How Do You Figure Out a Song Without Music?

doktersprode · #1 02-15-2009, 12:10 AM

These days, I really want to be able to figure out the bassline to a song without having to resort to TAB, but how is it done? I can listen to the same song a hundred times over, and still not hit the right notes. It's easy once I figure out the key, but how do I do that? Any help appriciated, as "Come Together" is really beating me.

iplaybasstexas · #2 02-15-2009, 12:19 AM

thats a talent only a few people have...your gonna have to go to the tab.
or watch live videos of the band and look at the frets they are at.

Slax · #3 02-15-2009, 12:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iplaybasstexas

thats a talent only a few people have...your gonna have to go to the tab.
or watch live videos of the band and look at the frets they are at.

Huh? Ear training should be part of daily practice...

Keep working at it, you'll get better. You might not have perfect pitch but you can get damn good at having relative pitch. Also, if you're in a rut, take a little break and try some other songs then come back to the one you're trying to figure out.

debassr · #4 02-15-2009, 12:29 AM

Sometimes if I'm really stuck, I'll pull out my old korg tuner - the type that has a mic built in and I'll hum the bass line to it and write down the notes - works great.

seanm · #5 02-15-2009, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by debassr

Sometimes if I'm really stuck, I'll pull out my old korg tuner - the type that has a mic built in and I'll hum the bass line to it and write down the notes - works great.

I will have to try that!

seanm · #6 02-15-2009, 12:37 AM

When trying to work out a song the first time, don't try to get every note. I find it is best to first work out the chord changes. So just play along with roots, nothing else.

Once you have the chords down, then work on getting any signature lines.

I usually stop there and just fill in with something

Fergie Fulton · #7 02-15-2009, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by debassr

Sometimes if I'm really stuck, I'll pull out my old korg tuner - the type that has a mic built in and I'll hum the bass line to it and write down the notes - works great.

Please this is by no means a criticism as i think the idea is genius but......if you can hum the song, why can't you play it on your bass? Or at least use the bass to identify the notes you are humming? Like i said pure genuis on the idea though if i works for you.

tidnab · #8 02-15-2009, 01:34 AM

Luckily for me I have a good ear and can pull the notes out, as I always assume most people can... that's not the problem tho. the problem is the speed at which I (or you) can do it...

The Solution...
I'm using a software called transcribe! (a quick google and you can find it) I'm just using the free trial of it.. but it seems to work well... You can slow down the song but keep the pitch the same... really helps me anyway... supposedly it can tell you what notes are playing (but I haven't mastered how that works yet)..

Also, if you need something slowed down a bit and happen to have guitar rig... get the song in WAV format.. open it in guitar rig and slow it down there (with the tapedeck) again it uses time stretch technology so the pitch doesn't change...

Anyway... just some thought from a drummer that's trying to play bass...

pedulla-2007 · #9 02-15-2009, 01:36 AM

First of all you need a copy of the song of course, then you listen to the song over and over and over. On the way to work or school, on the way home, that song becomes your only focus. Us old timers have a term we call "Wood Shedding" where you lock yourself up in a room, and you don't come out until you learn it reasonably well. Back in the 70's when long playing albums were more prevalent than cassette players I would ruin my albums by trying to learn the 2,3,4th... song and would scratch the album when I set the needle down on or about the beginning of the song.No different than brushing your teeth or combing your hair, after you do it enough,

you certainly will do it well. I find a Tascam Bass Trainer especially handy with fast passages as you may slow the cd down. Hum each note and find the corresponding note on your neck, then put them all together with a little speed. I mean (fastness) HA! GOOD LUCK!!

dmusic148 · #10 02-15-2009, 01:54 AM

I learned how to play with the time honored method of turning on the radio and playing along to whatever song was playing. How? Since I was very young I always tried to hum the bass parts to whatever I heard, no matter where I was or what I was doing. Grocery store, car, doctors office, whatever. Just wanted to. It became a habit, to this day. Eventually I got really good at it. Practice. But you can't expect to be able to do this instantly, unless you're some kind of prodigy.
Now I do lots of gigs where I've often never even played the song, but I've heard it enough times to nail it. I'm not talking about crazy prog rock/metal stuff, just pop/rock stuff you hear every day. You do need to know the fingerboard pretty well to pull this off though, at least the first five positions.

