Into The Moat,Dillinger,etc.

[Osama_Spears]

I was just wondering if anyone can lend me some knowledge/some where to find out exactly what makes DEP and ITM what they are. Like,what chords//scales do they play? I know alot of dissonance and odd-syncopation is incorporated,but I would to know more on how to write like they do.

if you haven't heard these bands,umm... www.purevolume.com/intothemoat

thanks in advance,i appreciate it.

(no flaming necessary)

[Correlli]

I listened to "In To the Moat", and that sounded a lot like a technique called "serialism", or the "twelve note system". this means that the piece of music has no Tonic Note or Key Center, and is composed of notes according to numerical patterns. Because this music is atonal, it puts alot of people off. The technique was invented by Arnold Schoenberg. Form the little bit I've seen about this technique, there are many modern forms of serialism.

Also, I counted at least 20 sections. by the sounds of it, they might arrange each section separately, then put the whole lot together into a single piece of music.

Google Serialism, Twelve Note System, and Arnold Schoenberg. There are books on these subjects as well.




These ideas are just a wild guess, but if I was attempt anything like it, I would investage the twelve note system.

[Osama_Spears]

thanks dude,I heard of the 12 note system before,and asked my instructor about it. So its basically when you play C to C by not repeating a note and playing every note in between?

[lemur821]

Originally Posted by Osama_Spears

thanks dude,I heard of the 12 note system before,and asked my instructor about it. So its basically when you play C to C by not repeating a note and playing every note in between?

Not quite. It's when you give each note equal face time to avoid being in any particular key. While playing each note from C to shining C would accomplish that, it would be boring. Serialism is one way to construct an atonal piece. You take all twelve notes and arrange them in a sequence (the chromatic scale you described is one). Then you use that sequence of notes and its transformations (upside down and backwards) to create music. That's basically it.

EDIT: Maybe you got it after all. At first it sounded to me like you thought that one just ascended a chromatic scale.

[Correlli]

Originally Posted by Osama_Spears

thanks dude,I heard of the 12 note system before,and asked my instructor about it. So its basically when you play C to C by not repeating a note and playing every note in between?

Here's a explaination of the Twelve Tone(note) System I found at MSN Encarta.

The composer first arranges the 12 notes of the chromatic scale in a particular order, forming a row of tones. A composition is then built by using each tone of the row in turn, beginning again with the first tone each time the end of the row is reached. Tones may be used one after another, as melody, or simultaneously, as chords. They may be placed in as high or low a range as desired and given to whatever instrument or voice the composer chooses. The row may also be used in three variations:
- Retrograde (played backward from end to beginning).
- Inversion (played upside down, so that an upward leap becomes a downward leap and vice versa).
- Retrograde inversion (upside down and backward).
The original row and any variations can also be transposed to higher or lower pitches.

[Osama_Spears]

confusing :/

i just read explanations like that and than play a DEP or ITM song and draw a blank as to how they're related.

[Correlli]

Originally Posted by Osama_Spears

confusing :/

i just read explanations like that and than play a DEP or ITM song and draw a blank as to how they're related.

Like I said, it's was a wild guess. ignore it if you wish.

[Osama_Spears]

I didnt mean that in a disrespectful way at all,and I apolagize if you took it that way.Thank you for your time and your research//knowledge.

[Correlli]

Cool music though. I actually quite like it.

[Osama_Spears]

same here,i love blast beats over scaling,it just makes me giddy.

[.matthew e wengerd.]

Throwing a word like 'serialism' around whenever dissonance is involved is a slippery slope. there are many forms of atonal and non-tonal music that are not based on the 12-tone row.

01 11 07 08 10 02 05 04 12 03 06 09
11 09 05 06 08 12 03 02 10 01 04 07
07 05 01 02 04 08 11 10 06 09 12 03
08 06 02 03 05 09 12 11 07 10 01 04
10 08 04 05 07 11 14 01 09 12 03 06
02 12 08 09 11 03 06 05 01 04 07 10
05 03 11 12 02 06 09 08 04 07 10 01
04 02 10 11 01 05 08 07 03 06 09 12
12 10 06 07 09 01 04 03 11 02 05 08
03 01 09 10 12 04 07 06 02 05 08 11
06 04 12 01 03 07 10 09 05 08 11 02
09 07 03 04 06 10 01 12 08 11 02 05

This is a typical serial matrix. If you call 'C' '01,' every pitch is related chromatically to 'C;' 02=C#, 03=D, 04-D#, etc.

This gives you your melodic content at the least. At their most extreme, serialist matrices can dictate rhythm, dynamics, timbre, etc. It's some pretty complex stuff that I don't reall understand and I don't think what we're hearing here is serialism.

[Correlli]

Originally Posted by .matthew e wengerd.

Throwing a word like 'serialism' around whenever dissonance is involved is a slippery slope.

yeah right, pal.

I'd take that with fries and pinch of salt.

Also, NAME YOUR SOURCE!!

[.matthew e wengerd.]

Originally Posted by Kiwi Kid

yeah right, pal.

I'd take that with fries and pinch of salt.

Also, NAME YOUR SOURCE!!

I'm sorry?

[edit] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serialism. For your reading pleasure.
[/edit]

[Correlli]

Originally Posted by .matthew e wengerd.

I'm sorry?

[edit] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serialism. For your reading pleasure.
[/edit]

Thank You

[.matthew e wengerd.]

Originally Posted by Kiwi Kid

Thank You

The limitations of the internet...do you disagree and are being coy? I just want to make sure I wasn't being offensive in any way...

.m.

[Correlli]

Originally Posted by .matthew e wengerd.

The limitations of the internet...do you disagree and are being coy? I just want to make sure I wasn't being offensive in any way...

.m.

Well, my reasoning for the two pieces of music for being atonal or serialism in form, was that I couldn't hear any resolution to a tonic note anywhere. Even if they modulated several times, I still can't hear a key.

Also, you said something that sounded pretty good, and I wanted to know where you got it from, so I can learn it as well

[gstbass]

DEP wouldn't be DEP without all the off-beat playing they do!!!! Try headbanging to them without looking like a fool!!

[Osama_Spears]

Originally Posted by gstbass

DEP wouldn't be DEP without all the off-beat playing they do!!!! Try headbanging to them without looking like a fool!!

haha,you're right...you'd be mid "bang" and you'd just get lost.