New bass instructor ( I want to learn Jazz )

[Drifta]

Since i'm no longer having to cram cover songs for upcoming gigs, I've decided to take some more lessons. I really want to learn jazz.

I took lessons early in my bass life - the guy showed me much about how to listen but I only took about 3 sessions (moved). 2 years later, after some hiatus's from music, I moved to orlando and took a few (3) from a teacher who was taught by dave Larue. That was two years ago.

Went to a jazz jam last night, and the house bassist (whom i've seen 10-15 times play) is really good. Got to talking to him about the lakland 55-01.

Turns out he had taken lessons from the same guy I did. I had thought contacting my old teacher, but this guy is really good - obviously knows his stuff, and long ago I saw the dude playing and I said to my self " I want to be that good, i want to be able to sit in at a jazz jam one day "
So I asked him if he gave lessons, I figured that it might be a better idea to get lessons from yet another source because I want to be well-rounded and not locked into one way of thought. Anyways, so I'm going to call him and set up some time to get to learnin'

Sorry for long story! but my question to you guys (since I know many of you are instrutors) :

What do I have him teach me? maybe a weird question, and I'm sure he will know what to teach me, but I'd like to go into the lessons able to give him a direction I'd like to go so as to not waste time/money (structure is good). Basically I've been locked into one style of music, reggae (and other Jamaican stylee's ) but I've always loved jazz but I have no idea how to play it.

I know some theory, been working on knowing my intervals-modes-chord tones and stuff, but i need more work on.

I want to learn:
How to walk, swing, improvise etc (i'd really like to be able to add this to my Jamaican repertoire)
Learn about time (I've only ever played 4/4)
Theory, how to read/transcribe
Develop my pitch

I know all that is pretty much synergistic but I have a problems a lot of times juggling a lot of information at once.


Anyways any comments or advice (or suggestions of some tunes i should start listening to) is greatly appreciated. I'm excited to learn, i haven't been able put my bass down lately!

[BASSDROID]

Originally Posted by Drifta

Basically I've been locked into one style of music, reggae (and other Jamaican stylee's ) but I've always loved jazz but I have no idea how to play it.

I know some theory, been working on knowing my intervals-modes-chord tones and stuff, but i need more work on.

I want to learn:
How to walk, swing, improvise etc (i'd really like to be able to add this to my Jamaican repertoire)
Learn about time (I've only ever played 4/4)
Theory, how to read/transcribe
Develop my pitch

I know all that is pretty much synergistic but I have a problems a lot of times juggling a lot of information at once.

I think you've laid it out pretty well here ^^.

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by BASSDROID

I think you've laid it out pretty well here ^^.

Yeah but I might not (financially) be able to take many lessons, also I am not able to juggle a lot of information at once. I don't want to drown. lol.

[dalkowski]

Wow -- sounds like my story. You've got it pretty well nailed, but I think it's on the teacher to create the plan that gets you to your goals (you can't learn ALL that stuff simultaneously).

Good luck and enjoy the journey!

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by dalkowski

Wow -- sounds like my story. You've got it pretty well nailed, but I think it's on the teacher to create the plan that gets you to your goals (you can't learn ALL that stuff simultaneously).

Good luck and enjoy the journey!

Yeah I'm trust he'll be able to create that plan, I'd just like to help him get there. I figured some jazz aficionados could chime in and maybe add something, because judging on some of these threads here there are many many approaches and ways of thought when it comes to jazz.

[ghiadub]

I would focus on major scale theory. Once you learn that, you can use it to improvise, fake your way thru jazz tunes, etc....

Reading music is a big plus if it is a "real book" jam and you are not already familliar with the tunes being called.

[BASSDROID]

Keep in mind that learning to play jazz is a journey and it certainly doesn't happen overnight. If you are starting essentially from scratch, 2 or 3 lessons will probably give you a basic understanding of a few elementary aspects, but not much more. If finances are a problem, you might want to bring that up with your teacher, maybe he'll work with you. There is a lot to process, so maybe scheduling the lessons every other week would be a better option for you, both in terms of digesting the materials and financially.

[BASSDROID]

FWIW, Dan Pliskow, one of my teachers wrote a book called "23 lessons at home". The book (which does not purport to be comprehensive) was designed to teach the fundamentals of double bass technique and improvisation to students who did not have access to a teacher. I figure it pretty safe to say that 23 lessons is probably an adequate estimate for the purposes you laid out here.

[fearceol]

Originally Posted by Drifta

Yeah but I might not (financially) be able to take many lessons, also I am not able to juggle a lot of information at once. I don't want to drown. lol.

