Sight reading and key signatures - does thinking in scale positions help?

Eminentbass · #1 07-02-2010, 01:44 PM

I'm preparing for some upcoming pit work and while my reading is getting better and I'm getting more efficient with rhythms and note recognition, what confounds me is the amount of modulations that occur in musical theatre. Does it help to think in terms of the scale positions specific to the key signature so that if a song has five flats in it for example, then I'm seeing the notes as intervals relating to the key and scale pattern unless a chromatic is specified? I'm usually ok when dealing with one key but some these songs modulate every 8 bars or so.

The other reason I have for asking this is that I'm reasonably efficient at position shifts when doing scales up and down the neck so I was wondering if relating what's on the page to scales would make it easier when dealing with moving around the neck when looking at the music.

JimmyM · #2 07-02-2010, 03:54 PM

it works on a very limited basis but only as a last resort when you can't think of anything else to do. the reason is you're always going to get thrown for loops. maybe you'll have a note or two out of the key, maybe you'll have a jump that's impossible for you to find your scale position at all times, things like that. going strictly by positions and shapes will end up screwing you at some point. if you do the hard work and memorize where all the notes are and forget about shapes, you will know where you are at all times. if you go by shapes, you're going to get lost sooner or later, usually sooner than later.

MalcolmAmos · #3 07-02-2010, 04:21 PM

Let the sheet music's standard notation tell you what note to use. Take a # 2 pencil and notate the sharps etc for each measure that standard notation expects you to know about. Make notes in the margins.

Good luck.

Eminentbass · #4 07-03-2010, 02:07 AM

Thanks guys. It's going to take some grunt work. I generally mark a huge circle around the key signatures but it takes a quick mental shift to adjust at tempo and remember that a key change has occurred, especially when one song actually modulates to Cb(?!). The other thing I'm having to do is getting used to scanning the music in advance to mark off where big jumps are so that I don't just play below the fifth fret and then get taken by surprise. Working through "Standing in the shadows of Motown" has at least made the syncopation a lot easier to manage

slybass3000 · #5 07-03-2010, 08:26 AM

Sight reading and key signatures - does thinking in scale positions help?

Absolutely !!!

Scottgun · #6 07-03-2010, 08:34 AM

If this is your first pit group, get a pencil and mark up that chart like it's going out of style. Add the the sharps and flats to the notes even though they are part of the key sig. The director is going to make you mark it up anyway with all the vamps, adjustments and what not. Might as well put in stuff that help you figure out what is going on modulation wise. I assume there are a good number of rehearsals. By the end of them you should be a master of modulation. Just dive in and do your best.

Phil Smith · #7 07-03-2010, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slybass3000

Sight reading and key signatures - does thinking in scale positions help?

Absolutely !!!

Thinking actually gets in the way. You need to do enough reading where you can just react to what you see on the page because you recognize stuff and already know where the notes are. Lots of practice and lots of reading.

JTE · #8 07-03-2010, 08:59 AM

Thinking in scale position doesn't help me, if you mean that Ab puts you in 3rd position while B natural is 6th position.

A. I look at the scale as a selection of notes that are found all over the neck. For PLAYING G major isn't G A B C D E F# G. It's B C D E F# G A B C D E F# G A etc. until I run out of notes if I'm playing my 5-string.

B. I'm thinking intervals and scale degrees; this section is in Ab and starts on the 5, goes up a half-step, up a third, etc. I'm not thinking note names much.

John

JimmyM · #9 07-03-2010, 09:06 AM

modulating to Cb is lame, btw. why not just use B? bad arranger.

Eminentbass · #10 07-03-2010, 09:09 AM

This is the third time in the pit. The first two were just depping on amateur productions of Funny Girl and The Producers, which involved some serious modulations but the bass parts were mostly cut time root/five lines and the hardest part was keeping up with the tempos and paying attention to the conductor during pauses. This time it's a revue of various Broadway shows. I've been given the music quite a way in advance to be able to prepare. It includes some stuff from The Heights, which seems to contain some funky syncopated lines with upper register fills written in. There's some West Side Story stuff as well which has the challenge of time signature changes.

I think my main concern is that I want my playing to be as natural as possible, so I'm having to learn how to move out of the "safe" lower positions and get used to playing where I would naturally play if I wasn't reading.

Eminentbass · #11 07-03-2010, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

modulating to Cb is lame, btw. why not just use B? bad arranger.

I think it might be due to it being brass heavy music. That's the reason I was given at any rate.

JimmyM · #12 07-03-2010, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eminentbass

I think it might be due to it being brass heavy music. That's the reason I was given at any rate.

what? that makes no sense. the brass has nothing to do with whether you write it in B or Cb. now i know it's a bad arranger. oh well, i get bad arranging all the time on charts. nothing you can do except go with it.

tomshepp · #13 07-03-2010, 09:22 AM

I try to get the book ahead of time, then practice with the original sound track. Some things from the book don't line up with the track, but you get the music in your ear. As you go through it, make notes of passages or sections that require attention. You can do this kind of thing in rehearsal as well. Once the show starts, it's best to be playing as naturally as possible. That way, even in a fast two, it's as musical as possible. MHO

Eminentbass · #14 07-03-2010, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

what? that makes no sense. the brass has nothing to do with whether you write it in B or Cb. now i know it's a bad arranger. oh well, i get bad arranging all the time on charts. nothing you can do except go with it.

Yup. It was an official score book for The Producers, which had a lot of inconsistencies. The first act had a lot of cut time and the second act had songs that were played with the same 2 feel but were scored in 4/4. Some of the arrangements I'm looking at now were done by our musical director who arranged them on Sibelius, which seems to do some unconventional things with regards to rhythms, rests or ties. Fortunately I've got a few weeks to familiarize myself with the music and scribble all over the pages.