So...tri-tones

[bass555]

the flatted 5th, Sharp 4th, the devil's interval, the "jazz 5th", etc etc...


whaddya think?

[Wrong Robot]

Tritones have a lot of really neat theoretical applications, and their place in modern theory can be pretty interesting. But, I find that often times people use tritones and it sounds like they are using them to create dissonance for dissonance's sake, while that mightn't be the case for many acts, I do hear tritones often and think "was that really necessary?"

[SteveC]

Works great for chord substitutions in jazz.

[burntgorilla]

I know of the first two, but I've never heard of the other two. Have they anything to do with submediants and dominants, or am I way off beam?

[akuma12]

Great for creating tension in music too. It's one of those intervals that feels like it needs to be finished. Especially when you keep thinking of the Simpson's theme because your ear training instructor drilled it into your head

[WillBuckingham]

Burntgorilla, "flatted 5th, Sharp 4th, the devil's interval, the "jazz 5th"" all refer to the same interval: seven half steps.

[scorpionldr]

a lot of good metal riffs can derive from tritones

[Marcus Willett]

Originally Posted by Wrong Robot

I find that often times people use tritones and it sounds like they are using them to create dissonance for dissonance's sake...I do hear tritones often and think "was that really necessary?"

+1

Bass players are notorious for using the tri-tone sub just because. (FYI to anyone who might wonder...tri-tone stands for 3 tones, another word for a step, as in three whole steps from the first note). Or putting in the famous Jaco upper register tri-tone lick. Cool, but it's been done to death.

[FractalUniverse]

if you played a tritone in medieval times they would cut your head off... "diabolus in musica" or something like that

[floydbass]

*cough* YYZ*cough*

[pklima]

Originally Posted by FractalUniverse

if you played a tritone in medieval times they would cut your head off... "diabolus in musica" or something like that

That had probably had more to do with tritones being difficult to sing in tune - especially when you have a choir of monks and some of them are lousy singers. A lot of traditional folk styles avoid tritones in the melody to this day.

Death and black metal melodies, on the other hand, will often avoid ascending intervals other than the tritone, minor third and minor or major second.

[PlayTheBass]

Originally Posted by bass555

the flatted 5th, Sharp 4th, the devil's interval, the "jazz 5th", etc etc...


whaddya think?

I think tritones are kinda like the letters 'K' and 'Q' -- they work great in some sentences, but not so well in others. I'm glad they're in the alphabet because sometimes nothing else will do! But... it all depends on the context. You can't force it, for sure.

[steveksux]

Cool color notes to add, if you don't overdo it.

Take a D7 (dom), the F#(3rd or 10th) and the C (7th) are a tritone apart. Hit them both at the same time up high, adds some neat tension.

Interestingly enough, the same notes (F# and C) roles are reversed for the A flat dom 7 (C becomes 3rd, Gflat becomes 7th), so it works equally well for both chords. Always thought that was cool.

Randy

[ajb2804]

First of all,I enjoy using tri-tone intervals in my solos to create tension and release.For burntgorilla,an explanation of the tri-tone substitution is in order.In jazz,when a dominant 7th chord is called out ,you can substitute a dominant 7th chord a tri-tone away.Ex. C7 to Fsharp 7.This works because the 3rd and 7th in C7,(the E and Bflat),are also present in the F sharp 7(B flat being the 3rd and E being the 7th).I hope this helps your creativity and enjoyment of the gift of music!

[Aaron Saunders]

Personally, I think the "jazz fifth" (and other names, what-have-you) sounds far better as a raised eleventh/flattened 12th as a chord tension, rather 1st octave chord tone.

Example -- go to the nearest keyboard, and hit a regular ol' Fsus2 chord with the 1st, 2nd, and 5th (starting on the F two octaves below middle C.) Then, on top, toss the B right below middle C. Sounds kinda neat, doesn't it?

[burntgorilla]

Thanks for the explanations. However, taking the C7 example, why is it F#7? From what I can see, F from C is a tritone, so I must have misunderstood something somewhere. By this, if A7 was called, could you substitute in a D#7?

Oh wait, I see. It's a sharpened fourth interval, which would give the sharp.

[Pacman]

Moved to General Instruction. Where lots of people would do well reading some other threads about tritone subsitution, chord tones, extensions, etc, etc....

[Bruce Lindfield]

Originally Posted by FractalUniverse

if you played a tritone in medieval times they would cut your head off... "diabolus in musica" or something like that

But we don't live then - we live now!! So it's just a part of musical theory that has been explored for many centuries.

They'd cut your head off for stealing a lof of bread then - thank goodness we live in more enlightened times!!

We don't get hanged for suggesting that the Earth is not the centre of the universe either!!

[quallabone]

Tritones are just another interval. No more important than a P5 or a P8. If we didn't have tritones we wouldn't have dominant chords which would make modulations quite a bit less believable. No 1/2 diminished chords either. The applications are endless. They're just another tool that every musician should have.

[Jazzin']

When I improvise in the dorian scale, I enjoy "overdoing" the the use of the 6th and the 3rd or the 3rd and the 6th consecutively (tritone). I love the sound of them together. I dig it!