how would you analyse this circle of fifths chord progreassion

[varunkapahi]

Amin7 D7 / Gmaj7 / Cmin7 F7 / Bb maj7
Ebm7 Ab7 / Dbmaj7 Gbmaj7/ Bm7 / E7

i know its II- V > I over and again but how would you analyze the progression in a key?

and how do i learn to remember such progressions so i can play them out of memory any day? i mean i know its just going down in fourths but how do i remember this exact progression as in which chord plays for full measure or a half?

[BassChuck]

I'm not sure I'd think of the whole thing in terms of "key', but you do have what some people call 'key centers'... in other words a couple of chords that do outline (temporarily) a key. The ii7 - V7 is a part of the key, in fact it helps define it.

So, you have G then up a minor third to Bb, then up a minor third to Db, then up a minor third (enharmonically) to E. If you continue the pattern a repeat would take you up another minor third to G. So this progression would continue to repeat itself smoothly by going around a series of key centers each one a minor third above the one before.

[HeadyVan Halen]

Practice.

If you remember, you'll forget.
If you know, you won't.

[varunkapahi]

Originally Posted by BassChuck

I'm not sure I'd think of the whole thing in terms of "key', but you do have what some people call 'key centers'... in other words a couple of chords that do outline (temporarily) a key. The ii7 - V7 is a part of the key, in fact it helps define it.

So, you have G then up a minor third to Bb, then up a minor third to Db, then up a minor third (enharmonically) to E. If you continue the pattern a repeat would take you up another minor third to G. So this progression would continue to repeat itself smoothly by going around a series of key centers each one a minor third above the one before.

i get you but if you had to analyze that progression on paper then how would you do it with romans and brackets and arrows!? i mean with chord symbols lol

[teleharmonium]

Originally Posted by varunkapahi

Amin7 D7 / Gmaj7 / Cmin7 F7 / Bb maj7
Ebm7 Ab7 / Dbmaj7 Gbmaj7/ Bm7 / E7

i know its II- V > I over and again but how would you analyze the progression in a key?

and how do i learn to remember such progressions so i can play them out of memory any day? i mean i know its just going down in fourths but how do i remember this exact progression as in which chord plays for full measure or a half?

It's not all in one key. Each new IM7 chord with those clearly diatonic precedents is in a new key. So it is a series of iim7 V7 IM7 progressions in the keys of G, Bb, Db, and E.

You can also think of it as iim7-V7-IM7 progs where the iim7 of the next set is up a fourth from the preceding IM7; or as a G diminished arpeggio where each chord tone is the root of an M7 that is set up by the simple diatonic progression.

[MalcolmAmos]

Originally Posted by varunkapahi

Amin7 D7 / Gmaj7 / Cmin7 F7 / Bb maj7
Ebm7 Ab7 / Dbmaj7 Gbmaj7/ Bm7 / E7

i know its II- V > I over and again but how would you analyze the progression in a key? and how do i learn to remember such progressions so i can play them out of memory any day? i mean i know its just going down in fourths but how do i remember this exact progression as in which chord plays for full measure or a half?

Well I doubt you would ever have that progression in a song. It is as you said a string of 4ths. Makes a good exercise, but, I don't ever remember seeing it used in - total - in any song. For that matter do not see the need other than an exercise. So you need not worry with how many measures each gets. That is left up to you.


To answer your question of how long does a chord last or how many measures to use it. It lasts as long as it harmonizes with the melody line. If the melody line is using notes found in the A chord that A chord would harmonize the melody (sound good) until the melody moved on and no longer had notes from the A chord. When that happened - then you need to find a chord to play under the new melody that does have some of the new melody notes in it's (the chord) makeup. Read that again, it's one of the most guarded secrets out there as it explains how music thinks.

How many? One is enough for harmonization, two are better, three are probably not necessary. That's why just roots work. Root - 5 would be better, you've established harmonization with those two notes any other additions are going beyond basic and entering into melodic. If you like melodic help yourself. Of course IMO.

Good luck.

[Freddels]

I can't do arrows, etc. on here but you would do it like this:

G||: ii-7 V7 IMaj -- Bb||: ii-7 V7 IMaj -- Db||: ii-7 V7 IMaj IVMaj

etc.

I can't format this the way I want to. Usually, you will write the key Bb||: up one line and drop the chords down lower.

This is one way to do it. You need to learn it by the key centers and how they move (up a minor 3rd) and watch as to where in the tune it shifts to be able to get back to the top. In your example, the GbMaj7 is the shift to get back to the top by leading it into the ii-7 V7 of the A-7 chord.

[teleharmonium]

It's not that different from the second section of Giant Steps, but cycling through an octave of minor thirds for the I chords instead of major thirds (requiring one more iim7 V7 IM7 because of the smaller interval). So that section of Giant Steps is like an augmented triad with the 2-5-1 for each chord and this progression is the same thing for a dim7.

I could easily see something like that being the chorus of a jazz tune.

[tstone]

It's a harmonic sequence.

Sequence (music) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The repeated harmonic progression is a ii-V-I. The entire progression is moved up a minor third on each repetition.

[JimmyM]

Analyze it? What's to analyze? It's all analyzed for you already. Just play it

[MalcolmAmos]

Just remembered something else it is used for.
Backcycling. Have a progression of three measures of the same chord and you would like to liven it up.