Check out Carol Kaye's web site. She has great books and DVD's on jazz, that wont break the bank.

[Jim Campbell]

Originally Posted by Drifta

Yeah but I might not (financially) be able to take many lessons, also I am not able to juggle a lot of information at once. I don't want to drown. lol.

the chord tones alone should give you a good hour or two's work daily.....maybe get as much of that stuff locked before you head to the teacher,as a jazz guy is going to need it all on instant recall....i practice the arpeggios in groups of 4 keys,E A D G starting on Emaj 7,F#mi7,G#mi7,Amaj7,B7....etc on those 4 keys.....at 3 minutes each x 26 chords ...i know there are duplicates,but that' the idea,and every 3 days all twelve keys are covered,then the same idea only starting with the relative minor keys...C#mi7,D#mi7b5,Emaj 7,F#mi7....etc.....say each note out loud as you go and try to listen to the notes and not look

it took me way longer than the six months guys on here said it would,but sometimes i have to work so.....

after that you can start adding the 6,9,dim7,etc to the routine and you wont have to spend as much time on the others.,as you will be able to whiz through them.....add in an hour of reading a day,ear training.....that's a good four hours daily right there...... after you get all that down get the teacher involved to sort it all out....at least that's my plan until i can find a motivated instructor,or win the lotto,and enroll in berlin's school in florida every winter

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by Jim Campbell

the chord tones alone should give you a good hour or two's work daily.....maybe get as much of that stuff locked before you head to the teacher,as a jazz guy is going to need it all on instant recall....i practice the arpeggios in groups of 4 keys,E A D G starting on Emaj 7,F#mi7,G#mi7,Amaj7,B7....etc on those 4 keys.....at 3 minutes each x 26 chords ...i know there are duplicates,but that' the idea,and every 3 days all twelve keys are covered,then the same idea only starting with the relative minor keys...C#mi7,D#mi7b5,Emaj 7,F#mi7....etc.....say each note out loud as you go and try to listen to the notes and not look

it took me way longer than the six months guys on here said it would,but sometimes i have to work so.....

after that you can start adding the 6,9,dim7,etc to the routine and you wont have to spend as much time on the others.,as you will be able to whiz through them.....add in an hour of reading a day,ear training.....that's a good four hours daily right there...... after you get all that down get the teacher involved to sort it all out....at least that's my plan until i can find a motivated instructor,or win the lotto,and enroll in berlin's school in florida every winter

Thanks for the reply. Now that you mention the 4 key thing , my first instructor told me to play in two keys each day then the next two on the next day..
(i think it was fifths) and to transpose my lines into those keys. totally forgot about that.
lately I've been playing my major/minor scale on my 5 string, 2 octaves up and down, up and down one string, all over the place. and maj/minor arpeggios but I need to learn all those funky chords I've never heard of.

I actually live in orlando, not far from berlin's school (and i have fam/friends live next to it). Maybe i'll look into the one week intensive program or w/e it is.


thanks.

[TapyTap]

Read all of Jeff Berlin's posts.

[Jim Campbell]

Originally Posted by Drifta

Thanks for the reply. Now that you mention the 4 key thing , my first instructor told me to play in two keys each day then the next two on the next day..
(i think it was fifths) and to transpose my lines into those keys. totally forgot about that.
lately I've been playing my major/minor scale on my 5 string, 2 octaves up and down, up and down one string, all over the place. and maj/minor arpeggios but I need to learn all those funky chords I've never heard of.

I actually live in orlando, not far from berlin's school (and i have fam/friends live next to it). Maybe i'll look into the one week intensive program or w/e it is.


thanks.

i try and run the arpeggios up an down in as many different configurations as possible,big leaps,single string,etc and troll for weak spots,and then try to devote a tad more work to them......orlando is jimmym country,and i'd bet he'd know a teacher or 3

[Colgan]

Sorry I stumbled on to this thread so long after the fact. Howdy Drifta!

What is often misunderstood about jazz, is the tenancy to overdue the technical aspects and and neglect the most important part; the songs.

The best thing anyone can do to tackle jazz is to do the same thing you do for any style listen to the specific artist and songs and invest in a Jazz fake book (often called real books). I would suggest either the Chuck Sher publications or try to track down the Warner Bros. if you can find them on e-bay.

Target specifics in the music you LISTEN to first and then work in the technical aspects to supplement and amplify your knowledge of the SONGS and you will learn the technical skills faster when you learn them in context.

