Is there any hope?

jordan-z · #1 06-05-2008, 02:07 AM

I've been playing bass for quite some time (far to embarrassed to say how long) and my theory is still close to nonexistent. I know I have the technique to be a pretty decent bassist but I feel that not knowing where I can go, or what I can do at different times is really, really holding me back. This leads me to the question of, where do I begin!?! I've been reading through countless pages about beginning intervals, modes, scales and the like, but I'm not sure where I can build a steady foundation to build on. I know that lessons would be the smartest thing to invest in, and I plan on looking for a teacher (again) sometime in the near future, but I think that I can learn a lot with the resources I have now. Thats where all of you kind people fit in. What should I focus on to start stepping up my chops, to what I'm hoping, will be a whole new level!

Dave Muscato · #2 06-05-2008, 02:18 AM

Oh, wow, where to start... Teoria.com has some great resources. Gary Willis has some great books. Berklee has some WONDERFUL online courses, although they're not cheap. Lessons would be best. Check YouTube or Expert Village for free video lessons. Check out the Sticky links on the top of this forum, too. Lots of good stuff here!

fearceol · #3 06-05-2008, 03:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jordan-z

I know that lessons would be the smartest thing to invest in, and I plan on looking for a teacher (again) sometime in the near future,

You've answered you own question here.

Apart from teaching you scales, modes, ect a good teacher can motivate you and keep you going in the right direction. My advice is, dont put it on the long finger. Start taking lessons as soon as you can.

Deacon_Blues · #4 06-05-2008, 03:27 AM

Start playing something different - learn some walking bass over some jazz standards, play some latin (samba, salsa, bossa nova, rumba...), funk, pop, roc0, country etc etc. Use some books or online lessons to get started, and listen analytically to a lot of music in these genres. I mentioned jazz first, because that helped me build up my theory knowledge better than any other music. Extremely helpful.

And of course: +1000000 to lessons.

ganga · #5 06-05-2008, 04:16 AM

I'm just wondering: What do you need the theory for? How will it help and develop you as a player?

The best way to learn this is from a teacher and try to apply it to the music you play. Don't buy books until you've learned some basics from someone who can help you. The foundation is the most important phase where you really need to be solid. After that it gets pretty easy to build on top of it. It's like learning to do math. 2+2 makes no sense in the beginning, but after a while you can do rocket science.

Remember not to be too focused on theory when writing/playing (unless you're stuck of course, then it's a great way to get on).

Remember to start from scratch even though you've played for a long time. Shoot your ego with a gun and throw it in a grave.

cowsgomoo · #6 06-05-2008, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jordan-z

I've been playing bass for quite some time (far to embarrassed to say how long) and my theory is still close to nonexistent. I know I have the technique to be a pretty decent bassist but I feel that not knowing where I can go, or what I can do at different times is really, really holding me back. This leads me to the question of, where do I begin!?! I've been reading through countless pages about beginning intervals, modes, scales and the like, but I'm not sure where I can build a steady foundation to build on. I know that lessons would be the smartest thing to invest in, and I plan on looking for a teacher (again) sometime in the near future, but I think that I can learn a lot with the resources I have now. Thats where all of you kind people fit in. What should I focus on to start stepping up my chops, to what I'm hoping, will be a whole new level!

you've mentioned theory & technique, but the most important thing a musician can have is a good ear

since you've been playing music for a while, your ear ought to be developed to a certain extent, so you should always be looking to relate the theory you learn to harmony, melody & rhythms that you already recognized but didn't know the names of

if your ear can't recognize a 'music theory concept' when you hear it, then just knowing about it is completely pointless... it's like knowing lots of recipes but never actually cooking... or, worse still... never actually cooking but using your knowledge to impress others on cooking-related web forums

jordan-z · #7 06-05-2008, 10:24 PM

Thanks for all the advice, but I was kind of looking for some specific things that I could start out with. What would you teachers out there start teaching a new student (keep in mind I have been playing for some time)?

Stumbo · #8 06-05-2008, 10:35 PM

What kind of music do you play? like?
Learn the blues. Turn the bass down on tunes you like and play along.
Get tab of the songs you like and learn.
Get some "slow downer" software (Transcribe! has been mentioned several times around TB).
Keep a notebook with all the songs you learn. Review regularly.
Go listen to some live music.

Don't worry to much about theory.
You gotta play the music!

fearceol · #9 06-06-2008, 02:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jordan-z

Thanks for all the advice, but I was kind of looking for some specific things that I could start out with.

I'd say you've got some excellent advice here regarding this.

