Hearing what notes are being hit

Mike151 · #1 01-01-2009, 10:50 AM

I was just listening to a group of songs that I'm going to be auditioning this weekend and was picturing the notes in my head A, D, C, B (just an example).
Then I thought what if I could play along with others by recognizing the notes they are playing instead of looking at their hands? I can easily hit an A in my head as I have used this for tuning my A string prior to tuning the rest of my string by ear. I can't believe that I haven't thought of this earlier but maybe it was because of the genre that I had been playing.
I would like to be able to hear a song playing on the radio and be able to identify "ah,, that is G, C, A" (no bass in hand). Is this a common aquired talent or is this something that is difficult to master?
Any suggestions, experience, practice exercises, etc would be greatly appreciated.

CatfishStudios · #2 01-01-2009, 11:01 AM

This is a quite common thing...I call it "the ear" ...really...no sarcasm...some musicians have "the ear" and some dont..I play by "the ear" alone really. You can develop "the ear" through practice and time. Some people who do have the ear do not have perfect pitch recognition...there are some test online that can help you improve...some people are born with the ear AND perfect pitch.....I call them ..bastards.

megadan · #3 01-01-2009, 11:05 AM

It's very much doable; like anything else it's just a matter of practice. It's just like tuning, except you have to be a lot faster. Slide to every note on a fretless

pin_head_47 · #4 01-01-2009, 11:15 AM

It's definitely something you can develop with practice, but it goes beyond just recognizing a note - you should also be able to pick out what type of chord is being played, possibly the key that you're in, etc. Also remember that you don't need to know every exact pitch; it's more important to know how the notes sound in relation to each other. For example, If you can figure out the progression, which isn't all that hard, then you only need to know one pitch for sure, really, and then you can figure the rest out.

If you keep at it, it will help you immensely when learning new songs. You'll be able to learn them a heck of alot quicker. Unfortunately, most of us "hobby" musicians don't have the time to dedicate to learning this, cause it really does take some serious work.

I believe Mozart was one of those guys that could pick out the pitch of just about anything. He could hear a wheel squeaking on a cart as it went by and say, "Oh, yeah, that's a b flat two octaves above middle c." Crazy.

Joe Nerve · #5 01-01-2009, 11:15 AM

I've seen people do that with frightening accuracy. I think it's something that the ones who do it well are simply born with, although I'm sure it can also be developed. I can do it with some super simple stuff, but even though I consider myself to have a really good ear I'm not as good at it as I'd like to think.

Not all that long ago I actually practiced doing this in an hour long car ride. Had to learn some emo band's cover of Journey's Any Way You Want It and was absolutely certain I nailed the whole thing in my head and would be able to play it to perfection along with track when I got home. Wrong!

What I DID learn from this experience though is that you can absolutely practice without a bass in hand. Although I was wrong in some of what I thought I was hearing it was fixed instantly once I picked up the bass, and I was able to nail the entire thing in one playthrough. I was able to get close enough and at the very least nail the structure, rhythm, changes - pretty much everything but the perfect notes.

I've a feeling one of those perfect pitch courses would help with this. Or a sight singing course.

rarisgod · #6 01-01-2009, 11:28 AM

I recognize notes that I play a lot, like at school we play in the key of Bb a lot, so I usually can pick out a Bb. Meanwhile, I can often pick out E, A, D, and G, because of the obvious reason that those are my open strings. I noticed that recently too so it's funny you should post about this. Though I'm not too great at it yet.

Deacon_Blues · #7 01-01-2009, 11:39 AM

Transcribe, Transcribe, Transcribe. Play along to songs you're not familiar with. You'll probably develop a decent relative pitch over time, which is pretty much your goal. It won't come quickly or easily, but gradually if you keep doing it.

