landing on the fifth as opposed to the root?

chief ten beers · #1 10-31-2008, 08:47 AM

I was working through a tab interpretation of let's stay together ad i noticed that it often had you landing on the fifth of the chord rather than the root.I know the fifth is often used but landing on the one on the fifth of the chord rather than the root...how common is that?thanks

PeterChampagne · #2 10-31-2008, 08:50 AM

Don't necessarily think of landing on the 5th. Think more about implying other chords. I find that when players land on the 5th, more often than not, they are implying a ii-V progression. Land on G over a C7 chord, and you imply a G-7 C7 progression.

BruisedOoze · #3 10-31-2008, 09:30 AM

I'm not sure how common it is but I find it's something that I do sometimes, noticeably in soloing. When I started trying to see what I can do by staying away from the root on the changes, I found because of the strong relation of the fifth to the root it works quite effectively. Say in a VI-V transition or II-I. For example, and in other words, going from an E minor to D major.

dougjwray · #4 10-31-2008, 09:43 AM

Here's a great example for Motown fans: "Someday We'll be Together" by the Supremes.
The chorus goes (I don't know what key it's in, let's say C major):
C (G in the bass) / G / F / C, then C / G / F / C
The fifth in the bass in the first bar lends some extra weight to the words and catches your ear, too.

chief ten beers · #5 10-31-2008, 10:57 AM

one interesting note choice in the arrangement i was referring to is landing on and staying on the minor 3rd(d flat) of the Bflatmin chord.on another chord the arranger has you landing on the fourth of the chord.just trying to wrap my mind around some of these options that I have encountered.now landing on the 4th is of the chord is definitely not something i've seen before.I'm used to seeing these chord tones following the root or as passing tones mostly.

Richard Lindsey · #6 10-31-2008, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeterChampagne

Don't necessarily think of landing on the 5th. Think more about implying other chords. I find that when players land on the 5th, more often than not, they are implying a ii-V progression. Land on G over a C7 chord, and you imply a G-7 C7 progression.

No offense, but I don't think that's really true most of the time. IMO a 2nd inversion is a perfectly good and venerable inversion that has its own uses and that can and should be heard on its own terms rather than be automatically assumed to be implying a ii that's not in evidence. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar; sometimes a C/G is just a C/G.

I would say that more often or not, the reason for the 5 in the bass is either (1) to create a certain kind of tension or (2) to embody a certain kind of melodic motion in the bass line. There's no reason to assume that the function of an inversion is necessarily to suggest some other chord than the one present.

slybass3000 · #7 10-31-2008, 06:01 PM

This is a very common situation where the chords go from I to V (C to G7 for example) and you play a 2 feel bass line based on the root and fifht of each chord. You want some movement between the notes and because the fifht of C is the root of G7 then you have to repeat the same note which doesn't define the chord progression so,if you play the fifht as the first note and then the root on the G7 it is a better melodic line and it can imply a Dm7-G7 movement as well and there are no repeating notes on a chord change,

Sylvain

StyleOverShow · #8 10-31-2008, 06:14 PM

I intend playing the fifth and the root together in 'A Train' to give the feel of a roaring train. Someone mentioned that was the original intention of the tune.

Whatever, using 5ths is a slippery slope. They are comfortable to grab below and above but have an "um-pah-pah' feel if overused.

I and using half tones above or below and it is quite effective in drawing the ear to the resolving next tone.