Here is my basic understanding of chord progressions. Is it right?

[aarono]

Let's assume we're talking in the key of C.

I know the chord progression formula is:

I. Major
II. Minor
III. Minor
IV. Major
V. Major
VI. Minor
VII. Diminished

Let's assume a song has a I-V-VI-IV progression.

So the chords would be Cmaj-Gmaj-Aminor-Fmaj (I assume this is correct, correct me if I'm wrong)

Now as a bass player let's say we're told to write a bass line. This is where I'm confused. I know we could simply play the Root-Fifth of each chord so for Cmaj we could play C-G, and so forth.

If we want to make it interesting are there any general rules one should follow? Or can you pretty much play any note of the key we're in? Do bass lines generally follow triads much like how chords are built?

We know that A is the 6th degree of a C major scale but isn't in a Cmajor chord. Would a note like this fit as long as it's still in the key of the song we're playing?

[FretlessMainly]

Originally Posted by aarono

Now as a bass player let's say we're told to write a bass line. This is where I'm confused.

Unfortunately, you are confused earlier than that, but you're close. In any Major key, the seven chords that can be built of each scale degree are:

I. Major7
II. minor7
III. minor7
IV. Major7
V. Dominant7
VI. minor7
VII. minor7(b5)

So, your I V VI IV example in C Major would be:

| CMaj7 | G7 | Amin7 | FMaj7 |

[Mushroo]

Originally Posted by aarono

Let's assume a song has a I-V-VI-IV progression.

So the chords would be Cmaj-Amaj-Bmin-Gmaj (I assume this is correct, correct me if I'm wrong)

Nope.

1=C
2=D
3=E
4=F
5=G
6=A
7=B

So I-V-vi-IV in the key of C is C, G, Amin, F.

(note that I used lower-case roman numerals for minor chords)

The best way to learn this stuff is to listen to your favorite songs and analyze what the bass player does.

Turn on the radio and I bet you can hear lots of songs using I-V-vi-IV.

[aarono]

Ouch, I should of proofread my post. I made a big blunder there.

So as for picking out notes to accompany the chord is there really any limitations or is anything that's in key pretty much fair game? Sure you would like to outline the chords but are there really any "wrong" notes?

For the most part does it make sense to play within the chords? I.E. outline the chords using their Root-3rd-5th-7th.

[Mushroo]

Originally Posted by aarono

Ouch, I should of proofread my post. I made a big blunder there.

So as for picking out notes to accompany the chord is there really any limitations or is anything that's in key pretty much fair game? Sure you would like to outline the chords but are there really any "wrong" notes?

Yes there are "wrong" notes, no to "anything... is fair game."
What are your 3 favorite songs with I-V-vi-IV progression and what does the bass player play?

Here is one to get you started: "With or Without You" by U2. I-V-vi-IV in the key of D. Bassist Adam Clayton plays the roots using steady 8th notes and very little variation/embellishment. It was U2's first #1 single in the US.

[aarono]

As a player who's gone primarily from reading tabs to starting to use my imagination I believe I'm progressing by leaps and bounds but you must forgive my ignorance.

In the U2 song you just mentioned, I do see that he just does root changes. If Adam had wanted to he could of added 3rds, no?

Perhaps D-D-F#-F#-A-A-C#-C#-B-B-D-D-G-G-B-B

[Mushroo]

Originally Posted by aarono

As a player who's gone primarily from reading tabs to starting to use my imagination I believe I'm progressing by leaps and bounds but you must forgive my ignorance.

In the U2 song you just mentioned, I do see that he just does root changes. If Adam had wanted to he could of added 3rds, no?

Perhaps D-D-F#-F#-A-A-C#-C#-B-B-D-D-G-G-B-B

Exactly! You got it.

Another good tip is to listen to the vocals, try to sneak in some non-root tones during pauses in the lyrics or transitions between sections of the song.

[MalcolmAmos]

Originally Posted by aarono

Now as a bass player let's say we're told to write a bass line. This is where I'm confused. I know we could simply play the Root-Fifth of each chord so for Cmaj we could play C-G, and so forth.

