names of these triads?

[No Profile]

I was just messing around with some simple triads and was changing them about, I come up with some but i dont know what the correct names for them would be, any help would be great

1 3 5 - Major
1 b3 5 - Minor
1 b3 b3 - Diminished
1 3 b5 - ??
1 #3 5 - ??
1 #3 #5 - ??
1 3 #5 - Augmented
1 b3 #5 - ??
1 #3 b5 - ??

[dlloyd]

Originally Posted by No Profile

I was just messing around with some simple triads and was changing them about, I come up with some but i dont know what the correct names for them would be, any help would be great

Best guesses...

1 3 b5 - major, b5
1 #3 5 - = 1 4 5 - sus4
1 #3 #5 - sus4 #5
1 b3 #5 - minor, #5
1 #3 b5 - sus4 b5

[Petary791]

1 3 b5 - major b5
1 #3 5 - sus4
1 #3 #5 - sus4 augmented
1 b3 #5 - augmented b3
1 #3 b5 - sus4 diminished

[BassChuck]

Well. The 1, b3, #5 chord is probably best thought of as not a variation of the tonic chord but rather a chord built on the flated sixth scale step. So.. in the key of C, not C, Eb, G#, but C, Eb, Ab. (this example would be in the first inversion).

A musical example. I don't recall the keys but..... on the St. Pepper recording, after the opening tune there is a transition into "Get By With A Little Help..." and the lads sing: "Bil-ly Shears----" The chord they sing on "Bil-" is a chord built on the flated sixth step. (the chord on "-ly" is built on the flated seventh and "Shears" is tonic of the key of "Get By....")

Rock on....

[No Profile]

thanks for your help guys, i forgot about suspended chords. ok i been working on some more, i figutred the first 3 out, but im lost on the others.

1 2 5 - sus2
1 2 b5 - sus2dim
1 2 #5 sus2aug

1 b2 5 - ??
1 b2 b5 - ??
1 b2 #5 - ??

[BassChuck]

The b2 is a bit of a problem for me. I think of these as b9. Can I assume that the use of the b2 is to show that there is no 7th in the chord? If so, that would make some sense to use the b2 notation... I suppose. Do you want to hear a third in these chords?

Frankly, I would question why you are trying to think of these notes as chords in the tradition sense that you would want to use chord symbols. I would be suspitious that a chord symbol like C b2#5 would be misunderstood. Why not just write them out as notes.

Chord symbols, like Tab and Figured Bass are short hand ways to express some complex musical ideas. As such, they have a limitation... and, in the extreme case can be misunderstood.

Like Napoleon said, "What is history, but a fable agreed upon". Same is true for chord symbols, if we don't all know what is being described, the system will fail us.

[Snarf]

Originally Posted by No Profile

I was just messing around with some simple triads and was changing them about, I come up with some but i dont know what the correct names for them would be, any help would be great

1 3 5 - Major
1 b3 5 - Minor
1 b3 b3 - Diminished
1 3 b5 - ??
1 #3 5 - ??
1 #3 #5 - ??
1 3 #5 - Augmented
1 b3 #5 - ??
1 #3 b5 - ??

1 3 5 - Major
1 b3 5 - Minor
1 b3 b5 Diminished
1 3 b5 - Better to call this a major chord with tension #11
1 4 5 - Sus4
1 4 b6 - Sus4 b13 (which is an avoid note)
1 3 #5 - Augmented
1 b3 b6 - Minor b13
1 4 b5 - Really ugly . . . I wouldn't use that.

[No Profile]

Originally Posted by BassChuck

The b2 is a bit of a problem for me. I think of these as b9. Can I assume that the use of the b2 is to show that there is no 7th in the chord? If so, that would make some sense to use the b2 notation... I suppose. Do you want to hear a third in these chords?

not really, ive just replaced the third with a b2, just to see what it sounds like. i havnt got to 7ths yet.

Originally Posted by BassChuck

Frankly, I would question why you are trying to think of these notes as chords in the tradition sense that you would want to use chord symbols. I would be suspitious that a chord symbol like C b2#5 would be misunderstood. Why not just write them out as notes.

well to be honest im new to the whole theory thing and as i said im just playing around with triads, im tryin to find out the correct names for chords like c b2 #5 so it is less confusing, if u know what i mean.

[No Profile]

Originally Posted by Snarf

1 3 5 - Major
1 b3 5 - Minor
1 b3 b5 Diminished
1 3 b5 - Better to call this a major chord with tension #11
1 4 5 - Sus4
1 4 b6 - Sus4 b13 (which is an avoid note)
1 3 #5 - Augmented
1 b3 b6 - Minor b13
1 4 b5 - Really ugly . . . I wouldn't use that.

one question, why do u change for example sus4 b5 to sus4 b13?

also i found a good use for that last chord, sounds just right in a black metal song i was working on

[dlloyd]

Originally Posted by No Profile

one question, why do u change for example sus4 b5 to sus4 b13?

also i found a good use for that last chord, sounds just right in a black metal song i was working on

It would be the #5 he's changed to b6 and then to b13 (which is an octave + a b6).

How I understand it...

In extended chords you can sometimes leave out notes as they are implied by others. The fifth is one of these, it's implied by the root, as the harmonic series contains the 12th (octave + 5th), so while the ear doesn't really hear a fifth, the brain does.

If this was a chord you'd call it sus4 add b13 to indicate the lack of a 7th and 9th (the 11th is irrelevant because of the sus4).

[No Profile]

thanks dlloyd that makes a lot more sense to me