Harmonics Sound Very Low(as in volume)

bassist 4 life · #1 05-26-2006, 08:18 AM

Hey, whenever I play harmonics, their volume is reaaaaaaally low, theres more finger noise than harmonics, this can get very frustrating when I'm playing faster pieces with more harmonics(portrait of tracy), all you here is "tuck tuck tuck tuck" just like a muted note.

See attachment if you odnt undertsand.

Juneau · #2 05-26-2006, 08:29 AM

Sounds like your just not getting the harmonics to ring from the mp3. You might try playing more over the bridge pickup, and maybe mess around with moving your fretted finger one way or the other just a bit as they arent always where they should be exactly.

Bruce Lindfield · #3 05-26-2006, 08:34 AM

Accuracy is the big thing for getting harmonics to ring out - remember it's about subdidving working string length and not where frets happen to be!!

bassist 4 life · #4 05-26-2006, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Juneau

Sounds like your just not getting the harmonics to ring from the mp3. You might try playing more over the bridge pickup, and maybe mess around with moving your fretted finger one way or the other just a bit as they arent always where they should be exactly.

No its not from the mp3, it also happens when I'm playing through headphones or the amp. Oh, and I dont have a bridge pickup.

Juneau · #5 05-26-2006, 08:46 AM

I didnt mean that the mp3 caused it, I meant that it sounded from the mp3, that you werent hitting the harmonics correctly.

And not having a bridge pickup is likely part of your problem. Harmonics create a node in the string, and if the node is over your pickup, then you get no sound. The bridge pickup is a lot less likely to have a node over it, which is why harmonics ring better when played over it. On my bass with two pickups, my harmonics ring best with both pickups in series as both pickups have some more volume in general, and if a node is over one pickup, its likely not over the other, so they almost always come through. A buddy of mine with an old P-bass could not get harmonics to ring hardly at all because most of the harmonics had a node over the single pickup, so was no place to pickup the sound of the vibrating portion of the string.

Bruce Lindfield · #6 05-26-2006, 09:18 AM

I'm not sure about that...

I've managed to get loud harmonics on P basses as long as the strings aren't dead - it's just accuracy!

I can get loud ringing harmonics on my unamplified DB, so I don't believe pickups, ncessarily have anything to do with it!

Juneau · #7 05-26-2006, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce Lindfield

I'm not sure about that...

I've managed to get loud harmonics on P basses as long as the strings aren't dead - it's just accuracy!

I can get loud ringing harmonics on my unamplified DB, so I don't believe pickups, ncessarily have anything to do with it!

Getting harmonics on an unamplified instrument doesnt apply here. If your using a pickup to get your sound in an electric instrument, then where that pickup is will absolutely affect your harmonics (and tone). You may hear the harmonic unamplified on the electric, but if there is a node over the pickup, you will not get an amplified sound from it. After all, the part of the string over the pickup is not vibrating. Unamplified, nodes dont cancle your sound since the sound travels through the whole instrument.

And I did say PART of the problem. They will come through on a P-bass, with newer strings, but it requires a lot more accuracy than a bass with two pickups, or just a bridge pickup, and IMO, they will never ring quite as nicely or with as much tone. Also, from my example, I was talking about a beat to hell 76 P-bass, that had low output to begin with, and played like a dog with its setup anyhow. On that instrument, no amount of accuracy helped several of the harmonics to ring. Some of them came through of course, like 7th and 12th fret harmonics as those arent as likely to create nodes over a neck pickup.

pocketmonster · #8 05-26-2006, 10:36 AM

General tips for sounding harmonics:
(For simplicity we'll assume left hand is stopping the string, right is plucking)

New strings > old strings (this one is a big deal)

Bridge pickup > neck pickup (neck pickups tend to have more "thud" and less "ring")

Active > passive (active, on average, has stronger high frequency response)

Left finger: Narrow finger touch (tips) > Broad finger touch (pads) Release the finger immediately as the harmonic sounds. Otherwise the finger turns into a mute.

Right finger: Sharp attack (fingernail or pick) > dull attack (finger pad) If you use normal fingerstyle, pluck quickly and try not to deflect the string very far to minimize "thud."

Finally, for songs like Portrait of Tracy, considering EQ'ing especially for the song. Cut or boost to bring out what you want to hear. Playing this song on my Bongo with new strings, active pickups (bridge only), and 4-band EQ is insane. Jaco may have considered switching from Fender.

If anyone is interested, Sterling Ball demonstrates the Bongo harmonics at this site: (Bongo video)
http://www.guitarcenter.com/events/musicman/

Edit: Plucking closer to bridge > Plucking closer to neck (I knew I'd forget one)

Cristo · #9 05-26-2006, 11:42 AM

+1 to all the techniques mentioned in the last post.

Also, use of compression can bring out harmonics as well since you will be able to boost level.

This of course means you have to approve of using compression, which does not work for some folks.

bassist 4 life · #10 05-26-2006, 11:57 AM

Thanks for your replies people! I will do as you said, and I'l post a clip to show you the difference!

-Sam- · #11 05-28-2006, 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pocketmonster

General tips for sounding harmonics:
(For simplicity we'll assume left hand is stopping the string, right is plucking)

New strings > old strings (this one is a big deal)

Bridge pickup > neck pickup (neck pickups tend to have more "thud" and less "ring")

Active > passive (active, on average, has stronger high frequency response)

Left finger: Narrow finger touch (tips) > Broad finger touch (pads) Release the finger immediately as the harmonic sounds. Otherwise the finger turns into a mute.

Right finger: Sharp attack (fingernail or pick) > dull attack (finger pad) If you use normal fingerstyle, pluck quickly and try not to deflect the string very far to minimize "thud."

Finally, for songs like Portrait of Tracy, considering EQ'ing especially for the song. Cut or boost to bring out what you want to hear. Playing this song on my Bongo with new strings, active pickups (bridge only), and 4-band EQ is insane. Jaco may have considered switching from Fender.

If anyone is interested, Sterling Ball demonstrates the Bongo harmonics at this site: (Bongo video)
http://www.guitarcenter.com/events/musicman/

Edit: Plucking closer to bridge > Plucking closer to neck (I knew I'd forget one)

i agree completly with all of these and just wanna add that in terms of right hand in PoT you might wanna try raking alot of the time. less string contact time and IMO more tone from the pads of the finger

ras1983 · #12 05-28-2006, 04:58 AM

its already been said several times, but your technique is definately a major problem. how do we know? because we had the same thuddy noise before our accuracy improved. i'm assuming that the harmonics in te recording were all open string harmonics, since i don't know that else to call them. i.e. i'm assuming there are no false harmonics.

if that's the case, make sure your accuracy is 100%, because the strings can ony be touched at very specific regions to get the clear ringing harmonic.

AND, they do NOT always line up with the frets.

p.s. i once saw a guy doing all sorts of harmonics on his upright acoustic. absolutely mind boggling.