If you're not careful, you can go on and on with mathematical theory concepts where you can end up leaving your ear in the dust. When you do the, sooner or later, you will end up having to go back and get it and that means you have wasted all of the "progress" that you have worked so hard to achieve

I'm glad you're still playing, my friend!

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by Colgan

Sorry I stumbled on to this thread so long after the fact. Howdy Drifta!

What is often misunderstood about jazz, is the tenancy to overdue the technical aspects and and neglect the most important part; the songs.

The best thing anyone can do to tackle jazz is to do the same thing you do for any style listen to the specific artist and songs and invest in a Jazz fake book (often called real books). I would suggest either the Chuck Sher publications or try to track down the Warner Bros. if you can find them on e-bay.

Target specifics in the music you LISTEN to first and then work in the technical aspects to supplement and amplify your knowledge of the SONGS and you will learn the technical skills faster when you learn them in context.

If you're not careful, you can go on and on with mathematical theory concepts where you can end up leaving your ear in the dust. When you do the, sooner or later, you will end up having to go back and get it and that means you have wasted all of the "progress" that you have worked so hard to achieve

I'm glad you're still playing, my friend!

Well it's actually been quite a bit of time! so I guess i'll update it since you revived it!

So I found a bass teacher; local jazz pro; Basically for him it's not about the money ... seems more like a mentorship - we'll do our "25 dollar half hour" lesson and basically work on stuff for 3 hours or until I have to go home.

My playing has excelled quite a bit; i've gotten intimate with the fretboard, scales/arpeggios/modes/ etc. Recently started getting into working on "autumn leaves" and a couple other standards , as well as marvin gaye's "whats going on" sight reading.. following the cadence. For me i've got to really work on recognizing, "alright this coming up... thats a 2 - 5 - 1 in g" ... and just intuitively knowing that kind of stuff. One thing that would help me is If i could jam with people that can play those sorts of changes, different chords -- everyone I jam with only knows major/minor bar chords by ear. For this reason my teacher is pushing me to sit in at his jazz jam and get my feet wet, "just keep it simple, the horn players will love you" ... he probably just wants a break ! Lol.

One of my main goals is swinging and walking baselines.. Obviously I am confident I know the notes, where they are but it's getting my brain to work on the fly .. getting what is in my head onto the strings, that is a constant struggle.

Lately i just haven't had much time (consequently haven't been practicing or progression much) -- I created a band which just broke up (because the singer made a drunken joke about my dying dog..). So now I'm gonna get back on track. for a bit there I got super burnt out, and just started playing the hammond organ my friend gave to me, which is quite fun i must say..

Need to improve my ear a bit and analyze songs (like.. "man why did this bassist play that change like that?" etc) so I'm going to dive back into transcribing (my first teacher hammered that home.. he was a transcriber for warner brothers.. ).


first up: Curtis mayfield's "baby its you" .. amazing bassline.


Thanks for all the advice brothers.

[Colgan]

Check out the Jaimie Abersold (Jamey Aebersold Jazz) and Chuck Sher (Jazz & Latin Music Real Books and Method Books | Sher Music Co.) sites for their jam with sites.

Jamie Abersold is the original and the ultimate jazz play along publishers and their "Maiden Voyage would be a great start.

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by Colgan

Check out the Jaimie Abersold (Jamey Aebersold Jazz) and Chuck Sher (Jazz & Latin Music Real Books and Method Books | Sher Music Co.) sites for their jam with sites.

Jamie Abersold is the original and the ultimate jazz play along publishers and their "Maiden Voyage would be a great start.

Yeah I actually have the 100 volume's of jamie aeborsolds.. just started putting them to use! Btw you don't happen to be Colgan Bryan do you?

[jallenbass]

Originally Posted by Drifta

"just keep it simple, the horn players will love you"

This advice ain't just for novices.

[Colgan]

How many other Colgans do you know, Sam? :-) It's even weird to see my name with an s on the end.

How're you doing, my friend?

-Colgan

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by Colgan

How many other Colgans do you know, Sam? :-) It's even weird to see my name with an s on the end.

How're you doing, my friend?

-Colgan

haha! knew it. Its going i guess.. life! I was gonna email you awhile back and lost your email, glad to see you here. too bad I moved, would have enjoyed continueing lessons with ya. The lessons we had though, really openned my eyes and showed me that I could achieve the level of playing I wanted ( i just have to work at it ). I'm just at one of those plateau's again where I've been working on so much stuff, ready for a breakthrough.. a "click" to go off again.

Hope all is well with you! You gigging down there? I make it back down to south florida from time to time, if you're playing out maybe i'll come check it out if I can.