I learned to play songs but never to play bass...Starting over

[BassBob2112]

Hi,

I'm hoping for a few concise, to the point, pieces of advice. I have checked my ego at the door.

I started playing bass at age 17, played for about the next 10 years, playing several days a week on my own and with various garage bands every week.

I learned how to play songs...by tab, by slowly transcribing sheet music into tab, and later, by ear. I learned lots of songs (classic rock stuff, lots of Rush, Zeppelin, The Who). I felt I was pretty good too, at playing those songs.

Life changes, and well, I took about 12 years off from playing and now am getting back into it. I have come to the conclusion after so many years that,

I learned to play songs, but never to play the bass.


What is a good way to learn the bass at this stage?

I'm rusty but my fingers still have some "muscle memory". In a weekend of playing I've been able to play a few riffs and lines from some songs I used to know again. But I want to learn to play bass and not just play songs.

Do I just buy the Mel Bay book and start there?

[Renaissance]

I wouldn't start with beginner books. Find a teacher to work with, even on an irregular basis. In know, I know - stock answer. I have a similar background. Since you already play you will quickly become bored with trying to "start from the beginning". A teacher will find the bad habits and correct them. Learn to read music and work on theory. Learning to read and write music is a lot easier than you may think. Set a goal for every time you practice - otherwise it's very easy to slip into "noodling" mode and waste time accomplishing nothing since you already play. I'm sure others will have better advice but this is -unfortunately- previous experience speaking. Good luck!

[Robotsatemygma]

I can relate with the op. I started off right away by learning songs, never ever took a lesson (unless friends count). Well here I am just noodling away trying to find lessons that don't bore me, but that's actually kind of hard.

Solution:
I'm actually going to go get lessons. Took me awhile to finally admit that, well, lessons probably won't be a bad thing. I've been playing bass and guitar for about 11 years now and theory makes, absolutely, no sense to me . I understand some of it but some areas are so confusing I just give up. I figured, if I want to be a better musician I might as well learn how to read and write the language I speak (musically illiterate).

[bassbully]

I can understand where your at. I learned nothing but songs on guitar 20+ years ago. I didnt play again until about 10 years ago and this time I picked up a bass. I learned nothing but songs on bass...but I am happy

Getting back to music later in life (40) left me not allot of time to study music and the bass. I want to play and a band wants a bassit who can play and play songs correctly.
I tried to bend ears on theory to those who knew it and that I was playing with and to my surprise even they said "Learn the songs"
Most of my advice from others has been Know basic major and minor scales, know your fretboard, know how chord progressions work, be able to follow simple chrod charts and last but least ...have big ears.

Its all about what you want from music .If you want to study music and music on the bass ...great. If you want to be a good bassist in a band learn the bass as a tool and learn the songs the band plays.

[S. Katz]

Originally Posted by Renaissance

I wouldn't start with beginner books. Find a teacher to work with, even on an irregular basis. In know, I know - stock answer. I have a similar background. Since you already play you will quickly become bored with trying to "start from the beginning". A teacher will find the bad habits and correct them. Learn to read music and work on theory. Learning to read and write music is a lot easier than you may think. Set a goal for every time you practice - otherwise it's very easy to slip into "noodling" mode and waste time accomplishing nothing since you already play. I'm sure others will have better advice but this is -unfortunately- previous experience speaking. Good luck!

+1

If you want to start on your own, get a music theory book, learn the basics, and then start picking apart the songs you know--study the chart (even a guitar or piano chart) and figure out what you are playing in functional terms (i.e., R - 3 - 5 - b7, etc). Then throw out the line you learned, and write a new one for the same song, using the theory you have learned, your ear, and your sense.

[MalcolmAmos]

Yes, move away from tabs and look into being able to play from fake chord or lead sheet music.

That means you will have to decide what bass line to use. The lead sheet or fake chord will just give you the name of the chord and then it's left up to you to decide how many of the chord notes you will use in your bass line.

Roots only or R-b3-5-b7. Somewhere in there is a groove. That's left up to you.

For example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUK5pE5x_6A Roots to start with, .........
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4x0u...eature=related try this with just roots then see how many of the chord notes you can add..... That F#m7b5 - "generic bass line" would be R-b3-b5-b7. Where you have two chords in one measure, i.e. Em and Eb7 - you've got two beats for the Em and two beats for the Eb7. I'd go R-b3 on the Em and R-3 on the Eb7 - it's your bass line do what you think is best. Here is some help with that; http://www.smithfowler.org/music/Chord_Formulas.htm

www.studybass.com is a friend.

