What chords go over E Phrygian

[WarriorJoe7]

I have a bass line that is in the E Phrygian mode (E minor scale with flat 2nd.)

So what chords can my guitar player play over that? If he plays single notezs he would just use the same scale but I don't know how to figure out what chords go over it.

Joe

[HaVIC5]

Em, E7sus4, E7sus4(b9), D-/E, F/E.

Just a few that imply a modal phrygian sound.

[BassieMike]

E Phrygian uses the same notes as C major. So, Cma7, Dm7, Em7, Fma7, G7, Am7, Bm7b5. Other extensions of these chords can be used for color/tension.

-mike

[EADG mx]

I find it easier to do it the other way around - use a mode or scale according to the harmony (chords).

unless you've got a bassline based on E phrygian already that you just cannot abandon

[WarriorJoe7]

Yeah I came up with the bassline originally and the guitarist doesn't like it since he can't figure out anything.

I knew about it being the same notes as c major but does that really work with chords that you could play C maj even though the bassline is in E Phrygian?

[mutedeity]

It really depends on the context and application of the chord to the piece of music. Theoretically you can use any chord over any scale.
You can approach things the way that HaVIC5 or BassieMike have suggested, which is taking notes from the scale in various combinations. Also I agree with EADG mx that it can be easier to apply a melody to a harmonic context.

On the other hand, depending on what you are doing you can have chords that have elements outside of the scale and vice-versa. For example, you might want to have a dominant. In E this will be B7 but to have B7 you need the notes D# and F#. You can apply these two notes or you can even get away with just the D# and omit the 5th. There is really no end to what is possible though.

[EADG mx]

Originally Posted by WarriorJoe7

Yeah I came up with the bassline originally and the guitarist doesn't like it since he can't figure out anything.

I knew about it being the same notes as c major but does that really work with chords that you could play C maj even though the bassline is in E Phrygian?

There's no way to really answer that question... to sum it up, they will have the same notes but a different tonality. Without seeing or hearing your bassline and the guitar part, I can't tell you what will work and what won't.

If you want to get really philosophical, what sounds good to you is what really "works", isn't it?

[DocBop]

Phrygian most consider a minor mode with a very Spanish sound. To create the sound of a mode is use the modes root chord. Being the third mode of the major scale that would be a mi7 chord. So if lets say Emi7 for example.

Modes are typical used in static, one chord vamp the and tend to change key like So What from the classic Miles Davis Kind of Blue album. So it goes from Dmi7 and then Ebmi7 and back. So two chords and two keys not two modes.

Chordally to imply the sound of a mode KB and GTR will comp on the root chord and the two triads that imply the modes sound. In this case the E Phrygian you would use Emi7 and throw in some F and G triads. I will do this in my bass lines sometimes throw in double stop of F and A, G and B.

I hear ya why F and G triads? To imply the sound of a mode comp on the IV and V chord major triads of the Parent scale of the mode. So being we are using E Phrygian it is the third mode of C Major. The IV and V of C major is F and G.

Kind of a hard topic to explain so I hope it is clear enough.

[MarkTAW]

Phrygian is a wonderfully moody mode. The dense arrangement of notes around the root give it a vaguely mid-eastern feel, but it also makes it difficult to arrange with *full* chords (root, 3rd, 5th).

Your guitarist can purposefully leave the E vague by not playing any third and letting your riff define the majorness or minorness of the key. If your riff is playful enough, he may be better off doing a simple drone on E (with possibly a B thrown in) and let you play over it, or he can double you and you can take turns droning while riffing/soloing.

Treat this as an intro & then put the song in a more usable key.

[LowBSix]

E Phrygian is the same as Dorian, which is the same as a major scale begining on the II.
Diatonically, they would be in the key of D:
Em-F#m-G-A-Bm-C#m7(b)5-D
II - III -IV-V-VI - VII - VIII/I

[MarkTAW]

Originally Posted by LowBSix

E Phrygian is the same as Dorian, which is the same as a major scale begining on the II.
Diatonically, they would be in the key of D:
Em-F#m-G-A-Bm-C#m7(b)5-D
II - III -IV-V-VI - VII - VIII/I

I doubt he's referring to *that* phrygian mode, but rather the modern one that would be - E, F, G, A, B, C, D.

Wikipedia says sus(4)b(9) is a popular chord to play over this mode.

These guys seem to know a bit more about it than these guys.

[projectMalamute]

Originally Posted by LowBSix

E Phrygian is the same as Dorian, which is the same as a major scale begining on the II.
Diatonically, they would be in the key of D:
Em-F#m-G-A-Bm-C#m7(b)5-D
II - III -IV-V-VI - VII - VIII/I

I'm not sure I agree with you a hundred percent on your police work, there, Lou.

[WarriorJoe7]

Yes I was referring to the E Phrygian which includes E-F-G-A-B-C-D

my basic bass line is 1-1-5-6-8-9-9-8-9-8... so i know the rhythm isn't here but if that helps.

[ras1983]

Originally Posted by WarriorJoe7

Yes I was referring to the E Phrygian which includes E-F-G-A-B-C-D

my basic bass line is 1-1-5-6-8-9-9-8-9-8... so i know the rhythm isn't here but if that helps.

I have a question: Are you playing chord changes or a bass line? Because that will make things a little different depending on what you are playing...

it might be easier if you could post up a chord chart... which of those notes are chord changes and which are just passing notes? (it may be easier to tell us which ones are on the first beat of a bar to begin with)

That way its sort of easier to help you find chords that fit your bassline.

[WarriorJoe7]

It is a bass line and it is all in E, the first E is on the one and the rest of it fills out a 4/4 bar. I of course have some fills and variations but that is the main riff.

I guess it would have been better to say the bass line over one 4/4 bar is E0-E0-B1-C1-E1-F1-F1-E1-F1-E1. I know the rhythm from playing it but I don't know notes get which values. I don't read or write musical notation or do sightreading.

[ras1983]

Originally Posted by WarriorJoe7

It is a bass line and it is all in E, the first E is on the one and the rest of it fills out a 4/4 bar. I of course have some fills and variations but that is the main riff.

I guess it would have been better to say the bass line over one 4/4 bar is E0-E0-B1-C1-E1-F1-F1-E1-F1-E1. I know the rhythm from playing it but I don't know notes get which values. I don't read or write musical notation or do sightreading.

thats ok. It is common for chord changes to happen on the 1st or 3rd measure of a bar.

THIS IS NOT A RULE - there are MANY songs where chord changes occur in very unusual places, I'm just saying that it is common for chord changes to occur on beats 1 & 3.

To begin with, try and find which notes are on the 1 of each bar (without knowing how many bars your bassline goes for it makes things a little difficult) and get your guitarist to play the corresponding chord. Then just try and change it up i.e. try playing the corresponding chord of a 3rd measure in a bar every now and then just to change things up a bit.

So your guitarist might play an Emin for the 1st bar and a Fmin for the second or something like that.

EDIT: Just go back to the start of this thread and read through the chords that were mentioned with this scale. Others have done a good job of telling you which chords are theoretically correct.

As to what sounds best and works; thats up to you and your guitarist :-)