not major 7th!!!!!
If I understand things correctly the Dominant 7th is the V (V7) chord of whatever key you happen to be playing in. In the key of C the Dominant 7th is a G7 chord.
IF... you are spelling the Cm7 chord: C, Eb, G, Bb, perhaps you are referring to the "Bb"? If so, that is called the Minor 7th (interval).
"Dominant Seventh" refers to a MAJOR triad (i.e., C, E, G) with a Minor Seventh (Bb) -> C Dominant Seventh (C7): C, E, G, Bb.
The Dominant Seventh chord has a tritone interval between the Major Third (E) and Minor Seventh (Bb).
There are no tritones in a Minor Seventh chord (i.e. Cm7 - C, Eb, G, Bb).
Stick, perhaps it's referred to by a different name depending of the chord BUT, it's STILL a Bb.
If the chord is Dm7, the 7th is a "flatted" major 7th. In this case, a C note. If the "chord" players are playing a Dm7, there's a C note in there. If I play a C note, I shouldn't be incorrect. Call it whatever you want, it's still the same note.
The 7th scale degree is very colorful. Since it's so close to the root it won't always sound good.
The problem with your statement: "Call it whatever you want", is that I am using proper/correct terms - you are not. So, there will be a communication breakdown.
Also, the term: "flatted" major 7th, is... odd.
this is not good
you are mixing up terms:
a Dominant 7th CHORD refers to the 7th chord built off the 5th of the key - G7 in C
a Dominant 7th SCALE note is just that a flatted 7th = b7 - as in Bb in the key of C
in a minor chord you assume the flatted 7th - Bb in Cm7 (but with minor chords it could be HARMONIC minor or NATURAL minor scale)
if it is a minor chord with a MAJOR 7th it would be notated CmM7 - Cm(with a little triangle that I can't do on a keyboard) 7
the reason there are assumptions is Diatonics - the way the chords fall naturally using scale notes of the root key - whether major or minor
you need to study each mode as it starts of each scale tone using only scale notes
then you only need to notate the deviances
Here are common 7th chords all from the pitch C for easy understanding.
Dominant 7th: C, E, G, Bb
Major 7th: C, E, G, B
Minor 7th: C, Eb, G, Bb
I just read the original post again. It seems like maybe you were thinking that the minor 7th (flat 7th) is called a dominant seventh? If this is the case, there are some instances where 7th chords sound unstable. The more chromatic and eccentric the music, the more stable a 7th chord will work. Playing modern pop music with 7th chords will sound kind of weird, but using them in jazz is almost a necessity.
IF you are talking about playing the seventh of a minor 7th chord in the bass, it should be fine as a passing tone. If you sustain it for any length of time, then you will, at a minimum, change the "character" of the chord.
Depending on what the other players are doing, the results may be even more "interesting".
If the chord is Cm7, and the guitar player is using the commonly-played third fret bar form of the chord, a Bb sustained against those could yield some "displeasing" results. One thing that could be happening here if you play Bb against that particular guitar voicing, is that you may be creating a voicing which actually begins to sound like G minor(your Bb along with the guitarist's low e string fretted at the 3rd fret(G) will yield a 10th that contains the part of the tonal "essence" of a G minor chord).
It's often helpful to think of minor seventh chords as a 6th chord formed on the third of the minor seventh chord(in this case Eb). When you examine it from that perspective, then the seventh is analogous to the fifth of the chord formed on the tonic of the relative major scale. As you probably know, that tone, when taken as a bass note, will yield a very distinct "open" character. Again, whether or not it turns out to be "musical" can be greatly influenced by what the other players are doing.
If you have a keyboard player and he is playing heavy bass tones with his left hand, that will further complicate the harmonic picture.
It's best in this kind of situation to have some communication with the other players. It may not be that they are playing something that is "wrong" for the chord, but they may be playing the chord voiced in a way that, taken in combination with your bass note, lends a "train wreck" character to the chord.
If you are going to play that note in that scenario, then I recommend a passing tone. If you want to use it as a sustained tone, make sure that the other players know what you are doing and make proper compensation for that in their own chord voicing.
One easy way to "un-clutter" such situations is to ask your guitar players to play "partial" chords at such points. Often a good start is to have them mute the low E and A strings at particular places. This opens up a lot of the sonic space and gets rid of some displeasing intervals. The keyboardist(if you use one) needs to be in on this discussion as well.
Press together, the "option" key and the "j" key.
cool Apple has always excelled at GUI!
In an attempt to clear up some misunderstanding on the OP's part, Dominant 7 refers to a chord, not just a flatted 7th scale degree. A Dom7 chord is constructed as 1 3 5 b7 from the parent Major scale. What primarily makes the chord dominant is the presence of the 3rd and the b7. Both of these chord tones resolve in half-step movement to the root and third of the I chord. For example, G7 to CMaj7. The 3rd of the G7 is B, which resolves a half-step up to C (the root) of the CMaj7 chord and the b7 of the G7 is F, which resolves a half step down to the 3rd of the CMaj7 chord, which is E. This dual half-step resolution in opposite direction, coupled with V to I root motion are what lends strong "dominant" characteristic to a Dominant7 chord.
It's funny - everyone is trying to describe it verbally
if you study (the notes will come) - when you work from ignorance you are guessing
there HAVE been many amazing self-taught non-reading musicians
but, it's just easier to get an education
I waited until 20+ to start studying theory and I kicked myself in the ass for not starting to study earlier
especially today when it's free on the web - I had to buy books and pay for a correspondence course
I'm sure I was clear to the reasonable. In a m7 chord, the 7 is, by definition not major. And therefore, it is dominant, meaning a half step lower than its major 7th position.
Just saying that, in jazz, playing it doesn't sound quite right to me. Perhaps, as was suggested, I should just play it as a passing note and not as a "solid" foundation "descriptive" note such as the 1,3, 5 or 8.
Thanks for all input.
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