Going to college for music?

[Satchurio]

I've recently began looking into some college music programs around Canada. I really have no idea what to expect as I have been out of school for four years and am certain some members here can answer my questions with there own experience.

My bass experience is limited to studying independently and practicing/jamming with friends on my own schedule over 3 years, assuming most of the students come directly from other schools, am I going to get walloped by prodigies when I walk in the door? I am always confident when im playing in my own space or with friends but have not had much experience with a wide array of musicians.

I was curious what the expected level at a college music program would be to have enough room for improvement to make it worthwhile while still not struggling to keep up with the course demands?

[onlyclave]

First of all you need to be able to read music competently and apply it to your instrument. You won't have time to play catch up in that area.

Secondly, there are going to be people there who can blow you away musically. Get used to it. Also, there is going to be a constant drop out rate. College music study isn't for everyone.

Don't expect the school to teach you how to play your instrument. They teach music, you have to take that theory and learn how it applies to your instrument yourself.

Be prepared to learn how to play piano and do a lot of "Do Re Mi" singing.

IMO you should seek out a local bass teacher and sign up for classes at a local community or junior college if such things exist in Canada. It is cheaper, you can get your core classes done and transfer them, typically the profs are more personable and are open to the fact that there are "second string" musicians in their classes. If you decide that a music major is not for you at least you walk away with a (hopefully) mostly good experience without too much money out of your pocket.

You might decide that you want to major in music theory, history, education or composition instead. Lots of people take that path.

[E2daGGurl]

You could start out with lower division courses in music - courses designed for everybody, not just music majors, but the theory will be fast-paced and sight-reading will be expected (and tested) at the end of one semester. However, not everybody will get it and they will still go on to the second semester, if they are determined.

To major in music, you'd need to find that you were able and quick in those two first semesters - but how will you know if you don't try? You can major in music and not aim for performance as a career, as well.

If Canada has anything like community colleges, I agree that's the best way to go (sometimes you can take extension courses and transfer those too).

[onlyclave]

Originally Posted by E2daGGurl

You could start out with lower division courses in music - courses designed for everybody, not just music majors, but the theory will be fast-paced and sight-reading will be expected (and tested) at the end of one semester. However, not everybody will get it and they will still go on to the second semester, if they are determined.

To major in music, you'd need to find that you were able and quick in those two first semesters - but how will you know if you don't try? You can major in music and not aim for performance as a career, as well.

If Canada has anything like community colleges, I agree that's the best way to go (sometimes you can take extension courses and transfer those too).

Is there an echo in here?

[Satchurio]

http://www.sl.on.ca/_files/0965-DigArtsMus0809.pdf

There is PDF of the course description for anyone who is curious, I appreciate the feedback. I have a good understanding of music theory and how to apply concepts to bass but my ability to read sheet music is lacking currently, as its been about 7 or more years.

[Martin Bormann]

Originally Posted by onlyclave

First of all you need to be able to read music competently and apply it to your instrument. You won't have time to play catch up in that area.

Secondly, there are going to be people there who can blow you away musically. Get used to it. Also, there is going to be a constant drop out rate. College music study isn't for everyone.

Don't expect the school to teach you how to play your instrument. They teach music, you have to take that theory and learn how it applies to your instrument yourself.

Be prepared to learn how to play piano and do a lot of "Do Re Mi" singing.

IMO you should seek out a local bass teacher and sign up for classes at a local community or junior college if such things exist in Canada. It is cheaper, you can get your core classes done and transfer them, typically the profs are more personable and are open to the fact that there are "second string" musicians in their classes. If you decide that a music major is not for you at least you walk away with a (hopefully) mostly good experience without too much money out of your pocket.

You might decide that you want to major in music theory, history, education or composition instead. Lots of people take that path.

Don't forget the hand signs for the solfege syllables. I always thought this stuff was pointless, but they insist on hand signs.

[Dave Muscato]

Originally Posted by Satchurio

I've recently began looking into some college music programs around Canada. I really have no idea what to expect as I have been out of school for four years and am certain some members here can answer my questions with there own experience.

My bass experience is limited to studying independently and practicing/jamming with friends on my own schedule over 3 years, assuming most of the students come directly from other schools, am I going to get walloped by prodigies when I walk in the door? I am always confident when im playing in my own space or with friends but have not had much experience with a wide array of musicians.

I was curious what the expected level at a college music program would be to have enough room for improvement to make it worthwhile while still not struggling to keep up with the course demands?

Something you should ask yourself first... What is your long-term goal? Do you plan to make a career out of performing music? In what capacity (studio sessions, on cruises, in a cover band, songwriting/jingles, arranging, producing, studio engineering, teaching privately, teaching at a college)?

[Chrispurchase]

Originally Posted by onlyclave

First of all you need to be able to read music competently and apply it to your instrument. You won't have time to play catch up in that area.

Secondly, there are going to be people there who can blow you away musically. Get used to it. Also, there is going to be a constant drop out rate. College music study isn't for everyone.

Don't expect the school to teach you how to play your instrument. They teach music, you have to take that theory and learn how it applies to your instrument yourself.