Target the next chord - the one after the long three measure void. Look at the circle - what leads to that chord.
Lets take G as the target chord. What leads to G?
C-F-Bb-Eb-Ab-Db-Gb-B-E-A-D-G-C



The Following goes into detail......
Advanced Chord Comping? [Archive] - iBreatheMusic Forums

[BassChuck]

Originally Posted by varunkapahi

i get you but if you had to analyze that progression on paper then how would you do it with romans and brackets and arrows!? i mean with chord symbols lol

Why bother? There's really enough information there already. But the smartass part of me wants to say that this is not a circle of Fifths thing but rather a "Square of Minor Thirds". And yes I suppose you could have a "Triangle of Major Thirds" and a "Hexagon of Whole Steps".... but who needs all that?

[JTE]

Amin7 D7 / Gmaj7 / Cmin7 F7 / Bb maj7
Ebm7 Ab7 / Dbmaj7 Gbmaj7/ Bm7 / E7

To memorize it, analyze it.
|ii V| I| in G, then Bb, then Db. The last measure of the Db goes to the fourth, Gb, then it's ii V in A. And that E7 resolves nicely to the Amin7 as you start the cycle over again. So, it's ii V I in G, then a minor third higher (to Bb), then a then another minor third to Db, then the Gb chromatically to A. It's moving through key centers so don't try to stay in one key. Just focus on the chord tones and let them lead you to the next change.


John

[varunkapahi]

Originally Posted by JTE

Amin7 D7 / Gmaj7 / Cmin7 F7 / Bb maj7
Ebm7 Ab7 / Dbmaj7 Gbmaj7/ Bm7 / E7

To memorize it, analyze it.
|ii V| I| in G, then Bb, then Db. The last measure of the Db goes to the fourth, Gb, then it's ii V in A. And that E7 resolves nicely to the Amin7 as you start the cycle over again. So, it's ii V I in G, then a minor third higher (to Bb), then a then another minor third to Db, then the Gb chromatically to A. It's moving through key centers so don't try to stay in one key. Just focus on the chord tones and let them lead you to the next change.


John

thanks just what i needed!

Originally Posted by BassChuck

Why bother?

because i have to
yes the minor 3rd part makes sense thats the key to learn the progression ill just two five it whenever needed!

[AMp'D.2play]

Originally Posted by JTE

Amin7 D7 / Gmaj7 / Cmin7 F7 / Bb maj7
Ebm7 Ab7 / Dbmaj7 Gbmaj7/ Bm7 / E7

To memorize it, analyze it.
|ii V| I| in G, then Bb, then Db. The last measure of the Db goes to the fourth, Gb, then it's ii V in A. And that E7 resolves nicely to the Amin7 as you start the cycle over again. So, it's ii V I in G, then a minor third higher (to Bb), then a then another minor third to Db, then the Gb chromatically to A. It's moving through key centers so don't try to stay in one key. Just focus on the chord tones and let them lead you to the next change.

John

John, I follow you except for the 'Gb chromatically to A'. Gb -> G -> Ab -> A, no? I don't see that. Could you please elaborate?

[JTE]

Originally Posted by AMp'D.2play

[/color]

John, I follow you except for the 'Gb chromatically to A'. Gb -> G -> Ab -> A, no? I don't see that. Could you please elaborate?

BRAIN FART!!!

I was thinking G#, not Gb when I typed that... It's Gb to A, another minor third.

DOH!!!

John

[VocMusTcrMaloy]

My college theory teacher did not believe in modulation, so he would have called it a V/V/V/V/V/V/V/V/V/V/V/V (a five of five of five of five of ...) Of course I didn't put in all the 7's and M7's etc. I believe the appeal of the progression would be the V-I relationship of all chord changes. The strongest cadence is the V-I (authentic) cadence, and the strongest progression is also V-I. Since your progression is rife with that V-I feel it should sound great. The fact that there are m7's and M7's throughout would keep it from sounding cliche.

[VocMusTcrMaloy]

I didn't really answer the question. With the minors I would still think in terms of a stack of V's of V's but with modal shifts. ii-V is really a v-I relationship that is done without going outside the original key. The ear hears the V-I and perceives it as a powerful progression.

[Phil Smith]

Originally Posted by varunkapahi

Amin7 D7 / Gmaj7 / Cmin7 F7 / Bb maj7
Ebm7 Ab7 / Dbmaj7 Gbmaj7/ Bm7 / Bb7

I think this sounds better.

[bobsax]

Originally Posted by MalcolmAmos

Well I doubt you would ever have that progression in a song.
.

au contraire mon basso frere
Down In Old Brazil by Michael Franks
Michael Franks Down in Brazil - YouTube
//: A MA7 / A MA7 / Am7 / D7 /

G MA7 / G MA7 / Gm7 / C7 /

F MA7 / F MA7 / Fm7 / Bb7 /

EbMA7 / EbMA7 / Ebm7 / Ab7 /

DbMA7 / DbMA7 / Dbm7 / Gb7 /

B MA7 / B MA7 / Bm7 / E7 ://

Begins and ends in A so I say AAAaaaaay
sorry just being goofy