If we want to make it interesting are there any general rules one should follow? Or can you pretty much play any note of the key we're in? Do bass lines generally follow triads much like how chords are built?

We know that A is the 6th degree of a C major scale but isn't in a Cmajor chord. Would a note like this fit as long as it's still in the key of the song we're playing?

OK from the top.

For the melody line (the tune) and the chord line (your bass line) to sound good together both of them should share some like notes. How many notes? One per bar is all that is necessary, two are better and three are probably not needed. So.......

If you are playing from sheet music the song writer has already decided what chord is needed to harmonize this specific portion of the melody - and all you need to do is follow the chords and play one or two of the chords notes in your bass line. If you are not playing from sheet music and you are composing your bass line - just take into consideration YOU need to have some shared notes in play. Not going to get into the structure of a chord progression, i.e. what chords like to move to what other chords. If you are needing this just ask.

Problem comes up with how many notes need to be played. In 4/4 time you need four quarter notes to a bar, or two half notes to a bar, etc. (lets not get into rests and rhythm).

So look to the chord for what the notes can be and then chose the ones you need. Most of the time this is dictated by the tempo of the song - how much room (time) do you have before the song goes off and leaves you.

Until you know more -- root on the first beat - gets you harmonization anything more is gravy. If you like gravy spoon it on.

Root first then look to the 5. Need more the 8 is safe. Need more the correct 3 & 7 will work. The 2, 4 and 6 are all that are left. The 2 & 4 are passing notes and should be treated as such - passing notes, don't accent them, don't spend a lot of time on them and don't land on them. The 6 is "kinda" neutral and goes well with major chords (R-3-5-6).

The following may help.

Major Scale Box. 

G|---2---|-------|---3---|---4---| 1st string
D|---6---|-------|---7---|---8---|
A|---3---|---4---|-------|---5---|
E|-------|---R---|-------|---2---|4th string

Basic Chords
• Major Triad = R-3-5
• Minor Triad = R-b3-5
• Diminished Chord = R-b3-b5
7th Chords
• Maj7 = R-3-5-7
• Minor 7 = R-b3-5-b7
• Dominant 7 = R-3-5-b7
• ½ diminished = R-b3-b5-b7
• Full diminished = R-b3-b5-bb7
See a chord and play it's chord tones. As every key will have three major, three minor and one diminished chord it's a good idea to get your major (R-3-5-7), minor (R-b3-5-b7) and diminished (R-b3-b5-b7) bass line chord tones into muscle memory so when you see a chord your fingers just know what will work. Now the song may only give you enough room for the root, or root five - adapt and get as many chord tones into your bass line as needed. Root on 1 and a steady groove from the other chord tones plus something to call attention to the chord change will keep you gigging.

[JTE]

A. I maintain that there are no wrong notes, only wrong resolutions. A b5 works against a major chord quite nicely if it resolves correctly. It depends on the melody, the feel, the rhythmic placement, and what note comes before and after the b5. So, in a very real and practical sense any note IS OK.

B. Having said that, there are of course notes that generally work better than others. In the given example, the key point is that all the chords are from a single diatonic major scale. That means any note from that scale can work (again, depending on context).

Understanding that the notes are in the same key is critical. And to go beyond that, I think it's vital that people not only memorize that I and IV are major 7, ii, iii, and vi are minor 7, V is dominant 7, and vii is minor 7 b5 or half-diminished (BTW, it's NOT "diminished" if you go beyond the triad!!). Learn WHY it is that way. Learn that by searching for "harmonized scale" so I don't retype it all again.

Then you'll clearly see how the chords relate to each other. Now, what's the bass's job? No matter the "style" or "genre" (terrible terms), the bass function is always the same and it's always two-fold. To DEFINE THE HARMONY and to CONNECT THE RHYTHM WITH THE HARMONY AND MELODY. So if you know the harmony (i.e. you KNOW that the progression is ii V I in C and then moves to a ii V I in G) you'll KNOW how those first three chords are interrelated and how the second three are similarly related. That gives you powerful and easy to grasp knowledge of what notes will work under those chords to help you achieve the "define the harmony" part of the gig.