The major scale box pattern is one of my dear friends.

Major scale box with note names shown 
G-|----|--A-|----|--B-|--C-|----|----|
D-|----|--E-|----|-F#-|--G-|----|----|
A-|----|--B-|--C-|----|--D-|----|----|
E-|----|----|--G-|----|--A-|----|----|

Major scale box with interval numbers shown
G-|----|--2-|----|--3-|--4-|----|----|
D-|----|--6-|----|--7-|--8-|----|----|
A-|----|--3-|--4-|----|--5-|----|----|
E-|----|----|--R-|----|--2-|----|----|

Ask questions, some one will jump on it.

Good luck.

[dave64o]

If money isn't an issue and you can somehow find the time, lessons with a good instructor are tough to beat. I learned like most people here, playing on my own and learning/using box patterns. And like at least some, even though I could play a lot of songs I didn't really know much more than that. Improvising was really hard for me and making up my own basslines was a slow process that involved a lot of time to think through the theory I sort of knew in order to come up with something beyond pumping out roots and occasional 5th.

Since starting to work with my new instructor, he's got me breaking that habit ("the box") and really learning the fretboard, focusing on intervals and translating what I'm hearing to where I am on the fretboard and where the intervals regardless of where I am. I'm finding I'm becoming faster than I was before, I'm far more economical in my movements (*far* less moving up and down the fretboard), my fretting hand doesn't get fatigued as easily, and my fretting hand dexterity has improved dramatically because I'm forced to not use the muscle memory I came to depend on. What seemed like a fairly simple idea to me at first has really changed my playing a lot.

The ear training we do has a similar focus. Instead of learning a song by playing "within the box", I'm not just learning songs and moving on to the next one. Each song I learn I'm supposed to come up with as many alternate fingerings as I can whether they work well or not, then come to him with what I figured out - specificially, why some fingerings work better than others.

We also agreed right away that I won't use tab (my insistance) so the books I specifically found some books that use standard notation only, which I soon realized is more valuable than just learning to read for its own sake. I've found that sight reading, even at my still very slow speed, is an outstanding way to stop yourself from focusing on patterns. In order to be effective you also need to keep looking ahead far enough to figure out a good position to play in to make sure you're set up to play later sections smoothly.

Of course you can learn on your own by using books, online videos, and even online lessons. Many of us did and continue to do that. But at least for me, I quickly figured out that taking lessons in person lessons with a good instructor is worth every penny if you want to do more than just play songs.

[KingRazor]

Yeah, I've been self taught up until now and I'd really like to be able to create music instead of just playing it. I want to be able to create bass lines from scratch. Being able to play songs written by other people is a valuable skill and will always have its place, but what I want is to make my own music.

[bassbully]

Originally Posted by MalcolmAmos

Yes, move away from tabs and look into being able to play from fake chord or lead sheet music.

That means you will have to decide what bass line to use. The lead sheet or fake chord will just give you the name of the chord and then it's left up to you to decide how many of the chord notes you will use in your bass line.

Roots only or R-b3-5-b7. Somewhere in there is a groove. That's left up to you.

For example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUK5pE5x_6A Roots to start with, ......... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4x0u...eature=related try this with just roots then see hom many of the chord notes you can add..... That F#m7b5 - "generic bass line" would be R-b3-b5-b7 Here is some help with that; http://www.smithfowler.org/music/Chord_Formulas.htm

www.studybass.com is a friend.

The major scale box pattern is one of my dear friends.

Major scale box with note names shown 
G-|----|--A-|----|--B-|--C-|----|----|
D-|----|--E-|----|-F#-|--G-|----|----|
A-|----|--B-|--C-|----|--D-|----|----|
E-|----|----|--G-|----|--A-|----|----|

Major scale box with interval numbers shown
G-|----|--2-|----|--3-|--4-|----|----|
D-|----|--6-|----|--7-|--8-|----|----|
A-|----|--3-|--4-|----|--5-|----|----|
E-|----|----|--R-|----|--2-|----|----|

Ask questions, some one will jump on it.

Good luck.

Great advice!