Be prepared to learn how to play piano and do a lot of "Do Re Mi" singing.

+1

I started my degree last year and this has been my experience down to a tee, but don't let it put you off you'll know if it's the right thing to do.

[BassChuck]

Originally Posted by Satchurio

.......My bass experience is limited to studying independently and practicing/jamming with friends on my own schedule over 3 years, assuming most of the students come directly from other schools, am I going to get walloped by prodigies when I walk in the door? I am always confident when im playing in my own space or with friends but have not had much experience with a wide array of musicians......

At the risk of being a real A$$ here, let me ask this. If this is your experience with music, why are you planning to spend the money and time for a degree? It seems to me that you should spend some time living the life of a professional musician (try to pay your bills with your bass playing). The reality of professional music is that you will have to teach in some capacity to make ends meet. You really need to spend some time thinking about your personal, musicial and professional goals. Find someone who is working as a player and talk to them.

As for your question about finding people at school who can play great. Yes.... you'll find them. And more of them than you can imagine. And there are a lot of music schools.

[Bruce Lindfield]

Originally Posted by Satchurio

http://www.sl.on.ca/_files/0965-DigArtsMus0809.pdf

There is PDF of the course description for anyone who is curious, I appreciate the feedback. I have a good understanding of music theory and how to apply concepts to bass but my ability to read sheet music is lacking currently, as its been about 7 or more years.

Well it says quite clearly in that pdf file, that a basic entry requirement is to be able to read treble and bass clef fluently...

[Freddels]

Originally Posted by Martin Bormann

Don't forget the hand signs for the solfege syllables. I always thought this stuff was pointless, but they insist on hand signs.

I never had to learn hand signals for solfege in college. That's the first I've every heard of it.

As far as sight reading, you could get to be a very proficient reader in a short period of time (6 months - 1 yr) if you work hard at it. It's not difficult but you need to work on it.

As far as music programs in Canada, one of my best friends is a music prof at St. Fx.

[jomahu]

Originally Posted by BassChuck

At the risk of being a real A$$ here, let me ask this. If this is your experience with music, why are you planning to spend the money and time for a degree? It seems to me that you should spend some time living the life of a professional musician (try to pay your bills with your bass playing). The reality of professional music is that you will have to teach in some capacity to make ends meet. You really need to spend some time thinking about your personal, musicial and professional goals. Find someone who is working as a player and talk to them.

As for your question about finding people at school who can play great. Yes.... you'll find them. And more of them than you can imagine. And there are a lot of music schools.

+1 living in berklee town, this question comes up a lot.

a degree, essentially, is a piece of paper. i dunno about canada, but in the US and other places, it's a very expensive piece of paper. be sure it'll be a good investment for you.

also, university is a business. if you can pay, you can go. if you can't, then you drop out, hence the large freshmen dropout rate at colleges.

if you are serious about music school, check out their faculty. the most important asset in these school is the contacts you can/will establish there. conduct yourself with skill, humility and professionalism, and you'll definitely see some results with the contacts you make.

at the end of the day, there's nothing at music school that you can't learn with private lessons.

[nickonbass]

Is music your life? If that's an easy question for you to answer then I'd go in and go in hard if I were you.

If you can't read too great ('how's your reading?') - then start reading everything you can get your hands on now - treble and bass cleff. If you put in the hours it'll start to happen. If you can't be bothered doing that then maybe there is something else you are more passionate about that you should be studying.

And like others have said - what do you want out of it - what do you see yourself doing (if you don't become the greatest bass player on earth) with music?

It's very important for you to think about these things because one day they will become your reality.

Best of luck.

[azureblue]

I played music for a long time before deciding to go to music school, in my case, Loyola New Orleans. i think my main reason was sitting at the bar after playing a long night & seeing how burnt the guitar player looked, and realizing that could be me, if I got stuck in the bar band life.

A few observations:
There will always be someone better than you. I lived in LA for a while and learned real quick that competent and dependable got the work, not the hot shots. Be yourself, musically.

Yes, you will need to read, and both clefs, if you want a leg up. You should know your basic chord theory, too, and be able to solo. You should also have good ears. Do all you can to find out what is taught in the 101 classes, and learn it BEFORE you go to school. Be prepared to work your ass off. I can't count the number of days I fell asleep with my bass in my hands, and had to wake myself up to finish my assignments.

Music school is boot camp. you will learn many things that you think are useless, only to find a place for them later in your career. I had to study solfeg and classical theory, but in the process, I was exposed to music I had never studied or played, and this has helped me a lot. That is what music school does- gives you a lot of tools and exposes you to a lot of different kinds of music. But here is the secret:

Music school is just as much about connections and proving your self as it is about learning. The improv classes do two things- obviously, they teach you how to improvise, but they show your teachers how well you can play, and this is most important. As you gain skills and prove your self, your teachers will hand you small gigs and how you do on them will open or shut doors for you. And you must network with other musicians- there have been countless successful bands that were formed in the practice halls.

Another tip- before you sign up, audit the classes you want to take. Find out who the teachers are and go hear them play, and ask about them. My two cents is that big music schools only benefit the top players, becasue the teachers do not have time for personal attention.

