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12-14-2011, 08:35 PM
| | |  Proggresive Metal ????
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Good Morning/Afternoon/5 O'clock somewhere Bass Players/ Musicians / Random Guitar player lurking on this forum wanting to be a bass player.
Well as the topic suggests I need help. I'm a Funk Rocker/ Jazz player. I was recently scouted, tried out and accepted into a progressive metal band. The only problem is I HAVE NO CLUE HOW TO PLAY PROGRESSIVE METAL or any kind of Metal at all, and they don't want me to pound out the root note. It's a really guitar driven sound band with two great Guitarists. I'm just having trouble finding my spot in there. List time!
1. I'm used to Bass Driven groove like songs, or at least a strong presence.
2. Uhh metal ... hmmm uhhhh Hmmm!>!>!>>>???!?!? Minor Harmonic scale(thats all I know + modes and chord tones)
3. I just can't seem to find my spot.
4. The drummer and I lock in a lot but I find it troublesome to keep locked in with him because when I do lock in, the lead doesn't like my groove QQ.
So help meh?!? Pls Talk bass? I have Cookies that I'll eat for you?  |
12-15-2011, 08:49 AM
|  | Registered User | | Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Deep East Texas Piney Woods | | | They had a bassist before you, was it a good exit, if so talk to him/her. Beyond that - good luck. Metal to me is roots. Course I do not play metal. |
12-15-2011, 10:14 AM
| | | Reminds me of this post I read the other day: http://jazzadvice.com/listening-to-t...s-of-the-wise/
How much metal do you listen to and like? There's 40 odd years of great stuff, and since you joined this band, I've got a guess that even if you don't have much exposure to it, part of you might be looking forward to it, so dive in, listen to everything you can, and find what you like and the rest of the band likes and it'll come.
Nice thing about progressive metal is that it, well, progresses. You don't need to copy progressive band X or Y if you don't want. I think that if you soak up the "language of metal" from Anacrusis to Zero Hour then what you play won't be awkward, and when you find what you love it'll all groove.
Who knows what you all will find? Have fun! |
12-15-2011, 10:20 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Athens/Greece | | | Check out John Myung (dream theater) and Michael Lepond (symphony X) on youtube, to see their approach on bass playing in prog metal.
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12-15-2011, 10:29 AM
| | | | Oh, and of course, this will require some time and patience all around. So best to talk about that up front, if you haven't already.
If they hear you're learning and improving, and you feel they're giving you time and maybe letting you start simple until things start to form, it'll go better for everyone. You'll have a good band, they'll have a creative and dedicated bassist. If not, things can get stressful and stall out real fast. |
12-15-2011, 10:47 AM
|  | Remember 12/21/2012! ...it's my birthday! | | Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Cheviot, OH | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Dazzare  Good Morning/Afternoon/5 O'clock somewhere Bass Players/ Musicians / Random Guitar player lurking on this forum wanting to be a bass player.
Well as the topic suggests I need help. I'm a Funk Rocker/ Jazz player. I was recently scouted, tried out and accepted into a progressive metal band. The only problem is I HAVE NO CLUE HOW TO PLAY PROGRESSIVE METAL or any kind of Metal at all, and they don't want me to pound out the root note. It's a really guitar driven sound band with two great Guitarists. I'm just having trouble finding my spot in there. List time!
1. I'm used to Bass Driven groove like songs, or at least a strong presence.
2. Uhh metal ... hmmm uhhhh Hmmm!>!>!>>>???!?!? Minor Harmonic scale(thats all I know + modes and chord tones)
3. I just can't seem to find my spot.
4. The drummer and I lock in a lot but I find it troublesome to keep locked in with him because when I do lock in, the lead doesn't like my groove QQ.
So help meh?!? Pls Talk bass? I have Cookies that I'll eat for you? | The first thing I would do is brush up on my progressive metal history to get some ideas on how other bassists in the genre have approached the music. The next thing I would do is put all that aside and listen to what the music the band is making calls for and try to translate that to my fingers as best I can.
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12-17-2011, 10:50 PM
| | | | Prog metal for bass players, IME, is just following whatever the rhythym guitar does. Yes, John Myung is technically a monster on bass, but I find it boring to listen to him. It's like, 'Yeah, yeah, you can play really fast and all. That's great.' I like Mike LePond a lot better, but he's buried in the mix on most Symphony X Albums. It's a shame really, because he throws in some nice little fills here and there. He's really a tasteful player. |
12-17-2011, 10:57 PM
| | | | I should also add that a lot of prog metal is mostly guitar wankery - and I hate, HATE guitar wankery. I'd much rather listen to David Gilmour play three perfect notes than John Petrucci play a zillion notes. BLECHH!!
But . . . prog metal is cool for learning how to play odd time signatures. I'll give you that. I just loooove playing with drummers who can groove in 7/8. |
12-17-2011, 11:05 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Redding CA | | I go to the older Royal Hunt stuff for practicing (John West years) , partially because John gave me one of the 2006 videos. Royal Hunt-The Mission (Marcus Jidell) - YouTube
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12-17-2011, 11:23 PM
| | | | I suggest listening to TOOL, especially there newer albums like Aenima, Lateralus and 10,000 Days.
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12-19-2011, 09:31 AM
|  | Registered User | | | | | hey, wait a minute.....
it is "progressive", right? why don't you try adding what you think fits and makes it better music. instead of mimiccing tool, dream theater, etc. (no offense anyone, those are great bands), maybe throwing in some jazz, or locked-in groove is just what the music needs.
unless, of course, the lead has something specific in mind, then he/she needs to tell you.
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12-19-2011, 09:41 AM
| | | | I don't know how relevant this will be to what you are doing but it will be something decent to check out anyways.
The bassist for Opeth, Martin Mendez, is pretty good. Listen to Blackwater Park where he was still mostly following rhythm guitar. There is the song The Drapery Falls where he gets to shine. But it's still quite limited. Then listen to Watershed (or better yet, the new album). See what he's been doing in that style of music. |
12-19-2011, 09:56 AM
| | Registered User
Hi-fi into an old tube amp | | Join Date: May 2005 Location: SW | | Ryan Martini / Mudvayne... great prog metal bass Mudvayne - Death blooms - YouTube
If you are doing more recent styles of prog metal you should orient yourself by listening to Meshuggah. Meshuggah - In Death - Is Death - YouTube
A few other thoughts-
Jazz tone won't work well in metal. To cut through you'll need a harsh sound (which will mellow out in the mix).
I am not sure where you are coming from in terms of "groove" but in metal, generally, the groove you'll want is more mechanical and harder in nature. With your RH use punchy attacks and harder mutes than you'd use in less violent styles.
I wouldnt worry so much about scales, I'd focus on rhythm first.
If you are feeling lost in a time sense, maybe you need to learn more about time signatures (I'm assuming you guys play with that stuff, but you might not since many starting out prog bands aren't really in the deep waters of technical-ness). It's really odd at first and will throw what you know about groove out the window. 7/8 or 5/4 will make most traditional cats squirm or give up.
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Last edited by chaosMK : 12-19-2011 at 10:05 AM.
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12-19-2011, 12:55 PM
| | | | Thanks for the Suggestions of Dream Theater guys My playing kinda sounds like his when I jam with the Progressive Band Im playing with =DDDDDD
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12-21-2011, 08:05 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Austin, TX | |
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