Michael Case · #8 01-01-2009, 11:39 AM

A lot of good advice so far, I think Joe's example of trying to figure out a song without the bass is really good. It's like an exercise my old double bass teacher gave me. It goes like this, find a horn solo (I used Lester Young) and practice singing along to the solo at half speed. As you learn the solo increase the speed until you're at tempo. All the while the goal is to hear no difference between your voice and the solo playing. Once you are able to sing the solo you then try to learn the solo on your bass. Ultimately you should try playing it from your head, but that could also be a long term goal. Now days I try to listen to and sing anything song I am learning, get the sounds in my head, then pick it up on the bass from my head, then check it with the recording.

I think that this skill can be developed, just like playing the bass. Personally, I know just from playing music for many years I have developed an ear.

Happy New Year!

Mike151 · #9 01-01-2009, 11:46 AM

Ah, just had another thought that might be helpful.
I used to be troubled when I wouldn't forget the name of a person that I had just met no more than a few minutes ago. So I developed a technique that would help me out with this. I would reach out, shake the persons hand, and say their name. For instance Scott. I would then recall all of the Scotts that I had ever met or known of and put this guy in the same virtual memory box in my head. So I have all these circles or boxes in my head that have all the steve's, mike's, jeff's, etc.
Hmm... Maybe this could apply to this particular subject.
So, I started imagining all the songs I could think of that used E as the primary first note or major chord and started putting them in that box together in my head.
This might just be helpful to me and I'm amused that it never crossed my mind before. As I take my wife to lunch, I will be actually practicing in my head. shhhh!

Mike151 · #10 01-01-2009, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Case

A lot of good advice so far, I think Joe's example of trying to figure out a song without the bass is really good. It's like an exercise my old double bass teacher gave me. It goes like this, find a horn solo (I used Lester Young) and practice singing along to the solo at half speed. As you learn the solo increase the speed until you're at tempo. All the while the goal is to hear no difference between your voice and the solo playing. Once you are able to sing the solo you then try to learn the solo on your bass. Ultimately you should try playing it from your head, but that could also be a long term goal. Now days I try to listen to and sing anything song I am learning, get the sounds in my head, then pick it up on the bass from my head, then check it with the recording.

I think that this skill can be developed, just like playing the bass. Personally, I know just from playing music for many years I have developed an ear.

Happy New Year!

I'll work on this. Please note that the kids already have to put up with my bass playing shaking the entire house like a speaker box, but now they are going to have to listen to me sing. Oh the humanity!

Michael Case · #11 01-01-2009, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike151

I'll work on this. Please note that the kids already have to put up with my bass playing shaking the entire house like a speaker box, but now they are going to have to listen to me sing. Oh the humanity!

I think that's the hardest part, getting over the fear of singing. That was a big step for me, kind of an emotional/fear thing that I had to deal with. Music and therapy rolled up in one.

The thing about this exercise is you don't have to be so loud. You can do it in a low voice as long as you hear yourself.

Deacon_Blues · #12 01-01-2009, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike151

Ah, just had another thought that might be helpful.
I used to be troubled when I wouldn't forget the name of a person that I had just met no more than a few minutes ago. So I developed a technique that would help me out with this. I would reach out, shake the persons hand, and say their name. For instance Scott. I would then recall all of the Scotts that I had ever met or known of and put this guy in the same virtual memory box in my head. So I have all these circles or boxes in my head that have all the steve's, mike's, jeff's, etc.
Hmm... Maybe this could apply to this particular subject.
So, I started imagining all the songs I could think of that used E as the primary first note or major chord and started putting them in that box together in my head.

Hmm... I'd skip that last idea. Instead, try to learn all kinds of different chord progressions by ear, and as much music theory as you can. Start by reading this thread if you're new to music theory.

