Please HELP Set up a curriculum for me. . .

[SabreATK]

Hello, I am a guitar player who is transitioning into bass. I have played guitar for 20 years (but if I was really motivated, I could probably have gotten here in 7-10 years).

I know music theory, chords, inversions, modes, scales, arpeggios (sweeps / inversions) and substitutions. A little bit of jazz, but mostly play instrumental rock like Satriani, and metal. I know modes and my left hand is speedy and has no problem jumping around laterally, from practice shredding. I don't read music although I can pick out the notes on the neck.

I am not a bass player. . yet. The reason I got into bass was for my home studio, and wanting to record better demos. While I have the dexterity to play simple bass lines, I dont think like a bass player and i dont groove. I got an Ibanez ATK bass and I am enjoying it much more than playing guitar, so I decided to get good at bass. I can always go back to guitar when I can compose music that grooves. My current music has a melodic focus.

So I figured that I would need a good intermediate bass method to start. I got:

Jaco Pastorius Bass Method
Hal Leonard Jaco Pastorius Bass Method - Book/CD: Shop Books, Videos & Music & Other Musical Instruments | Musician's Friend

This method seems good, I have the dexterity to play most of it. Exercises are based around following/outlining chords with arpeggios. There are some really tricky Jaco songs mixed in.


Then, because I figure that my success as a bass player will depend on my vocabulary of grooves, I got:

Daily Grooves for Bass
Carl Fischer Daily Grooves for Bass Book/CD: Shop Books, Videos & Music & Other Musical Instruments | Musician's Friend
This is a groove vocab builder for intermediate/advanced bassists. I am kinda cheating because the lessons are written in standard notation, and the idea is to read and figure them out (althoug I am using the TABs on the CD, because I need to learn the fingering too.) These grooves are challenging but doable. I am already doing sweeps (rakes?) and alot of position shifting. I am using EZ drummer to program and loop drums to play along with. which is to help with my groove writing (drums and bass) and lock in my playing.


The next book I got (havent opened it yet), is "Building Walking Bass Lines" (Ed Friedland)" Hal Leonard Building Walking Bass Lines (Book/CD): Shop Books, Videos & Music & Other Musical Instruments | Musician's Friend

I figure I will need to depart from the canned grooves and learn how to improvise/write my own lines that follow the changes and the beat. This one comes highly recommended.


I want to focus on song playing, because I believe that imitating music you like is the best and most fun way to learn. So I got: "RUSH, Ultimate Bass Play Along" Alfred Rush Ultimate Play-Along Bass (Book/CD): Shop Books, Videos & Music & Other Musical Instruments | Musician's Friend

I'm going to start this when I've got some more fundamentals down.

Last but not least, I wanted to work on my rhythmic technique, which is much different from guitar, and got a DVD on Slap/Pop, called "Slap Bass The Ultimate Guide" (Friedland) http://www.musiciansfriend.com/books...41737000000000 Havent started this one yet either, still focusing on fundamentals.



So here is where I need suggestions. I've got the Jaco method for practicing basics, I have the Daily Grooves for building my vocab, The Walking Bass Lines to learn how to write and improvise lines, and The Rush Book for songs ( I want to get more songs with backing tracks, build a repertoire of 20+ songs).

I am really hesitant to pick up a "beginners method" because I will be bored to death with Mary's Little Lamb and simple scales, but I don't want to miss any fundamental skills. I feel like I should get one of the funk bass methods that has play along tracks that will guide me through simple stuff.

Because I'm doing it right, I probably should learn how to sight read (or at least learn enough to know I don't need any more reading), and basic techniques (things like practicing sequences and scales up and down the neck, finger exercises, etc.) I have been watching a bunch of YouTube vids and focusing on wathing technique.

Please make suggestions that will help fill out my bass education.

I have decided not to play guitar for a year and focus only on bass and drum programming. I might try to get some gigs or at least jam as a bassist.

The tip of my index figer hurts from the practice. I will update periodically with my progress. Any suggestions appreciated.

[colcifer]

Look up the local jazz players and take lessons from one of them.

[SabreATK]

Originally Posted by colcifer

Look up the local jazz players and take lessons from one of them.

Thanks. Maybe in a little bit. But an hour of lessons around here is $75, so I can get alot of stuff out of the way working on my own for less money. ALot less.

[MalcolmAmos]

You are leaning toward melodic and if that is what you like - great. Before you sit down with those books and start your journey spend 30 minutes at Carol Kaye's website and see what she has to say about chord tones.

