Help with some musical theory please

[ImakenoiseGood]

Hi,
I've been playing bass for one year now, and from playing with other bassists I can hold my own playing with more veteran players. I'm not as heavily interested in playing tabs like the band exactly, I'm more into learning riffs and the chords and really making songs more of my own, not just being a robot bassist playing the other bassist's basslines. I have learned a lot of music theory from my teacher, and my own personal studies. http://tb1.talkbasscdn.com/smilies/help.gif heres where I need help. If a guitarist is playing a song i can identify the roots of the chord progression. Usually I ask what mode and scale the song is based on. My question is how, using my ears and eyes, can I figure out the mode? thanks ahead of time

[cjmodulus]

This would probably be better off in the 'general instruction' forum.
Also, try the website goodear.com
Free ear training exercises. If you start with the intervals and progressively move up, you'll be able to identify the series of intervals that constitute various modes.
I'm not affiliated with the site, but it is a great resource.
Hope this helped.
Edit- not sure I typed the sites name right. Just google 'good ear' and you'll find it.

[JimmyM]

Forget the modes. Just learn the chords and that will tell you all you need to know. Modes are fun and all, but I find them totally useless on a gig. Why?

1. You limit yourself to 7 notes where the chord allows for using all 12.

2. People who play using modes sound like they're running scales, which they are, and it always sounds very boring.

3. It's just one more layer of translation you have to go through when you get music with the chords written out. You see a chord and you know what notes are in it, what the strong notes are in the chromatic scale, what the weak notes are, etc., and you're good to go immediately. But when you see a chord and you think modally, then you not only have to remember what chord it is but what modes you can play over it.

Play chordally, not modally.

[Mushroo]

Unless you are playing bass for Miles Davis, songs are not "based on modes." Follow the roots of the chord progression and you'll be OK. As your ear improves you might hear other notes you can add to embellish. But no bass player has ever been fired for following the guitar player and playing the chord progression!

[groooooove]

not all music requires you to be thinking in modes. as stated above- miles, yeah, modal stuff. rock / funk, it doesent matter. songs are either major or minor- sometimes mixolydian based, but on the whole you can think of it as major. just with a flat 7th scale degree, in this case.

you dont need to "figure out what mode" a tune is in. if you can figure out the root and quality of the chords, your next step should be to turn them into roman numberals- if the chords are G, Emin, Amin, D7, thats I vi ii V in G. modes should come much later, when you get into jazz and higher-level improvisation.

[Mushroo]

As an example, here are chords to Nirvana's "Smells Like Teen Spirit" (one of the first songs I learned to play on bass):

F5 Bb5
Ab5 Db5

Are you going to play one mode throughout, or are you going to play the roots of the chords?

[cjmodulus]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Forget the modes. Just learn the chords and that will tell you all you need to know. Modes are fun and all, but I find them totally useless on a gig. Why?

1. You limit yourself to 7 notes where the chord allows for using all 12.

2. People who play using modes sound like they're running scales, which they are, and it always sounds very boring.

3. It's just one more layer of translation you have to go through when you get music with the chords written out. You see a chord and you know what notes are in it, what the strong notes are in the chromatic scale, what the weak notes are, etc., and you're good to go immediately. But when you see a chord and you think modally, then you not only have to remember what chord it is but what modes you can play over it.

Play chordally, not modally.

All of this is very true. That's pretty much been my approach since I started writing my own lines. While it is (IMO) important to have an understanding of modes, playing chordally gives you more options.

[John Wentzien]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Forget the modes. Just learn the chords and that will tell you all you need to know. Modes are fun and all, but I find them totally useless on a gig. Why?

1. You limit yourself to 7 notes where the chord allows for using all 12.

2. People who play using modes sound like they're running scales, which they are, and it always sounds very boring.

3. It's just one more layer of translation you have to go through when you get music with the chords written out. You see a chord and you know what notes are in it, what the strong notes are in the chromatic scale, what the weak notes are, etc., and you're good to go immediately. But when you see a chord and you think modally, then you not only have to remember what chord it is but what modes you can play over it.

Play chordally, not modally.

This!

[Pacman]

All good advice here, including putting this in General Instruction.

Watch the closing door.

[bassybill]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

... the chord allows for using all 12.

That sounds like the sort of chord my band's brass section plays when they're meant to be in unison.