Be prepared to eat sleep and breathe music for four years. Pay attention at all times, both to what is being taught and to the other students and teachers. Try to learn beyond the classroom: My improv class was a dream, not becasue of the class itself, but because my bass teacher and the piano teacher who taught improve, also played together the night before. I would go hear them play, and ask questions about what they were doing in a particular song. Jazz theory is pretty dry, but when a great player shows you how it works in real life, it makes all the difference in the world. Yes you can learn scales & modes and arpeggios and mimic solos, but it don't mean crap until you can make it your own. And this is the truth abut music school- learning all that stuff and someehow internalizing it and making your own music.
Go to school. Ignore what people tell you and go to learn music. Stay focused and you will do fine.

Good luck.

And, if you want to study jazz, go to New Orleans. You will live it in the city that gave birth to it, and it will soak into your soul.

[DocBop]

In general the school doesn't matter its all about the student and their thirst for knowledge and willingness to work. IMO a school is just a resource the people teachers and student combine with resource to create environment that is there for you to take advantage of. If you just do your class work and pass your tests you will improve some. But you ask questions, play as much as possible, jam and hang with other serious musicians and dig into all the material sit in your shed and get it on your instrument you will learn a lot. That is true from a community college to a Berklee or MI its all about you.

[bassandbeyond]

You're probably getting more advice here than you bargained for! But it's all good food for thought.

Somebody mentioned that you could learn all the same information through either college or private lessons, and that's mostly true, but IMO the main advantages of a school environment are 1) the opportunity to get lots of ensemble experience playing with a variety of people, and 2) the broader perspective you'll get from a variety of teachers.

On the other hand, in private lessons you obviously get more individualized attention and tailored content.

[onlyclave]

Originally Posted by Satchurio

There is PDF of the course description for anyone who is curious, I appreciate the feedback. I have a good understanding of music theory and how to apply concepts to bass but my ability to read sheet music is lacking currently, as its been about 7 or more years.

I remember many years ago I was in a classroom with about 40 other people who were taking a music theory placement exam. As you finished, the faculty would come right over to your desk and look over your test and tell you if you should sign up for "Basic Music" or Theory I. I remember that a lot of people had the response of "Well yeah, it's been a long time since I had to read notes." Those guys weren't around second quarter.

This 2-year degree program looks more like something suited for video game production.

[Kyon`]

If you're really serious, start reading. Not just bass music but anything you can find in C and bass clef. Or even treble if you want to take it further. On that note, you can actually read Eb Alto Saxophone music without any sort of transposing, just need to know your keys.

There will always be someone better and their skill level will be really high but do not get discourage. Honestly if you could play Mustang Sally you're fine. Usually having a private teacher will do you loads of good as well.

Take as many music classes as you can right now, does your school offer jazz? Orchestra? You might even want to consider picking up a second instrument and joining band.

Also don't let a hard day, something difficult get you down. I'm probably sure it took Jaco a few tumbles before he got to his level. Practice, and make sure you practice what you need to. Also listen to more music, stuff you'd never listen to before. Classical, Metal, Gospel, even hip hop. And you know have fun, though to be honest, pretty much I can say I only had fun the start of each semester XD.

[Satchurio]

Thanks a ton for the replies and all the feedback! As onlyclave said this course is a hybrid focus on music and digital art which is why I began looking at it as a possible stepping stone to a full-time music program. I have no problem with hard work and don't foresee learning to read music as an immovable barrier.

As far as goals, i would ultimately like to open a music shop before the end of the next decade; I have spent the majority of the last few years out of school working in the IT field independently and love the freedom that comes with opening your own business. Computers have simply become a workhorse for me as a way to pay the bills and I would love to shift my focus to kill two birds with one stone.

[davidjbass]

My advice to you is that you don't to go to music college. Go to college for something that will guarantee you a job. Which the music industry does not. I know. My dad told me to get a degree in something that I could fall back on but I didn't listen to him and went to BIT in L.A. and Berklee College of Music in Boston. And believe me when I tell you trying to make a living in the music business is a very hard thing to do. Unless you become one of the very lucky few it's a long rough road. I wish I had listen to my father. If you have a degree in something that will gainfully employ you then you will have security. And not worrying about if your not gigging you wont' have a paycheck.

I play in a coverband, teach and d.j. events. And I am busy. But I have a real hard time covering my bills every month. If I had a degree in something besides music say finances I could have a regular job and not worry about money as much.

And I could concentrate on doing original songs instead of covers. As you probrably know performing original songs does not make you any money unless your famous.

I don't want discourage you from a life in music because it can be a wonderful thing and I encourage all my students to use music as a form of fun and enjoyment. But you have to be realistic about how you are going to make a living.

A good friend and musician told me a long time ago that once you start relying on music to make a living all the fun goes out of it. And it's true. Especially in todays economy.

I am not trying to sound bitter because I am not. I enjoy what I do and it does have it rewards. But I just want you to see the reality of a world in the music business. You can always do music. Just cover you tail end if you know what I mean. Good luck on what you do.