How do I tell what Key I'm in?

[Bassorama57]

Originally Posted by tpmiller08

Is the key im in simply the root note? Or is there something more complex and diabiloical im missing here?
-Troy

I'm not sure we ever actually answered your question..!
It was noted in here someplace that most basic rock follows a I-IV-V progression, and our Western ears (Arnold Schoenberg excepted) expect most music to "resolve" back to I, which is "usually" what key the tune is in. Eg, Louie, Louie in "G" would be G (I) C (IV) D (V). Nice thing about bass is the fretboard is laid out in a logical pattern, so if someone says "Nah, let's do Louie, Louis in 'A'" you can use the same fingerings two frets up without thinking about it.

Why is this stuff useful? I walked into a rehearsal last month and was given the bass chart for "Signed, Sealed, Delivered," written in "E," but of course everyone on the planet does it in "F," which is what the bandleader told us to do. Given about 2 minutes to look it over, and having a passing familiarity with the tune, rather than transcribe each note up a half step, I just looked at the patterns (decending major scale at intro, yada yada), and moved them up a half step.

[Billminpa]

Originally Posted by Richard Lindsey

Also, don't confuse "key signature" with "key."

The "key" refers to what is really happening harmonically. You figure this out by analyzing the harmony and melody. As Bruce's example showed, a song can be fundamentally in one key yet still take short jaunts into other keys. This is particularly common in jazz tunes of AABA form, where the song may modulate into another key temporarily at B but return to the initial key for the final A. Sometimes this type of modulation will be reflected in a written change of key, and sometimes it's handled just with accidentals. Either way, it doesn't matter: whether the key has changed temporarily depends on what the harmony is doing, not on the notation conventions employed.

The "key signature" OTOH is just a convenience to ease writing and reading. It doesn't make the key, it just reflects it (if the writer has done his or her job). You could write a given tune without any key signature at all, using only accidentals. (This is also fairly common for tunes with somewhat ambiguous harmony.) The key of the piece would remain the same, because the same things would be happening harmonically, even in the absence of a key signature. In theory, you could even write out a tune with the wrong key signature entirely, and as long as you notated all the accidentals correctly, the key of the tune itself would still be exactly the same, even if the key signature was way off. That would be perverse, though anyone who's seen enough charts has probably seen something like that.

Of course the key signature reflects the key of the song. That's the whole point of the notation. If it did not it would be the same as saying the letters of the alphabet do not form real words. The musical notation is a system devised to write down what the composer has in mind. It is a vehicle used to share information just as the alphabet allows us to share thoughts. The fact that a composer may use notes or harmony outside of the key the song is written in does not necessarily change the key the same as using a french word in an english sentence does not change the language of the author. The designated key allows the reader to make some assumptions about the notes he sees on the page. For example if it is the key of G the reader will know that all F's are sharped unless otherwise noted. He will also understand the relationships of the notes to each other. For example, when he sees a C chord he will know that is the fourth step of the scale.

[Richard Lindsey]

Originally Posted by Billminpa

Of course the key signature reflects the key of the song. That's the whole point of the notation. If it did not it would be the same as saying the letters of the alphabet do not form real words. The musical notation is a system devised to write down what the composer has in mind. It is a vehicle used to share information just as the alphabet allows us to share thoughts. The fact that a composer may use notes or harmony outside of the key the song is written in does not necessarily change the key the same as using a french word in an english sentence does not change the language of the author. The designated key allows the reader to make some assumptions about the notes he sees on the page. For example if it is the key of G the reader will know that all F's are sharped unless otherwise noted. He will also understand the relationships of the notes to each other. For example, when he sees a C chord he will know that is the fourth step of the scale.

Yes, of course, I know. My point, again, is that the key signature doesn't determine the key. I've seen people think that all they need to understand the key is to look at the key signature, regardless of what's actually happening in the piece. If the piece is well notated, then key and key signature will generally coincide, but it's worthwhile to point out that when they don't, it's what's actually being played that determines what the key truly is, not what somebody wrote in the key signature. if somebody puts one sharp in the key signature, yet analysis of the chords and the melody shows that the tune is functionally in D, then the tune is in D, regardless of what the key sig says.

Or, IOW, the key the piece is actually "written" in is determined by what the chords and the melody actually do, not by what the key signature says.

[tpmiller08]

Originally Posted by Bassorama57

I'm not sure we ever actually answered your question..!
It was noted in here someplace that most basic rock follows a I-IV-V progression, and our Western ears (Arnold Schoenberg excepted) expect most music to "resolve" back to I, which is "usually" what key the tune is in. Eg, Louie, Louie in "G" would be G (I) C (IV) D (V). Nice thing about bass is the fretboard is laid out in a logical pattern, so if someone says "Nah, let's do Louie, Louis in 'A'" you can use the same fingerings two frets up without thinking about it.

Why is this stuff useful? I walked into a rehearsal last month and was given the bass chart for "Signed, Sealed, Delivered," written in "E," but of course everyone on the planet does it in "F," which is what the bandleader told us to do. Given about 2 minutes to look it over, and having a passing familiarity with the tune, rather than transcribe each note up a half step, I just looked at the patterns (decending major scale at intro, yada yada), and moved them up a half step.

This is pretty close =) Very Helpful

If I'm writing an original piece of music, is there a way to tell what key I'm in? I take alot of time to learn music theory. But the only time I actively think of it is when Im writing a bassline to someone ELSES tune.
When I'm writing a song myself, I purposely chose to not think of music theory (hoping that years of burning it into my brain and fingers will make it just happen. Works well). Only problem is I can't tell what key I'm writing in.
So does it come down to the chord / note progression? Is it the lowest chord or note in the progression?

Thanks for all the help guys, this turned into one HELL of an informative thread!

[ayryq]

Originally Posted by tpmiller08

Only problem is I can't tell what key I'm writing in.
So does it come down to the chord / note progression? Is it the lowest chord or note in the progression?

I suspect the easiest way is to go on what key it "sounds like" it's in. In classical music there are some tricks you can use; some of them cross over to other genres.

• Look at the last chord. It'll probably be in the key of the piece.
• Scan through the melody and see what accidentals you had to use. Figure out what key signature they are in and that's the key. This one has some difficulties: In major it works great but in minor you'll see raised 6ths and 7ths. In D minor, for example, you'd expect to see Bb's. But, you'd actually also see some B naturals and C#'s. And in a blues-style piece in C you'd see lots of Bb's (in C7 chords) but that wouldn't make the piece be in F.
• Find cadences: Look for V-I progressions (like Eb7-Ab). The second chord might be the key of the piece. It's this dominant/tonic function that really give the listener the impression of "key."
• Find a note that works as a "pedal point" over the majority of the piece on your bass. As in, play a single note on your bass and sing the whole melody over it. The note that fits best will be the key.

I hope that all helps, but the most reliable method really is "feeling" it.

Eric