Here are 100 tips she gives - pretty well covers how she feels about chord tones. IMHO time well spent.

The Official Carol Kaye Web Site

Good luck on your venture.

[GeoffT]

All of the Ed Friedland stuff is top notch, Bass Grooves is pretty good for learning to work together with drums. It gets you started on programming drums to work with too.

Haven't seen the Jaco method but if it is heavy on chord tones you're good, those are the money notes in almost any style.

Standing in the Shadows of Motown is excellent, Jamerson wrote the book for electric bass playing with the Motown stuff, it's std. notation. The Hitsville USA CD box set is a good investment, it is some of the finest melodic and groovin' bass lines you'll come across.

Foundation Excercises for Bass by Chuck Sher is nice for almost any level of playing or style because excercises are not strictly writen out, they are more like an outline of how to practice using scales, chord tones, and rhythms in a musical way to build your own chops and style. It is one of the most creative and fun methods I've come across, feels more like jamming or grooving rather than practicing static written examples over and over.

Be sure to check out the Stickies at the top of the various forums, lots of great information on commonly asked questions from great guys with lots of experience.

Welcome to the deep end, you might want to be careful, if you spend a year playing bass, you may never go back.

[colcifer]

Originally Posted by SabreATK

Thanks. Maybe in a little bit. But an hour of lessons around here is $75, so I can get alot of stuff out of the way working on my own for less money. ALot less.

Where are you?

[funkybass]

Originally Posted by MalcolmAmos

You are leaning toward melodic and if that is what you like - great. Before you sit down with those books and start your journey spend 30 minutes at Carol Kaye's webb site and see what she has to say about chord tones.

Somewhere on the site are 100 hints Carol gives on how she thinks we should play our bass. IMHO time well spent.

It's in the education section. I printed them off and put them in a binder.

[SabreATK]

Originally Posted by funkybass

It's in the education section. I printed them off and put them in a binder.

I started reading the carol kaye stuff and its interesting, the first tip she offered, was something I came to realize about 12 years into guitar. If I was teaching beginners how to play guitar, I would focus on arpeggios and intervals, and not scales. Everything, every lick, every phrase is based off chord tones, when we play scales, the additional notes are largely just for texture. Staring with scales makes it take longer to reach that conclusion.

[sonofabass]

Originally Posted by SabreATK

Thanks. Maybe in a little bit. But an hour of lessons around here is $75, so I can get alot of stuff out of the way working on my own for less money. ALot less.

If $75 ...even a lesson a month from a good teacher who will set you up with a good curriculum is too much then I would venture to guess that you aren't really serious about playing the bass.

I don't mean that as an insult, just a fact. Consider it an investment in yourself.

Daily Grooves for Bass - $19.95
Jaco Bass Method - $14 - ish?


That's 33.95 right there....and a GOOD teacher is going to be able to give you feedback and advise. The books won't

sounds like you've got a wealth of good, although unfocused pile of literature to sift through and, ultimatly you'll feel overwhelmed, inundated with and toss aside.

I don't mean any of what I'm saying as an insult.....I only speak from personal experience.


laser beams...light bulbs...

hells, I'm not a scientist but I heard a cut analogy once that stated that they used the same energy - the difference is focus.


My 2 cents but , hey, I'm only one man.

[SabreATK]

Originally Posted by sonofabass

If $75 ...even a lesson a month from a good teacher who will set you up with a good curriculum is too much then I would venture to guess that you aren't really serious about playing the bass.
.

My first reaction to your response was to tell you to "go to hell". You have to admit its pretty rude and you're applying your own values and abilities to my situation.

Then I realized you don't know how good I am on guitar. There is a very real chance that I know more than any given instructor I would enlist for this.

I took some guitar lessons last year with a local instructor. THe guy had been cramming music theory and progressions, but when we sat down and worked through the first couple months of material, it became obvious that he didn't have a great depth of knowledge, and he couldnt improvise as well as me. I spent a few hundred bucks for information that could have been better served by reading Ted Green's Chord Chemistry.

I was hoping for some intangibles, some wisdom, something unique, but basically just got a human chord book in half hour weekly increments. It was actually de-motivating, and my expoerience with instructors from 20 years ago was that they are all a bit sensitive about their lack of abilities, and unless you are taking lessons from a world class player, there are gaps in their knowledge or they are holding back. I'll take a pro DVD instruction video or CD/book over an in person lesson most of the time.