John

[aarono]

What is the best thing I can do at this point?

Learn the 1-3-5-7 of every chord? I think my bass instructor wants me to do this, we've only had one lesson thus far and I think he thought I was more advanced in theory than I am so I was a bit confused as to what he wanted me to study.

[rydin4lifebass]

Originally Posted by aarono

As a player who's gone primarily from reading tabs to starting to use my imagination I believe I'm progressing by leaps and bounds but you must forgive my ignorance.

In the U2 song you just mentioned, I do see that he just does root changes. If Adam had wanted to he could of added 3rds, no?

Perhaps D-D-F#-F#-A-A-C#-C#-B-B-D-D-G-G-B-B

Would the third bar of that be B-B-D-D or B-B-D#-D# ? Just wanted to clarify since the third of B is a D#, but the vi chord is D is the Bminor.

[Mushroo]

Originally Posted by aarono

What is the best thing I can do at this point?

The best thing you can do listenlistenlisten. I was serious about my challenge: Flip through your iPod and find 3 songs that use I-V-vi-IV. Now that you recognize the sound of this progression, it will start popping out of your speakers at you.

Originally Posted by rydin4lifebass

Would the third bar of that be B-B-D-D or B-B-D#-D# ? Just wanted to clarify since the third of B is a D#, but the vi chord is D is the Bminor.

There is no D# in the key of D. But even if you didn't know that theory, you could try it on the bass while you're playing along with the song, and your ear would tell you, right? As soon as you play that D#, it starts leading you somewhere else, somewhere away from D, to E maybe? Anyway always let your ear be your guide; theory is just a way of explaining what the ear already knows.

[JTE]

Originally Posted by aarono

What is the best thing I can do at this point?

Learn the 1-3-5-7 of every chord? I think my bass instructor wants me to do this, we've only had one lesson thus far and I think he thought I was more advanced in theory than I am so I was a bit confused as to what he wanted me to study.

Do you know the diatonic major scale? That means you can figure out the correct notes in any key (note that I didn't say you have 'em memorized, but can you figure them out). Without that learning a bunch of chords is just going to be more memory work and not productive learning. Once you know the major scale then work on figuring out chords.

You should know:
A major chord is 1, 3, 5
Minor is 1, b3, 5
7th is 1, 3, 5 b7
Major 7 is 1, 3, 5, 7
Minor 7 is 1, b3, 5, b7
Diminished is 1, b3, b5
Augmented is 1, 3, #5
Diminished 7 is 1, b3, b5, bb7 (and know WHY it's a double flat 7 and not called the 6th even though they're the same pitch)
half-diminished is 1, b3, b5, b7.

If you know those nine chords, and you know how to determine the correct notes in any key, then you can work out the notes in chords. And all of this is stuff you can do without a bass in your hands. I used to work these exercises in my head while on the bus to class or to work. "What are the notes in an Ab min7?"

"Well, it's 1, b3, 5, b7 of Ab", and Ab is Ab whole step to Bb, whole step to C, half step to Db, whole step to Eb, whole step to F, whole step to G, half step to Ab, so the Abmin7 is Ab (1), Cb (b3), Eb (5), and Gb (b7)."

John

[aarono]

Originally Posted by JTE

1. Do you know the diatonic major scale? That means you can figure out the correct notes in any key (note that I didn't say you have 'em memorized, but can you figure them out). Without that learning a bunch of chords is just going to be more memory work and not productive learning. Once you know the major scale then work on figuring out chords.

2. You should know:
A major chord is 1, 3, 5
Minor is 1, b3, 5
7th is 1, 3, 5 b7
Major 7 is 1, 3, 5, 7
Minor 7 is 1, b3, 5, b7
Diminished is 1, b3, b5
Augmented is 1, 3, #5
Diminished 7 is 1, b3, b5, bb7 (and know WHY it's a double flat 7 and not called the 6th even though they're the same pitch)
half-diminished is 1, b3, b5, b7.

If you know those nine chords, and you know how to determine the correct notes in any key, then you can work out the notes in chords. And all of this is stuff you can do without a bass in your hands. I used to work these exercises in my head while on the bus to class or to work. "What are the notes in an Ab min7?"