A teacher can assess you, talk to you or advise about the specific things you want/need to do and then teach/guide you accordingly.

namraj · #10 06-06-2008, 03:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganga

I'm just wondering: What do you need the theory for? How will it help and develop you as a player?

this is a joke right?
knowing your neck is the most useful thing a bass player can do, in every situation, gives to the ability to improvise in any key for any genre and do it interestingly and on the spot.

Deacon_Blues · #11 06-06-2008, 05:48 AM

I think I gave you some specific advice as what to practice. Learn to walk through some jazz tunes. As a bonus you will learn a lot of theory that is applicable in most other music you'll ever play. You can also pick more poppy tunes like "Street Life" by The Crusaders feat. Randy Crawford, and play along to the chord changes. You can find a lead sheet of the tune in one of the new real books (IIRC) if you can't figure out the chords by ear. They are a bit tricky in the B part and that's why they're useful to learn. It forces you to play what the chords require and you can't stick to one and the same scale throughout the whole tune like you can in a lot of pop and rock music.

Even if you'll never play a jazz tune on a gig, you have a LOT to gain by learning some jazz. If you can find a teacher to help you with this, you will learn even more...

MakiSupaStar · #12 06-06-2008, 10:07 AM

Play with people. The fastest way to learn is by jamming with people. You've got the best jamming instrument on the planet, IMO. So, it shouldn't be too hard to find people to play with.

Bassbasixx · #13 06-06-2008, 10:36 AM

Funny thing I am in the same boat, I don't know lots of theory,but do know some basic scales and have pretty good feel., and have been in several bands and recording projects. If I new how to cut and paste on the computer i would post a link of my last recording I did bass tracks on. The project was called TALL LIKE GOD and it is on myspace. To answer your question I have been going on youtube and finding lots of new information and learning some new tricks and it is free, also I have never been in a cover band and I am going to join one to have some fun and improve my playing. trying new styles as well funk, disco, blues what ever sounds fun to play and I think it is making my skills broader. Hope this Helps.

Stumbo · #14 06-06-2008, 10:46 AM

When you are learning a tune, apply your theory. Figure out the key, the scale, the chords and the melody. Create a lead sheet to document everything. Learn the bass line and then as an exercise, improvise a new bass line based on the theory.

Stumbo · #15 06-06-2008, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bassbasixx

If I new how to cut and paste on the computer i would post a link of my last recording I did bass tracks on. The project was called TALL LIKE GOD and it is on myspace.

When you're on MySpace, highlight the web address and right click. YOu should see a menu, choose "Copy". Go over to TB and when you're typing a reply, right click and choose "Paste".

StyleOverShow · #16 06-06-2008, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jordan-z

I've been playing bass for quite some time (far to embarrassed to say how long) and my theory is still close to nonexistent.

Just started lessons for the first time in decades. I'm a very experienced hack, have good to very good technique, can read and have taken harmony and counterpoint in college (theory stuff).

The instructor asked me to play a few things: F blues; and sight read a bass line chart. He recognized 'my patterns' and suggested ways to break them up (half stepping, in the pocket playing). Suggested I loose the embellishments and get back to the basics. His suggestions and homework assignments were right on.

Get to an instructor, teacher, sensei or bass guru, as cheaply as possible. If they are worth their salt you will come out of the lesson with new thoughts in your head.

MarkTAW · #17 06-06-2008, 11:26 AM

It's tough to give you pointers if we don't know exactly where you are.

onlyclave · #18 06-06-2008, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StyleOverShow

Just started lessons for the first time in decades. I'm a very experienced hack, have good to very good technique, can read and have taken harmony and counterpoint in college (theory stuff).

The instructor asked me to play a few things: F blues; and sight read a bass line chart. He recognized 'my patterns' and suggested ways to break them up (half stepping, in the pocket playing). Suggested I loose the embellishments and get back to the basics. His suggestions and homework assignments were right on.

Get to an instructor, teacher, sensei or bass guru, as cheaply as possible. If they are worth their salt you will come out of the lesson with new thoughts in your head.

Sounds like your lesson was a good experience.

Mike Shevlin · #19 06-06-2008, 11:37 AM

You can also spend some time learning another instrument. I strung a six string bass like an octave lower guitar & study guitar charts & chords. Piano is another good choice where your left hand takes on some amazing bass lines. I played the tuba in high school & even THAT changed my playing.

Bassbasixx · #20 06-06-2008, 12:52 PM

http://www.myspace.com/tall_like_god Wow that was easy thanks feel free to comment on my playing I have my fire suit on this is all me on all bass tracks except a little shot. the singer is Martin Milners son if any you remember his dads tv show. If you click the pics there is a picture of me. this was by far the freakiest music I ever did tracks on keep in mind I do not know a whole lot of theory but I get by. I used a little Swr working mans 12 for this project I got a little mention in the bio Enjoy