Play in a different key? Transposing?

[btrag]

I'm self taught on theory, so, I second-guess a lot of things I read in theory books. So, I understand that for something to be in the key of A, it will contain chords from the A maj. scale: A Bm C#m D E F#m G#dim.

Let's say a song is in A, and it's chord progression is: I, V, II, V, VII, I.

Someone says, play this tune in the key of C now. Would the chord prog. now be: C, G, Dm, G, Bdim, C ?

Is that right? Is this what it means to transpose a song?

[steveksux]

Let's say a song is in A, and it's chord progression is: I, V, II, V, VII, I.

Someone says, play this tune in the key of C now.

Its chord progression in C would be: I, V, II, V, VII, I.















Just kidding, you're correct. C G Dmin G Bdim C

Randy

[WillBuckingham]

I don't think so. If the chords are really "I, V, II, V, VII, I" then that would be A major, E major, B major, E major, G# major, A major" in the key of "A" and "C major, G major, D major, G major, B major, C major" in the key of C.

If the chords are "I, V, ii, V, vii*, I," Then the chords in C would be C major, G major, D minor, G major, B diminished. In A: "A major, E major, B minor, E major, G# diminished, A major."

(* = degree sign)

[Bruce Lindfield]

The V should be a dominant 7th ....?

[btrag]

Will, that seems to be what I posted. How am I incorrect? And, should the fifth be a dominant? I read that it was a staight minor chord.

[Bruce Lindfield]

[christoph h.]

will is introducing another factor: the notation of the roman numbers.

if a roman number is written in capital letters, it refers to a major chord -> III (relative to C) = E major.
"iii" on the other hand refers to E minor in that context.

it is however very common to use all capital letters to refer to the degrees of the scale.

i think will should have explained his post a bit better, because currently it's more confusing than helpful to a theory "beginner". especially since there's no "B major in the key of C" (only Bm7b5 or B half-diminished). in fact, following will's logic, the chord progression wouldn't have a certain key center at all.

i hope that helps a bit, sorry if it confuses even more.

[btrag]

Let me try to summarize what I've read: In any major key the "seventh" chord will always take on a minor, diminished quality. So, in the key of Amaj, the seventh will be G#mb5 (right?)

I see on that piece of notation that every chord is a seventh chord. This is found mostly in jazz and blues right? Making every chord a seventh chord in a given key?

[Ed Fuqua]

Originally Posted by btrag

Let me try to summarize what I've read: In any major key the "seventh" chord will always take on a minor, diminished quality. So, in the key of Amaj, the seventh will be G#mb5 (right?)

I see on that piece of notation that every chord is a seventh chord. This is found mostly in jazz and blues right? Making every chord a seventh chord in a given key?

Don't say "seventh chord", say "chord built on the seventh degree".

In any major key, the chord built off the 7th degree of the scale will be a "half diminished" (or minor 7th flat 5) chord.

As far as "making every chord a seventh chord" well, no. Sort of. If you want a triad (3 notes) you can just write or play those 3 notes. You only add the (appropriate) tension when that is the SOUND you want. Just like you can have a V7b9#9b13 if that's the sound you want. Or a Imaj7(#11).

The other thing nobody seems to be talking about is that all of this is just DIATONIC harmony. Even if you have a key signature of C major, that doesn't mean that the whole song stays in C major. Most popular music tends to have a lot of SECONDARY key centers. So just because you are in Cmajor DOESN'T MEAN that you won't see/can't write or play a D7.

You're generally right about transposition; whatever you do to the key signature, you do to all of the notation in the song. So if you move from A major to C major, you've transposed UP a minor 3rd (or down a major 6th). So if the 3rd note in the second bar is an Eb in the original key, you move that up a minor third.

It IS easier to think of transposition by thinking in terms of function of the chord rather than moving specific notes up and down by a certain interval. You just want to make sure that you understand function when you do; is that a II7 or a V7 of V?

[geoffkhan]

Originally Posted by Ed Fuqua

It IS easier to think of transposition by thinking in terms of function of the chord rather than moving specific notes up and down by a certain interval. You just want to make sure that you understand function when you do; is that a II7 or a V7 of V?

Right on!

Also don't forget to use your ears when transposing... they can be immensely helpful (as they always are).