"Well, it's 1, b3, 5, b7 of Ab", and Ab is Ab whole step to Bb, whole step to C, half step to Db, whole step to Eb, whole step to F, whole step to G, half step to Ab, so the Abmin7 is Ab (1), Cb (b3), Eb (5), and Gb (b7)."

John

1. This is in reference to W-W-H-W-W-W-H right? If so yes I'm familiar with this. I know the 2nd mode of a scale goes W-H-W-W-W-H-W and so forth.

2. I can remember most of this stuff.

The best thing you can do listenlistenlisten. I was serious about my challenge: Flip through your iPod and find 3 songs that use I-V-vi-IV. Now that you recognize the sound of this progression, it will start popping out of your speakers at you.

My ear is terrible. Are there websites I can use to baby step my way up to figuring out chord progressions by ear? I've read that interval training is a solid first step. Advice?

[Mushroo]

Make a playlist of 20 or 30 songs with this progression and listen over and over. Even if you don't know the exact music theory terminology, you can hear they all have a similar "flavor," right? Once you get the sound in your head, you will hear it everywhere, I promise. Don't give up and say your ear is "terrible" because it is a skill you can practice and improve like any other skill. Drive around with the radio cranked and sing along to the classic rock station or the Glee soundtrack--singing is the best training for your ear! If you spend 1 week learning to recognize I-V-vi-IV songs (it's an easy progression to hear because it has 3 major and 1 minor chord), 1 week learning I-IV-V songs ("Louie Louie"), etc. learning 1 chord progression per week and you'll be a king of music theory with a fantastic ear.

[aarono]

Originally Posted by Mushroo

Make a playlist of 20 or 30 songs with this progression and listen over and over. Even if you don't know the exact music theory terminology, you can hear they all have a similar "flavor," right? Once you get the sound in your head, you will hear it everywhere, I promise. Don't give up and say your ear is "terrible" because it is a skill you can practice and improve like any other skill. Drive around with the radio cranked and sing along to the classic rock station or the Glee soundtrack--singing is the best training for your ear! If you spend 1 week learning to recognize I-V-vi-IV songs (it's an easy progression to hear because it has 3 major and 1 minor chord), 1 week learning I-IV-V songs ("Louie Louie"), etc. learning 1 chord progression per week and you'll be a king of music theory with a fantastic ear.

I promise I will find a ton of songs with this progression and listen to them and see how it develops.

[tjh]

Originally Posted by Mushroo

Make a playlist of 20 or 30 songs with this progression and listen over and over. Even if you don't know the exact music theory terminology, you can hear they all have a similar "flavor," right? Once you get the sound in your head, you will hear it everywhere, I promise. Don't give up and say your ear is "terrible" because it is a skill you can practice and improve like any other skill. Drive around with the radio cranked and sing along to the classic rock station or the Glee soundtrack--singing is the best training for your ear! If you spend 1 week learning to recognize I-V-vi-IV songs (it's an easy progression to hear because it has 3 major and 1 minor chord), 1 week learning I-IV-V songs ("Louie Louie"), etc. learning 1 chord progression per week and you'll be a king of music theory with a fantastic ear.

Louie Louie actually uses a rare minor v chord in the key of A major ... but you got the idea across

[JTE]

Originally Posted by aarono

1. This is in reference to W-W-H-W-W-W-H right? If so yes I'm familiar with this. I know the 2nd mode of a scale goes W-H-W-W-W-H-W and so forth.?

Being familiar ain't knowing. You gotta own that WWHWWWH. Don't worry about the modes until you have the major scale and the basic chords down.

John

[Mushroo]

Originally Posted by tjh

Louie Louie actually uses a rare minor v chord in the key of A major ... but you got the idea across

D'0h! Proof that a musician is never done learning!

[Snarf]

All this talk of 7th chords is unnecessary for the OP to know at this point in his development. Let him get the triads down first!

To the OP: To know how to write a bass line, you must first know how to play existing bass lines. Learn some songs, figure out the chords, analyze how the bass line relates to the chords. Can't do this stuff in a musical vacuum with only theory.