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  #1  
Old 09-02-2011, 07:49 PM
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I need some help getting my songwriting juices flowing

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Hey,

I just started my first band. I'm in high school. I have been playing bass for about 2 1/2 years. I am really into alternative/grunge/punk stuff, my guitarist is really into blues and progressive rock, and classic stuff. My keyboard/2nd guitarist is into "indie" and alternative stuff. I have recorded a couple of grooves that I set to a drum machine and then we jam to, but no whole songs. I wrote a "nirvana-ish" bassline yesterday, but I don't know where to take it. I use garageband, recording directly into the computer via an adapter cable. I also have a Zoom B2.1u, but I don't use it as much as i used to once I started using GB. How can I write a song (lyrics aside-for now), that works with all the instruments, with just a bass? I have been trying to compose stuff, mainly when I am by myself. I just have my 3 basses, effects pedal, and computer. What do I to inspire myself to come up with something new? I am fried right now, cannot think of anything. I haven't really taken any music theory, I read tab 90% of the time, if not more.
  #2  
Old 09-03-2011, 04:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoosierBassist View Post
I haven't really taken any music theory, I read tab 90% of the time, if not more.
Well you do not need a lot of theory, but, you do need to know how music thinks. This is coming from an old structured guy. Take that into consideration. I suggest you get a "First Draft" on paper then flesh it out from there. The following is a list of "things" that need to be in place before you finish your song. Should give you an idea of how music thinks and what you need to incorporate into your writing.

1. I know you do not want to start with the lyrics. OK, but, always that, "OK, but", my structure is based upon the lyric verse - hang with me. Pick a key now. Right at the first. Why? If you stay in key everything will fit and sound good together. You are writing a first draft. After you get that if you want to "go out" no one will stop you.

2. I use a four line verse and a cookie cutter chord progression. Remember it's a first draft. I start with the story to be told. Put that into verse format and then grab one of my trusted chord progressions. The chord progression moves the verse along from (I) rest to (IV) tension to (V7) climax and then (I) resolution and return to rest. My structure has two V-I cadences in the four line verse. Start with the I tonic and move to the IV chord near the end of the first line of the verse. Continue on into the second line of the verse with the IV chord and near the end of the second line bring in the V7 and quickly end this line with the I tonic chord. Do the same for the 3rd & 4th line. Now sing (recite, whatever) the song and move the chord so they are over a specific word, i.e. you are writing fake chord or a lead sheet so you need a chord change word to tie the progression to.

3. Three verses and a chorus (the hook, what you want them whistling tomorrow) should be enough. If you need more write more. Use the same chord progression for all verses and the chorus. It's a first draft.

4. Melody next. You have your lyrics and one of the rules of thumb is to have one melody note per lyric word. Two syllable words get two melody notes. You also have your chords that are in play with the lyrics at this point in the song.

5. Which melody notes to use. How about drawing your melody notes from the chord's pentatonic scale. You will have three chord tones for harmony and two safe passing notes for color and flavor. In the fleshing out phase if you need other scale notes use them. You want the melody and the harmony to sound good together and if the melody line and the chord line share like notes they will. IMHO the pentatonic's five notes will write a bunch of melody. May get some pointers from this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrDh0OFDCAk

6. Work in phrases - which note sounds right with this lyric word? Chord used is a C - OK that gives me C, D, E, A & G (C's pentatonic scale) to draw my melody notes from. Say the word and try the C. Say the word and use the D or E or A or G. The one that sounded best with that word is the one you write down. Next word, if the C chord is still active in the song repeat the process. If the song has moved on to another chord use the pentatonic scale of that chord. I find this very hard to do on the bass, I do my melody on the keyboard. If you are going to be writing songs do yourself a favor and get a keyboard, it need not be expensive.



That gets you a lead sheet. Something to give to the other guys. Lead sheets do not have a bass clef, but, you have the chord name. It's now time to build your bass line, aka the bass clef. I presume you already are writing your own bass lines. Use chord tones from the chords used in the song. Which ones? Roots, fives, eights and the correct 3 is a good place to start.

Gave you a structured list of things necessary to take into account before you end your song. You do not have to use any of this, if you are one of the lucky ones and can play what you hear in your head, you may not need the structure, if not help yourself to what ever you like.

First draft -- then flesh it out from there.

Have fun.

