Music colege options

chanson · #1 08-12-2009, 09:45 PM

My apologies if this topic comes up a lot, but it seems like it's hard to get much information/input on this from searching the forums since everyone's individual options and interests are different.

I just graduated from high school in June and am planning to go to the junior college in my town of Napa, California. After two years I was looking to go to another college after this. I recently decided I want study music and am looking into music schools. Can anyone recommend any good music schools in or near California? I was looking into the University of North Texas School of Music. Thoughts on this?

Thanks in advance.

Edit: Missed an "L" in the thread title. Whoops.

J. Crawford · #2 08-12-2009, 09:56 PM

Nice edit! I was going to say, if you cant even spell college..

I subbed, Im intrigued.

Spencer! · #3 08-12-2009, 10:00 PM

I think you have to play the double bass to go to North Texas. What do you want to study? Performance?

chanson · #4 08-12-2009, 10:03 PM

I was initially thinking that you had to play double bass but I guess in the Jazz Studies division of UNT, you can play electric bass. I am not 100% sure what I want to study specifically...maybe that's what I should figure out first. I don't really know what all of the different areas of study exactly are. Could someone give a brief list with descriptions? That would be very helpful.

totallybacan · #5 08-12-2009, 10:05 PM

Subbed. Looking for colleges near MD though :/ I applied to Berklee but had to say no cuz it's too dang expensive. What are the general opinions on MI? I want to go into Music Ed, with a minor or double major in music production

tch90 · #6 08-12-2009, 10:55 PM

Have you heard of the Musician's Institute? It's based out of Hollywood, but I've heard of a few big names graduating out of there. I don't know much about it, but I think it's worth checking out.

MNAirHead · #7 08-12-2009, 11:39 PM

would need to know more of your direction and needs.

most do not need music school for pro gigging.. Berklee and NoTexas are more jazz

Music schools like this are commonly VERY expensive - I do session work with a bunch of guys who have gone to the majors (Eastman, Juliard, Berklee, MI, No Texas, Michigan and so on) ..

Seems as if the guys that went to a "trade school" type setting have lower bills and more street sense.. My Berklee pal has no clue how to pick up a phone and dorks around with "his setup".. he's a talented guy --- missing the true essense of how to run a music career ($19/hour lessons at guitar center and playing in a cover band).

Best advice I got in Music school was to drop and go do it - went farther than any of my pals...

PM me if I can help - would need to know more of your direction.

bobknowsbass · #8 08-12-2009, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tch90

Have you heard of the Musician's Institute? It's based out of Hollywood, but I've heard of a few big names graduating out of there. I don't know much about it, but I think it's worth checking out.

Don't do it, IT'S A TRAP!!! BIT is hella expensive, and it gets new enrollment by advertising that you'll be a "rock star" when you get out. The things you learn there are solid theory-wise, but you could learn everything there for way less if you have a good private teacher. You're better off at an actual college like USC or UCLA where your degree would be more useful once you graduated.

BTW, BIT used to be awesome, now it's just sad.

Rudreax · #9 08-13-2009, 09:47 AM

The one main purpose of music school is not to simply learn, but to NETWORK. You need to be playing with as many people as you physically can, both inside and outside the school, with students and teachers and anyone you can meet. You have to meet all the greats in the area, let them get to know you, and go to gigs with them if they need you. You have to build a reputation where you are while you're in school, and become the bassist that anyone can call and count on to fill in a gig.

Basically, you have to be playing a lot. A whole lot.

MichaelScott · #10 08-13-2009, 11:31 AM

I'd recommend that you spend the LEAST amount of money that you possibly can for school since a career as a musician is going to guarantee that you don't really make a ton of money. And having to play back loans from Berkley would not be something I would wish on anyone that isn't making a Doctor's salary.

The most important things for you to look at are:
1) Networking opportunities (are you going to be near a major city? Who is the teaching staff? Will they help you get gigs outside of the school?)
2) Play time (is this a school for bass players where you are going to have to compete with 18 other players for each ensemble spot?)
3) Quality of the education. There are plenty of inexpensive schools that offer great courses with amazing teachers.

I went to Cal State University Northridge (in Los Angeles) for Music Performance. It is a really great music school with a wide assortment of teachers and classes- and since it is a state school it is very inexpensive.

I'd recommend that you pick a few schools that interest you, call them up to get their sales pitch, and create a chart that shows the pros and cons of each. Again, price would be my #1 deciding factor given how the economy is and how hard it is to make money as a pro musician.

derekd · #11 08-13-2009, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelScott

I'd recommend that you spend the LEAST amount of money that you possibly can for school since a career as a musician is going to guarantee that you don't really make a ton of money. And having to play back loans from Berkley would not be something I would wish on anyone that isn't making a Doctor's salary.

The most important things for you to look at are:
1) Networking opportunities (are you going to be near a major city? Who is the teaching staff? Will they help you get gigs outside of the school?)
2) Play time (is this a school for bass players where you are going to have to compete with 18 other players for each ensemble spot?)
3) Quality of the education. There are plenty of inexpensive schools that offer great courses with amazing teachers.

I went to Cal State University Northridge (in Los Angeles) for Music Performance. It is a really great music school with a wide assortment of teachers and classes- and since it is a state school it is very inexpensive.

I'd recommend that you pick a few schools that interest you, call them up to get their sales pitch, and create a chart that shows the pros and cons of each. Again, price would be my #1 deciding factor given how the economy is and how hard it is to make money as a pro musician.

I totally agree. At like $30k per year, how in the heck are those Berklee grads gonna pay off their student loan? The upside of places like that are as mentioned, networking and knowing you are studying at one of the top schools in the country.

