Understanding what is the root note and key

[Tylerrr51]

Im a noob when it comes to scales and the site ive found has diagrams of scales on the neck, for example, http://www.musicopedia.com/scales/6-bass.php. the key is C but wouldnt you play the open B first making it in the key of B? how do you figure out what key it is based on a scale?

My question is based off the link I put in the question.

Yet again im a noob to music theory and scales

[Jazz Ad]

A scale is defined by a suite of intervals, not by a starting note.
C major is CDEFGAB. If you start it on D and play DEFGABCD, it still is a major C scale.

[Tylerrr51]

Originally Posted by Jazz Ad

A scale is defined by a suite of intervals, not by a starting note.
C major is CDEFGAB. If you start it on D and play DEFGABCD, it still is a major C scale.

How do I determine the suite of intervals?

[pacojas]

Originally Posted by Jazz Ad

A scale is defined by a suite of intervals, not by a starting note.
C major is CDEFGAB. If you start it on D and play DEFGABCD, it still is a major C scale.

but if you start on "A" and use all the same notes in the "C" major scale, the scale becomes "A"minor,... correct?

[HogieWan]

Originally Posted by pacojas

but if you start on "A" and use all the same notes in the "C" major scale, the scale becomes "A"minor,... correct?

right

to the OP, the first chord does not have to be the same as the key.

[Chunk-O-Funk]

Originally Posted by pacojas

but if you start on "A" and use all the same notes in the "C" major scale, the scale becomes "A"minor,... correct?

Sort of. The scale does not "become" A minor. A minor happens to be the relative minor scale of C major, but the intervals are in a different order. Every major scale has a relative natural minor scale that shares the same notes, but is not the same scale.




To the OP:

Look at it in steps. A half step and a whole step.
A half step is one fret on a guitar. A whole step is two frets.

(R=root note, W=whole step H=half step)
Major Scale: R, W, W, H, W, W, W, H
Natural Minor Scale: R, W, H, W, W, H, W, W

If you use that formula you should be able to figure out the notes (with their sharps and flats) in any major or minor scale, assuming you know the notes on the neck. If you stick with correct notes in that scale you can start and finish the scale with any note and remain in that scale. You do not have to start on the root. However, to get the sound of a major scale in your head it should be played from root to octave (preferably two octaves). Hearing the difference of a major scale and a minor scale is an important step to developing a good musical ear.

[HogieWan]

Originally Posted by Chunk-O-Funk

Sort of. The scale does not "become" A minor.

but the song is said to be in "A minor"

[Chunk-O-Funk]

Originally Posted by HogieWan

but the song is said to be in "A minor"

What song?



What I was trying to say is if you are playing the notes A to it's octave A you are no longer playing a C major scale. It's A minor because of it's intervals.

I think what you and pacojas are talking about is playing a minor scale over a major chord.

[dalconthenovice]

every key has a different collection of notes that make it a key for example, if you'r playing a G major Scale? even if you don't start on G its still the G major scale, well... list those notes out and anytime you hear a track with those notes and it matches its in g major

do ya dig?

[kr0n]

Originally Posted by Tylerrr51

How do I determine the suite of intervals?

Originally Posted by Chunk-O-Funk

Look at it in steps. A half step and a whole step.
A half step is one fret on a guitar. A whole step is two frets.

(R=root note, W=whole step H=half step)
Major Scale: R, W, W, H, W, W, W, H
Natural Minor Scale: R, W, H, W, W, H, W, W

If it wasn't clear yet, you apply those intervals to the list of notes.
A A#/Bb B C C#/Db D D#/Eb E F F#/Gb G G#/Ab

A Major
 W W  H W W  W  H
A B C# D E F# G# a

So that formula refers to the distance of the notes from each other.

[MalcolmAmos]

Originally Posted by kr0n

If it wasn't clear yet, you apply those intervals to the list of notes.
A A#/Bb B C C#/Db D D#/Eb E F F#/Gb G G#/Ab

A Major
 W W  H W W  W  H
A B C# D E F# G# a

So that formula refers to the distance of the notes from each other.

Dead on! Apply the WWHWWWH to a chromatic scale and you end up with the Major scale for the note you started on, now --- those notes in whatever order are still the notes in that major scale.
Key signature has three sharps, i.e. ### tick off your memory peg - God Destroy All - three ### = A Major or F# minor and here are the notes in each of those scales:

I'm a chart guy, here is a present.

Major Scale Chart
C D E F G A B...............Notice the C scale has no Sharps
G A B C D E F#.............and the G scale has one, the F#
D E F# G A B C#...........and the D scale keeps the F# and
A B C# D E F# G#.........adds the C#. Then the A scale keeps
E F# G# A B C# D#.......everything and adds the G#. See how
B C# D# E F# G# A#.....it builds on it's self.
F# G# A# B C# D# E#
C# D# E# F# G# A# B#
F G A Bb C D E.............Look what happens with the flat scales
Bb C D Eb F G A...........F has one the Bb, then the Bb scale keeps
Eb F G Ab Bb C D.........it's self and adds the the Eb. Same thing
Ab Bb C Db Eb F G.......the sharp scales did...
Db Eb F Gb Ab Bb C
Gb Ab Bb Cb Db Eb F
Cb Db Eb Fb Gb Ab Bb

Memory pegs:
See God Destroy All Earth By F#irey C#haos. Order of the scale that have sharps. C has none, G has one, etc.
Fat Cats Go Down Alleys Eating Birds. Order of the sharps - C has none, G has the F#, etc.
Farmer Brown Eats Apple Dumplings Greasley Cooked. Order of the flats.

Natural Minor Scale Chart
A B C D E F G ................Notice how the 6th column of the
E F# G A B C D................Major scale becomes the 1st column
B C# D E F# G A..............in the minor scale and how the 7th
F# G# A B C# D E............column of the Major scale is now the
C# D# E F# G# A B..........2nd column in the minor scale. And
G# A# B C# D# E F#........yep, the 1st column in the Major scale
D# E# F# G# A# B C#......is now the 3rd column, etc. etc.
A# B# C# D# E# F# G#....Ask your self why?
D E F G A Bb C
G A Bb C D Eb F
C D Eb F G Ab Bb
F G Ab Bb C Db Eb
Bb C Db Eb F Gb Ab
Eb F Gb Ab Bb Cb Db
Ab Bb Cb Db Eb Fb Gb

Now those scales are used to produce the chords in the keys. Here is a chart on that.
http://www.ezfolk.com/uke/Tutorials/...ord-chart.html

Have fun.

[lolaviola]

Start and end the scale on C, and you will get the tonality of C major. If you want, you can start on the C, go down to B, and back up and down the whole scale, back to C, B, C. This way you're always starting and stopping on C.

It is important to ingrain the major scale tonal quality, and, once mastered, then you can go off into other scales from there.

I'd even give every root note a little stress, like this: DA, dit, dit, dit, dit, dit, dit, DA, dit, dit, dit, dit, dit dit, DA.

[kr0n]

Circle of Fifths is a great tool for those. When you can remember BEADGCF you're nearly there