Last edited by MalcolmAmos : 09-03-2011 at 08:25 AM.
  #3  
Old 09-03-2011, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoosierBassist View Post
Hey,

I just started my first band. I'm in high school. I have been playing bass for about 2 1/2 years. I am really into alternative/grunge/punk stuff, my guitarist is really into blues and progressive rock, and classic stuff. My keyboard/2nd guitarist is into "indie" and alternative stuff.
Find something you feel really strongly about then write down everything you feel and think about it. You may fill up a couple of sheets of paper and there will be enough words for a song.

Find a bassline you can sing over and fit the words to what you can sing. Aim for two sections that sound good going into one another.

When your song is at the stage where you can sing it and play the bass perform it to the band.

Hopefully they will be impressed with this and you can then insist that they play along with you.

Take the bull by the horns. If you have something to say in your song then go say it. Sometimes a band needs a dictator to get things moving and if you are singing it you can stipulate the key and tempo you need to sing in. You can all take turns at being dictator if you want.

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  #4  
Old 09-03-2011, 09:24 AM
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+1 to a band needing a dictator. Director perhaps is a better name. Democracy and or committee vote never seem to bring things to closure.
  #5  
Old 09-03-2011, 10:21 AM
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There are a couple of routes you may want to try.

Since you do not know theory, I will not get into that. But music does tend have a certain function and flow. I would say understand a scale... then understand a chord, and how chord fits into the scale. The look at common progressions in root and inverted positions. (You may first want to look up chord progressions... see what that is about it, look at examples [sheet music with the chord names above the staff lines - lead sheet chords]).

I think that is all you will need for the theory aspect. If you can figure that you (do not worry about exact details at first, just try and understand the point of it, the goal of it). If you know what chords are to be played, you can have a much easier time making up a bassline that harmonically fits into the scheme.

Two approaches to writing a song, or composing a progression is to either start with the bass or the melody. (1) If you have a lyric that you like, and you have a certain rhythm for it, I suggest you sing it to yourself. Hear where the voices go up and down. (Usually singing moves by half/whole steps, thirds, with the occasional leap. (Usually when there is a leap (more than a movement of a third), the melody tends to go the opposite direction. (Imagine you hit the climax of something, you would to descend before attempting to get to a high point again). So say you figure all this out, try and match your voice to the bass, play your bass on the higher register part. The bass actually plays notes in the treble clef, and the guitar plays notes in the bass clef! You can use this try and figure out the guitar melody part. When you got this, and say you understand how chords work, you can try and apply this to writing a bass line from a theory point OR you can just listen to what it sounds like, and work with it from there and see what sounds good.
(2) If you understand a little bit about chords, and their progressions, use the bass to just out line the chords. Start with a whole note, play that, then play another whole note. So that about 4 times. Say you have a simple, but decent sounding 4 note progression. You can now play those notes again, but instead, use your understanding of chords, and apply the fifth to after each root. (Play 8 notes, half the amount of time you did for the 4 notes - so it is 8 notes, but same duration as the 4 note sequence.) You can use this method to become elaborate with making something up. But just remember, it is not about how fast and how many notes, a rest (silence in music) can be much better than any note available.

I have seen people use loops of a bassline over a drum track, and then solo over it. You can do this once you figure out a melody and a bassline.

Learn song structure. Check out some songs and see how they build up a good song...

Intro
Verse
Chorus
Verse
Chorus
Bridge/solo
Chorus
Outro

Sit down and think about each section. Come up with a catchy rhythm that is a real attention grabber (do not be a snob about it) and make that the chorus. Lighten up a bit for the verse, let the words speak, but provide a solid foundation for the guitar and vocals to work. For the intro... try and use the idea of the chorus to make a theme. Your intro should have a bit of relevance to the chorus. The bridge and solo are always a good place for a modulation, but how that technically works is far beyond what is necessary. Just try and make a simple transition from the key you are playing in, into another key. A lot of the times if you are in a key, the relative/parallel key, the sixth, and the fifth make a good option to work. An outro should sound very final and should add a feeling of completeness to the song. Since you are doing a punk/grunge/etc influence, a cold stop (all the instruments stopping together on cue) is also an effective way to end a song.

So yeah, those are just some pointers without being too technical, I hope it helps you!!
By the way, I have never wrote a song in my life. So... yeah..
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