You say music ed. If you are thinking HS, then teaching certification. If college, you pretty much need a Master's now, and for a tenured position in a university, Doctorates are becoming more prevalent. I have a buddy who teaches at LAMA, which is supposed to be a good school. Good luck with it. Here are links

http://www.lamusicacademy.edu/

Jim Carr · #12 08-13-2009, 04:36 PM

OK. Assuming you want to become a trained musician, get a double bass and a serious teacher while in JR. College. Also take piano.

Then go to Sonoma State or SFSU or SJSU. That is if you really want a music degree. Do not go into debt for school. I have taught music at Columbia, Stanford, and SFSU. I know SJSU well, and my wife is a tenured music prof. at UNT. PM me if you have specific questions.

However, if you are more interested in Rock, Pop, Blues, Country, etc. than in Jazz, Classical, Music Education, don't go to school. Get a flexible day job, move out on your own, take lessons from a well connected bass teacher, and gig gig gig. Don't waste your young years getting a degree and debt. Plenty of time for that later, IMHO.

BTW, General Education is a good thing in and of itself, and will make you a better artist and citizen.

KaizerWilhelm · #13 08-13-2009, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Carr

OK. Assuming you want to become a trained musician, get a double bass and a serious teacher while in JR. College. Also take piano.

+1
There are a ton of things you can study related to music:
Performance
Composition
Instruction
Technology
Production
Acoustical Engineering

The technology refers to being a studio engineer, etc.

Im studying Music Tech with a Production focus at Seattle Pacific Uni. up here in Seattle. It's a liberal arts school with a really good music school but that's not it's main college. You'd be surprised what schools have good music colleges.

WJGreer · #14 08-13-2009, 04:55 PM

This is a great topic, and I think there are a few primary levers that can help someone choose a music school. Among them:

The bass professor. Who is it, what style is his or her specialty, and what do you hear from his or her other students?
The scene. A few people have suggested this, and I agree completely: a music school experience is as much about who you meet and play with in the scene as it is about the curriculum. All else constant, I think a school surrounded by a vibrant music town has the advantage, as will its students.
Your ability: you gotta be able to get in
The curriculum: Obviously, you wouldn't want to go to a place that has no significant jazz program if that's your interest.
The cost: Even if you can get into Berklee, it's still a brutally expensive place to attend school, magnified by the fact that you live in Boston.

I was accepted to the University of North Texas, which is a fantastic music school, jazz and otherwise (not sure about the requirement to play DB these days). Hard to go wrong, although Denton is not large enough to have a really bustling music scene. You find yourself commuting to Dallas and Fort Worth for gigs. Great players come out of that program, though. I recently played with a drummer from UNT named Stockton Helbing, who was absolutely killer.

I didn't go to UNT, by the way - I ended up at the University of Texas at Austin, and allow me to plug it here. John Fremgen is the jazz bass instructor - a monster player and a very nice guy. Jeff Hellmer is the jazz program director, very accomplished and published, and also a nice guy. Last I checked, there were three big bands plus small combos and the symphonies, all in the curriculum. You'd be in Austin, one of the best scenes in the country - an endless set of opportunities to play, especially if you are willing to work outside of jazz. I played a lot of theater, for instance.

And it's cheap. Way, way cheap compared to a lot of the others that have been mentioned here.

Let me know if I can answer any questions about the program. It's been a lot of years since I was there, but I still have some contacts.

Oh, one more thing...perish the thought, but if you get to school and find out that a music career may not be for you after all, wouldn't it be better if you were already at a place that had great options in other fields as well?

MichaelScott · #15 08-13-2009, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by derekd

I have a buddy who teaches at LAMA, which is supposed to be a good school. Good luck with it. Here are links

http://www.lamusicacademy.edu/

LAMA is also a great school- should have mentioned it before. I've heard that some of the best drummers in the world come out of that school. You'll be spoiled if you go there.

J. Crawford · #16 08-13-2009, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelScott

LAMA is also a great school- should have mentioned it before. I've heard that some of the best drummers in the world come out of that school. You'll be spoiled if you go there.

You would think with your avatar, it would be your first option!

chanson · #17 08-14-2009, 12:11 PM

Thanks for the input and suggestions, guys. Keep them coming

Jim Carr · #18 08-14-2009, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chanson

Thanks for the input and suggestions, guys. Keep them coming

Tell us more about your goals.

HaVIC5 · #19 08-14-2009, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rudreax

The one main purpose of music school is not to simply learn, but to NETWORK. You need to be playing with as many people as you physically can, both inside and outside the school, with students and teachers and anyone you can meet. You have to meet all the greats in the area, let them get to know you, and go to gigs with them if they need you. You have to build a reputation where you are while you're in school, and become the bassist that anyone can call and count on to fill in a gig.

Basically, you have to be playing a lot. A whole lot.

Well, this and another thing - becoming a well-rounded musician schooled in ear training, theory, history and arranging. Individualized instruction on your instrument is nice, but completely secondary. It simply isn't what music school is for - you can go out and get that same specific kind of education on your own for way cheaper. The networking aspect and the well-rounded training are both hard to come by if you try and train yourself, however.

The network aspect is directly related to where the school is. Basically, you should go to school in an urban setting, where there are gigs to go around nearby.

scott reed · #20 08-14-2009, 04:17 PM

+1 on not going into debt for college.

Check out the CLEP program - a cheap way to get general education college credit.

You don't have to major in music to play in college - Dave Liebman, Charlton Johnson and
Louis Nash graduated in other majors among others.

With all the online resources at your disposal you could teach yourself lots - how much
have you learned on Talkbass?

Learn to play keyboard better NOW.

Find the best bass teacher(s) you can.

Hang with the best pianists and drummers that will hang with you.

IMHO the best music degree today is a business administration degree with music electives.

In the real world, any degree is better than no degree.

You don't need a degree to get gigs. You might want a degree to get a job.