EDIT:
What I mean by learning chord progressions is how does e.g. an A major chord sound after an E major, or an E major after a B7? C#min after E major? Or whatever chord progression you want. These are things you have to learn to be able to play along to songs and transcribe, and it will come by time if you start with simple songs first and gradually advance as you get better.

mwiles30 · #13 01-01-2009, 12:11 PM

Even if you can't figure out how to recognize particular notes by ear alone, you can still learn to recognize intervals by ear (which is a hell of a lot easier and practical), and then all you need is a starting pitch. With this skill you're actually a lot further along than most people.

millsbass5 · #14 01-01-2009, 12:12 PM

It actually comes pretty easy to me.I can pretty much tune my bass dead on w/out a tuner.Actually,I do it all the time.I will detune my bass,then tune it by ear,check it w/a tuner to see how accurate I am.

Mike151 · #15 01-01-2009, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deacon_Blues

Hmm... I'd skip that last idea. Instead, try to learn all kinds of different chord progressions by ear, and as much music theory as you can. Start by reading this thread if you're new to music theory.

Thanks Deacon,
I began reading that thread and almost immediately got snowed over by the amount of information. I have absolutely no theory experience at all and this is one of my major downfalls. I recognized the G major chord right off the bat and know my notes on the neck but after that, it was all very confusing. I have pretty good playing technique, proper finger positioning, good picking fingers, and strong timing. When it comes time to play something I don't know live, I'm stumped and always end up just holding down the rythm of the root note with a couple nonsense riffs that are probably not even in the right key. Honesty on this subject is very important to me as I want to grow and learn. This might just be something that I need 1 on 1 instruction with unless someone can recommend a good online teacher or video on Theory.
All that being said, I can indeed play songs that I learn note for note well enough to play with experienced players as they really like my timing, accuracy, and attitude.

mwiles30 · #16 01-01-2009, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by millsbass5

It actually comes pretty easy to me.I can pretty much tune my bass dead on w/out a tuner.Actually,I do it all the time.I will detune my bass,then tune it by ear,check it w/a tuner to see how accurate I am.

You, my friend, have an enviable ability.

E2daGGurl · #17 01-01-2009, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mwiles30

You, my friend, have an enviable ability.

A rare ability, too.

Although, people with perfect pitch aren't all happy about it - nor does it guarantee you'll be a great musician. It tends to run in families and is likely partly (or maybe entirely) genetic. There's a test at that link to see if you have it.

Most people who have it seem to have enhanced musical abilities and very much enjoy having it. I personally don't think you can train yourself to have absolute or perfect pitch to the degree that those born with it do - they are fortunate. Some people train and train and come close - the rest of us just use a keyboard or other tuning device.

Developing relative pitch doesn't come automatically for people with perfect pitch, although it may come easier to them.

There's software training for doing either one, and some people do manage to train themselves to have perfect pitch after a lot of effort. I do not, myself, believe that every person is able to learn it, though.

Here's a fun list of famous musicians thought to have perfect pitch.. Brian Wilson is sometimes mentioned as a guy whose perfect pitch got him into perfectionist-hell - but I think it was also his personality.

Mike151 · #18 01-01-2009, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E2daGGurl

A rare ability, too.

Although, people with perfect pitch aren't all happy about it - nor does it guarantee you'll be a great musician. It tends to run in families and is likely partly (or maybe entirely) genetic. There's a test at that link to see if you have it.

That was depressing! I have no clue what any of those tones are. Anybody else try it? I don't want to feel alone here.

ha

Deacon_Blues · #19 01-01-2009, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike151

That was depressing! I have no clue what any of those tones are. Anybody else try it? I don't want to feel alone here.

ha

If it makes you feel any better, I scored terribly on that test as well. I knew I was going to. If you don't have perfect pitch you will fail that test. Most of the people here would also fail it. Your best bet is to develop a relative pitch, which can be at least as useful.

Fergie Fulton · #20 01-01-2009, 04:57 PM

If you try some blues classics you'll find that once you become familier with the formats you can hear and learn the songs with out going near your bass. As blues jams are common you will have a chance to try out this and apply it, thats where i'd start, at the simplest end of the spectrum.

PS. learn the terminology of Blues structures, like Uptown mid tempo shuffle, G, 1-4-1-5, standard turnaround.