Have scales ruined music?

[Manuel101]

So i was watching a Carol Haye video were she says that during the old days musicians would say, "dont hire that bass player, he plays scales." She said something along the lines that when you try to play using scales you limit yourself. I am not sure i understand what she means, can anybody shed some light here, the video is in youtube (i am at work right now and i cant access yoututbe from work).

[stflbn]

Scales haven't existed in Classical music for a long long time?

I think it's more the thinking that a bassist should play reserved and root related parts and only straying when instructed to do so.

[Fretless1!]

Carol Kaye believes you should play and think in terms of chords instead of scales.

[Kwesi]

Absolutely! Damn their CENTURIES of existence and their facilitation of organization and structure in written music.

[kreider204]

And then some:

Plato's ideas about musical modes

[williamk]

it's complete BS, from A to Z. I myself am not sure what se could possibly have meant by that statement...but I'm hoping it came out wrong or something because it makes absolutely no sense.

[williamk]

Originally Posted by Fretless1!

Carol Kaye believes you should play and think in terms of chords instead of scales.

that doesn't really make sense to me either...is there really a difference?

[Audiophage]

She's talking more about an approach to improvisation where you're thinking more in terms of arpeggios and approach notes vs a purely scalar perspective. She didn't say that scales have "ruined" music, they're obviously one of the many building blocks of music.

I swear that she and Jeff Berlin must be the most misinterpreted musians around.

[billyfalconer]

Why is this in the Basses forum?

[cabcreaser]

Carol does take a more chordal approach. I think she is warning against the "square" quality of simply moving up and down scales particularly when walking. Chromatic approach notes to chord tones add tension and an overall feeling of movement and targeting chord tones particularly roots, thirds, and fifths defines the harmony while leaving space for the comping and the melody.

By the way, roundwound bass strings ruined music . . . That's a joke for those that don't know

[57pbass]

No....they are a critical part of the language of music.....

[T-Bird]

Hi.

Originally Posted by Fretless1!

Carol Kaye believes you should play and think in terms of chords instead of scales.

Originally Posted by williamk

that doesn't really make sense to me either...is there really a difference?

^This.

Well I'm pretty clueless when it comes down to theory, but doesn't everybody play their lines based on chords and scales?

Regards
Sam

[spade2you]

To play a good walking bass part, one must understand scales, but you're not just playing scales when you're doing a proper walking bass line.

[williamk]

I'm not clueless at all when it comes to music theory and this makes no sense to me. I'm pretty sure what she meant is not exactly what she said.

[Tampabass]

fishy

[lfmn16]

Have scales ruined music? NO, the way some people use them can ruin music.

[genericusername]

Has engineering ruined making stuff?

[Chunk-O-Funk]

It depends on what you're playing but these scales are only a tool in your toolbox. You really can't play in different styles in chord changes until you learn your scales.

It was probably really obvious what that particular bassets was trying to achieve. He was probably playing in modes.

[BassmanSBK]

Originally Posted by Fretless1!

Carol Kaye believes you should play and think in terms of chords instead of scales.

Precisely. If you are playing a G-major blues, you cannot start start wanking around the G scale, as if anything in the scale fit at any time. Rather, you need to play G chord tones over the I chord, C over the IV chord, D over V chord--using appropriate passing tones between chords.

Yes, yes, I know that "The chords come from the scale. You have to know the scale to know the chords." True, and Carol wouldn't disagree. But when you are playing over the I chord in a G-major blues, pedaling a C sounds like ass. Yes, it is in the scale, but it is really only a passing tone from B to D.

That's what Carol Kaye means. And, it (like just about everything she says) is really good advice.

[chaosMK]

Originally Posted by Manuel101

during the old days

^ /thread