When I've got my bass technique solid and have a repertoire on bass, then I may enlist a teacher for some advanced instruction.

[sonofabass]

Originally Posted by SabreATK

My first reaction to your response was to tell you to "go to hell".

Yikes...really? Sorry to have invoked that emotion.

My sincere aim was/is only to help. Both of those situations (having all of the books - yet not really knowing how to make the most of them - hey...you asked people in a forum to help you come up with a curriculum for yourself) AND having (without knocking anyone I don't know) not-so-great-teachers.


It would have only been "rude" (and that's going a bit deep) had I not been in a very similar situation as you are and had absolutely no idea of your situation.

My "advise" is a quote that I heard from Todd Johnson - "How do you eat an elephant? The same way that you eat a chicken - one bite at a time.


Best of luck in your endeavors.

[SabreATK]

OK thanks, I dont think you have anything more to contribute to my thread.

[251]

Download a copy of this; Jamey Aebersold Jazz: Free Jamey Aebersold Jazz Handbook

The scale syllabus, practiced in all 12 keys or as a Circle of 5ths/4ths will do you no harm & it's Free!

[onlyclave]

Originally Posted by SabreATK

My first reaction to your response was to tell you to "go to hell". You have to admit its pretty rude and you're applying your own values and abilities to my situation.

Then I realized you don't know how good I am on guitar. There is a very real chance that I know more than any given instructor I would enlist for this.

I took some guitar lessons last year with a local instructor. THe guy had been cramming music theory and progressions, but when we sat down and worked through the first couple months of material, it became obvious that he didn't have a great depth of knowledge, and he couldnt improvise as well as me. I spent a few hundred bucks for information that could have been better served by reading Ted Green's Chord Chemistry.

I was hoping for some intangibles, some wisdom, something unique, but basically just got a human chord book in half hour weekly increments. It was actually de-motivating, and my expoerience with instructors from 20 years ago was that they are all a bit sensitive about their lack of abilities, and unless you are taking lessons from a world class player, there are gaps in their knowledge or they are holding back. I'll take a pro DVD instruction video or CD/book over an in person lesson most of the time.

When I've got my bass technique solid and have a repertoire on bass, then I may enlist a teacher for some advanced instruction.

You just gave every reason WHY you should go take an hour lesson with a teacher and tempered it with the fact you're an arrogant guitar playing ass.

You already know it all, pal. Work up your own curriculum with your awesome sweep picking technique.

[Crazyeelboy]

Originally Posted by SabreATK

OK thanks, I dont think you have anything more to contribute to my thread.

Nice attitude. Good luck with the books - I don't think you're going to win too many friends around here with that kind of attitude. Lighten up and you'll find that people here will bend over backwards to help you and will ask for nothing in return (except a little respect and courtesy).

[Infidelity]

Originally Posted by SabreATK

OK thanks, I dont think you have anything more to contribute to my thread.

[fearceol]

Originally Posted by onlyclave

You just gave every reason WHY you should go take an hour lesson with a teacher and tempered it with the fact you're an arrogant guitar playing ass.

You already know it all, pal. Work up your own curriculum

From casually reading through the thread, I have to admit that I agree with this. OP, sorry, but you come across as a know it all, yet come on here asking advice from strangers who could be, for all you know "sensitive about their lack of abilities, have gaps in their knowledge, or are holding back". If you are as good as you claim to be, you should have no problem working out your own curriculum.

When you do, maybe it can be put up as a sticky, so everyone here on TB can learn from it.


Seriously though, the bass is a different animal from the guitar, so lighten up, drop the aggressive, superior attitude, and you will find a wealth of knowledge here on TB....if you can humble yourself long enough to accept it.

[SabreATK]

When a guy says to another guy "youre not serious about learning bass", thats rude, aggressive trolling. I called it for what it is, then the guy acted surprised and wounded. Trolling 101.

I was looking for recommendations on the best books/methods/websites. I got some, and for those guys who helped. thanks. For everyone else in the peanut gallery, get a life.

[Crazyeelboy]

Dude, you totally misread the situation. The guy was just trying to be helpful and clearly had no intention of dissing you. You misread a single point on his message and took it out of context. His point was clearly that if one is serious about learning an instrument in a short time, cost of lessons would not deter that person from lessons. He's right and he was just trying to help you out with no obligation to do so.

[onlyclave]

Have a blessed day.

world fastest guitar