I don't believe I have perfect pitch. I have 'very good' pitch. This enables me to quickly identify intervals, which are the basis for my technique. Intervals are the key. Once you know where the 'one', or root, is, and you can hear the intervals, or changes, AND you know the fingerboard well, you can do it. It's not really that hard after a while.

Thump Jr. · #11 02-15-2009, 03:08 AM

Also, if you haven't already, learn some basic scales (especially the minor pentatonic if you dig a lot of rock/blues). They'll help by teaching you to get the "feel" of a particular scale. You'll begin to pick it up in songs after a while, and once you've got your root notes, other notes will rather handily fit into those scales (generally - there's always modes and other things that make my head spin).

Here's a tip to get you started on Come Together, since you mentioned it: The verse riff (the one everybody associates with the song) is (as I've figured it out by ear, may not be exactly how Sir Paul played it, but it sounds right to my ears): Open D twice, slide to D at the twelfth fret, play F on the G string (tenth fret), then slide back down on the D string.

Other than that, just keep learning music and start out with simple stuff - root-only bass lines are plentiful and easy to pick up. I'd recommend some ZZ Top to start with because it's fun and simple, but your taste may vary.

emor · #12 02-15-2009, 05:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pedulla-2007

Tascam Bass Trainer

+1

martyman5000 · #13 02-15-2009, 08:56 AM

I transcribed 10 bass lines this last few weeks by using my ears...play a few minutes stop and then seek out the notes, its time consuming but will teach you to listen.

phxlbrmpf · #14 02-15-2009, 09:03 AM

I agree about learning a couple of basic minor and major scales. As pretty much any pop/rock song uses those,being familiar with them will make figuring out their bass/guitar/whatever lines so much easier. If you get rally good at them and work on your ear, you will be surprised how easy figuring out simple lines will become.

Lady Kayri · #15 02-15-2009, 09:05 AM

If you can find books with scores to the songs you're interested in (I find a lot in the library), most will also list which chord(s) each measure is in; that way you'll know the chord to build on; then listen to the song (I've got a Tascam bass trainer too; excellent quality for the money!) and figure out what notes in the chord are being used in the actual song.

JansenW · #16 02-15-2009, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slax

Huh? Ear training should be part of daily practice...

Keep working at it, you'll get better. You might not have perfect pitch but you can get damn good at having relative pitch. Also, if you're in a rut, take a little break and try some other songs then come back to the one you're trying to figure out.

+1
Keep at it! It gets much much easier after your first dozen or so songs.

Dogbertday · #17 02-15-2009, 09:19 AM

Find the first note.... then the first half of the first lick... then the first lick... then base the rest off that.. If something sounds wrong, it probably is

martyman5000 · #18 02-15-2009, 10:39 AM

Fun one today I learned is the song by the Stranglers called Peaches... use your ears for that one its very easy to hear the notes.

prokfrog · #19 02-15-2009, 10:44 AM

play, rewind,play,rewind,play,rewind,play,rewind,play,re wind,play,rewind,play,rewind,play, rewind,play,rewind,play,rewind.......

atheos · #20 02-15-2009, 10:57 AM

It's nothing but practice. A lot. A hell lot. The most important thing to figure out is the TUNING, if a song is played using Db-Ab-Db-Gb you mostly just can't do it on standard EADG tuning. Or; you cannot do a 6-string riff on a 4-string bass, at least not properly. Use Google, search TB, ask TB etc. but the whole thing starts from the correct tuning.

Here are few things that help, though:

1. Good speakers / headphones - you need to really hear what's going on in the bass section before you can figure it out. If you have some plastic $5 computer speakers it's really no surprise you can't hear the notes. Near field monitors and/or closed professional headphones would be the best.

2. Tempo reducing application to listen the tracks slower, for Windows I'd recommend Winamp + Pacemaker plugin (can be found at winamp.com). For Mac... Well, Quicktime Player has the AV Controls and then there is Amazing Slowdowner but IMHO it's really not worth its price.

3. Parametric EQ. If the song is mixed reasonably well the bass sits in certain frequency range - finding and boosting this sometimes helps.

Other than that I repeat myself: practice. Daily. For years.