Internalizing The Use of Intervals?

arielk · #1 11-26-2009, 03:04 AM

Hi all,

I find that in improvising/coming up with lines, my hands only really ever want to use the 5th and octave intervals mostly. How should I work to change this effectively?

Thanks

SpawnofHastur · #2 11-26-2009, 04:29 AM

I think a good way to internalize the intervals would be to practice your scales in larger intervals- practice your scales in thirds, for example, and so on until you're entirely comfortable with every kind of interval.

Fergie Fulton · #3 11-26-2009, 04:49 AM

Your hands are only doing what you have let become easy and natural for them to do, you are in your comfort zone so to speak. Learn intervals away from your comfort zone, look to other forms of music for this if need be and incorporate it into you practise and playing.
For example if say you wanted to improve your playing in the rock area, J S Bach the orchestral composer would be a great starting point to hear new intevals and fingerings.

megadan · #4 11-26-2009, 06:46 AM

Learning my scales was what helped me to do this. Now when I'm playing new lines I jump all over the place looking for good notes. Usually it's a matter of trial and error, knowing your scales just speeds things up by knowning off the bat which notes aren't going to work.

MalcolmAmos · #5 11-26-2009, 07:44 AM

I have two basic "How to play bass" instructional books that have over 100 generic riffs plotted out on paper and then each riff is on a CD identified as track 17, 18, 19, etc.

I picked out several (8 or 9) and those became my go to riffs. Give some thought to finding your 8 to 9 go to riffs and then put them into muscle memory. Key is getting them into muscle memory.

The major pentatonic, R-2-3-5-6 should be one of your go to riffs. I seldom need the minor pentatonic, but here it is R-b3-4-5-b7. What the heck, here is the blues scale; R-b3-4-#4-5-b7.

Danny Fox · #6 11-26-2009, 01:38 PM

for example, practice your major scale, get used to the sounds of all the intervals. Often players stick with root, 5, octave because they know they are "safe". Once you are comfortable with the sounds and colours of all the intervals try using them over some major chord progressions, simple ones at first and you will see and hear how they all work and feel. I think its a case of expanding your musical vocabulary really, and it's always best to start simple.

Best,
Danny

http://www.myspace.com/bassmandannyfox

arielk · #7 11-26-2009, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpawnofHastur

I think a good way to internalize the intervals would be to practice your scales in larger intervals- practice your scales in thirds, for example, and so on until you're entirely comfortable with every kind of interval.

Yeah. Sounds good. However, I'm not clear on exactly what you mean...

Say I play in Dorian (what I'm working on right now, great mode); what would I do, just jump up from 1 (root note of scale/key I'm playing in) to 3 or what?

I apologize for my ignorance...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fergie Fulton

Your hands are only doing what you have let become easy and natural for them to do, you are in your comfort zone so to speak. Learn intervals away from your comfort zone, look to other forms of music for this if need be and incorporate it into you practise and playing.
For example if say you wanted to improve your playing in the rock area, J S Bach the orchestral composer would be a great starting point to hear new intevals and fingerings.

I'm actually a big fan of Bach, have listened to him constantly for the last two years or so.

Do you mean that I should play Bach?

bassandbeyond · #8 11-26-2009, 08:13 PM

Playing D dorian in 3rds, for example, would mean playing each note in the scale, followed by the note two steps up the scale:

D - F - E - G - F - A - G - B - A - C - B - D

and back down in reverse:

D - B - C - A - B - G - A - F - G - E - F - D

The next step would be practicing the same scale in 4ths:

D - G - E - A - F - B - G - C - A - D etc.

And then do it in 5ths, 6ths, and 7ths.

That's all good and necessary practice, but I get the impression from your initial question that perhaps you're in the habit of relying on roots and 5ths because those are usually the "safest" notes....am I right? If so, then maybe what you need most is some good ear training. Ultimately, you want to be reaching for notes because you know what they will sound like, not just because they fit in some scale fingering. Hope this helps. Happy Thanksgiving!

megadan · #9 11-26-2009, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny Fox

for example, practice your major scale, get used to the sounds of all the intervals. Often players stick with root, 5, octave because they know they are "safe". Once you are comfortable with the sounds and colours of all the intervals try using them over some major chord progressions, simple ones at first and you will see and hear how they all work and feel. I think its a case of expanding your musical vocabulary really, and it's always best to start simple.

well said Danny.

I like bassandbeyond's idea too.

MarkTAW · #10 11-26-2009, 09:20 PM

This Post about walking bass lines is a good place to start.

WalterBush · #11 11-26-2009, 09:34 PM

I watched Adam Nitti (he's got his own forum here) deliver a stellar clinic, a large chunk of which was on this very topic.

He has a system of practicing where you sing the intervals you're playing, getting them down in hands and ears. Part of his system results in being able to play anything you sing, and identify any interval by ear. It's pretty awesome. I'd ask him about it.

arielk · #12 11-27-2009, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WalterBush

I watched Adam Nitti (he's got his own forum here) deliver a stellar clinic, a large chunk of which was on this very topic.

He has a system of practicing where you sing the intervals you're playing, getting them down in hands and ears. Part of his system results in being able to play anything you sing, and identify any interval by ear. It's pretty awesome. I'd ask him about it.

I can ask him about it here on Talkbass?

...

As concerns walking bass lines: I've got a very good idea what they sound like, since I listen to jazz a decent amount and have been for the past year or two. The problem is that my ears AND fingers aren't really used to breaking out of the root-fifth-octave mold, so I can't really improvise walking lines right now. That's sorta the problem.

...

Bassandbeyond: Your method sounds excellent. You've just answered my initial question...Thanks!

Of course I won't say no to more feedback :-) Thanks guys

bassandbeyond · #13 11-27-2009, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arielk

Bassandbeyond: Your method sounds excellent. You've just answered my initial question...Thanks!

We aim to please!

SpawnofHastur · #14 11-28-2009, 10:12 AM

Yeah, props, bassandbeyond- that's exactly what I was thinking, but couldn't explain.

Fergie Fulton · #15 11-28-2009, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arielk

I'm actually a big fan of Bach, have listened to him constantly for the last two years or so.

Do you mean that I should play Bach?

I mentioned it in passing as an example of where a rock player would get great instruction, ideas and techniques from if he listened to Bach. The two genres fans do not sit well together as a rule, i cannot see members of Covent Garden Opera house buying tickets for Yngwie Malmsteen and vice versa. But when i first heard Malmsteen on Rising Force to me he was playing Bach on the guitar.

So if any player looks at music rather than genre then anything is possible if they open their minds that it is music that matters not style or genre.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wu0aEwhjj4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uD7ZLe5Nauc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16LI4TUucW4