Tackling Modes

[SimplyChaotic]

Alright, so I think we all know that it's almost essential to practice theory, Which I do, to an extent. But I've also been shying away from learning scales. I know pentatonics, and a lot of patterns by ear, but I know I'm gonna need to learn all of my full 7 note scales (8 if you count that octave) across the fretboard soon. And those pesky modes. Anyone know any ways of making this a little less painful? Websites? Lessons? Vids? Thanks a bunch.

[quale213]

A room with a lock

[4bpauly]

just learn the major scale... really well! in all keys and with all different fingering options (starting on different fingers.... different strings)

then just figure out from there the modes all contain those notes, so for the 2nd mode (dorian) start on the second note of the major scale and go to the second (for example, in C.. start on D and play D E F G A B C D..)

then phrygian (3rd mode) start on the E

or you could take private lessons and you may find it easier.

[mambo4]

I swear I copy and paste this old post of mine at least twice a day here

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THEORY PROGRESSION
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Theory can seem like a quagmire to those who are starting out, and it's often difficult to know just how important a particular aspect of it is. I will say that learning how chords are built from scales is the most important aspect of theory. It is far more useful to understand chord construction than to memorize all those "Scales A and B go with chord X" formulas.

I'd say the logical progression learning music theory is kinda like this:

1.) learn the major scale, and how it's constructed
2.) learn the minor scale and the dominant scale and how it relates to the major scale (i.e.; its the V and vi mode)
3.) understand how other 4 modes of the major scale are derived (less important to memorize these other modes at first)
4.) Learn how to harmonize the notes of a major and minor scale by building chords / stacking thirds.
5.) Learn to look at common chord progressions as "numerals" (eg, I-IV-V ect) to understand how the chords relate to the song's key.
7.) Learn arppegios/chord tones, and pentatonic scales for major/minor/dominant scales.
8.) dive back into modes for more detailed ideas about what "goes" with what chord.

Bass playing is basically a matter of knowing what to play over various chords. It may seem daunting at first, but my practical experience (bass in pop/rock) has been that I mostly use Major, Minor, and Dominant 7 related bassline patterns, usually based on chord tones and pentatonics.
Even if you're playing some guitar oriented riff-rock, each riff is going to imply a chord of some kind.

85%+ of the time, you will be going from root note to root note as the chords change. The trick learning is how to do it with a groove and feel that is stylistically appropriate to the song. The best way to reach stylistic understanding is to learn songs you like and pick them apart to see how the bassline relates to the chords.

If Jazz is your thing, you will probably be learning theory forever.
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[4bpauly]

well put.

[chicagodoubler]

Make sure you understand these concepts on a keyboard, and can sing the scales as well. Mechanical mastery of this stuff is only the first of many steps.

[David1234]

This table helped me remember the basic modes. Note the # shape that has a # at the middle of it, and the way the flats always hang down to the right both when you zoom in on each quarter of the table, and when you zoom out and look at it over-all.

The "I Don't Party Like Madonna Ane Lenny" sentence helped me remember the names, which I can't spell but can say (!!) with the obvious exception of the two whose names start with L. Just remember Lydian is in the middle right next to mixolydian.

[Slax]

The way I learned my modes, not to use them per say in a musical context, is to think of them scale degrees of a major scale where the tonal center is the start of the mode. Like people said above. Playing in dorian is like starting at the 2nd as of a major scale, using the 2nd as a tonal center as apposed to the 1st. (And so on through the modes)

[Stumbo]

History and explanation of modes
http://www.traditionalmusic.co.uk/sf...smodeguide.htm

[Dave Muscato]

I don't think in scales and modes anymore. I learned them that way (classical Western music theory classes), but once you know the fretboard, they're all just notes. I don't even think in keys anymore. I actually have gotten past the habit of thinking in intervals, chord tones, and scale degrees, and just listen with my ears and use the fretboard as a one collective palette. You should know your scales & modes, but they're all just notes in the end. There are only 12 notes, and all of them can work in anything if you want them to.

I think understanding tonal harmony and having a grasp of the fretboard as a whole are more important than memorizing fingering patterns. Running scales & modes are good technical exercises but that's not where music comes from.

Don't get me wrong; learn them, but don't play them. Just look at the piece in context, and play what fits.

I know that doesn't sound very helpful, but a big turning point in my playing was realizing that scales and modes are limitations as much as they are guides.