What kind of drum machine am I looking for?

ajb · #1 08-22-2007, 06:22 PM

I am looking for a drum machine, primarily for creativity-enhancing purposes. I am in a band and am looking to contribute more in terms of original grooves that can be the foundation for songs. I find that I am much more creative when playing to a drum beat of some sort as opposed to just playing solo, noodling around.

Problem is I know nothing about drum machines, brand names, how they work, etc. Ideally I would like something with recording capability. Nothing fancy, just something that can get the drum and bass track down.

Do you guys have any recommendations?

DocBop · #2 08-22-2007, 06:54 PM

Just get the one that goes beep, beep, beep, beep its called a metronome. If you can't be creative with a metronome using a drum machine is just putting a fancy bow on a empty box.

If you want to play with a drummer call the the drummer in your band and get together and work together on some grooves. The can teach you about drums and how they think and you can teach them about bass and how you work. You'll learn a lot more that way.

grovest · #3 08-22-2007, 06:55 PM

I'm interested in this too, and would like to know what models other bassist have had success with....

ajb · #4 08-22-2007, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DocBop

Just get the one that goes beep, beep, beep, beep its called a metronome. If you can't be creative with a metronome using a drum machine is just putting a fancy bow on a empty box.

If you want to play with a drummer call the the drummer in your band and get together and work together on some grooves. The can teach you about drums and how they think and you can teach them about bass and how you work. You'll learn a lot more that way.

I would love to be able to call my drummer and work on grooves, but there's one problem: He's a drummer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Limited availability, enthusiasm, etc. I can assure you that the answer does not lie with him.

permagrin · #5 08-22-2007, 07:45 PM

Playing with a metronome is an extremely good way to develop a more solid sense of meter. I have a drum machine and most of the time I'll just start it clicking, while running through scales and exercises. Speed up, slow down. You'll gain precision in your playing, too, playing on/before/after the beat.

Of course a click can be pretty limited in sparking creative grooves and licks. I have an old (must be mid-80s) Korg drum machine. The sounds are poor/cheesy (although one can use the cheesy sounds as a novelty) but I can use it to trigger better sounds on a MIDI device. The unit is physically large, with large buttons that makes it easy to "play" a pattern. It is quite simple but that's all I need, and the simple layout of functions makes it easy to navigate.

If I'm not using it as a click/metronome, I'm probably just having the machine loop a pattern I create.

Forgive me if this is too basic... To use it (or most drum machines if I'm not mistaken) you record a "pattern" of one to many bars (e.g., a two bar pattern) in a particular time signature (e.g., 4/4 or 3/4 or 7/8) with a particular quantization. Quantization, you ask? As you input your pattern (by playing the buttons that correspond to bass, snare, etc. along with a click) the drum machine will "correct" where the notes should actually land. That is, if you want a beat that has a "straight" feel, you'd set the quantiztion for, say, 1/16, meaning that the machine will only play sounds at exact time intervals, four to a beat in 4/4 time. If you want a beat that has a triplet or "swing" feel, you'd set the quantization to 1/12 (or, say, 1/24).

One can then put a song together by telling the machine to play your already-input patterns in a particular order. For instance, a song my read out as:

Click:
pattern 01 (one bar, 4/4 click)
Intro:
pattern 02 (two bar riff) x 4
Verse 1:
pattern 02 x8
Bridge:
pattern 03 (one bar)
pattern 04 (one bar)
pattern 03 (one bar)
pattern 04 (one bar)
pattern 03 (one bar)
pattern 04 (one bar)
pattern 03 (one bar)
pattern 04 (one bar)
Verse 2:
pattern 02 x8
Chorus
pattern 05 x ...

...something like that. I've done this for whole songs, to use as scratch tracks to record.

But again, on most occasions I simply compose a one-, two-, or four-bar pattern and have the machine loop it while I come up with basslines. Sometimes I just put in a simple rhythm, other times something complex (and not being a drummer, usually something that is not common for a drummer to do). A poor substitute to having a buddy to jam with, but a substitute nonetheless when no one else is around.

As a side note: there are a couple songs I've put together where I came up with basslines to chord progressions while having the drum machine loop a pattern, all the various parts of the song, still with that single drum pattern. I then took the bassline and chord progression to the band to work out the song. Things obviously morph when more creative people give their input - but even if the human drummer ends up playing something completely different than the machine there is still an unheard, underlying rhythm that ties the various parts of the song together, that has formed the basis of the groove or pocket.

Anyway, these are the various ways I use my crappy old drum machine as a tool in my bass playing.

brianrost · #6 08-23-2007, 07:06 AM

If you want a drum machine for practice only, then almost anything will do so might as well get the cheapest one you can (I still use a Roland TR505 I bought 20 years ago for $75).

Not too many companies still make them. Boss has a couple, Zoom has a couple and Alesis still sells the SR16.

If you don't need to program your own drum grooves, those home keyboards you see in department stores have pre-programmed drum patterns and it's always good to have a keyboard around.

xEriatarka · #7 08-23-2007, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajb

I would love to be able to call my drummer and work on grooves, but there's one problem: He's a drummer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Limited availability, enthusiasm, etc. I can assure you that the answer does not lie with him.

What kind of statement is that? That has to be one of the worst generizations I've ever heard. In my honest opinion, the best bassists groove with their drummer, and visa-versa. Practicing with a drummer has always been my most efficient way practicing.

However, obviously not everyone's schedules always correspond with one another, so it can be a bit difficult. I have this same problem all the time. But that's what I get for going to school full time and work almost full time as well. I'd honestly just recommend getting a metronome. Playing with your drummer and a drum machine are two completely different feelings.

51m0n · #8 08-24-2007, 05:30 AM

Download hydrogen, it comes in windows and linux flavours, is free open source software and a very very capable easy to use drum machine.

Not only do I use it as a metronome, but also as a really nice fake drummer (it has swing/humanize and velocity humanize which used sparingly actually do a fab job of making it feel more real).

You can find a load of drum machines to load inot it or create your own (pm me if you want some that I've downloaded). If you want a truly fantastic old school drum kit I recommend its YamahaVintageDrumset, although the UltraAcoustic is brilliant too.

It also has sounds/kits based on all the usual electric kits out there.

It will run on any reasonably up to date machine and I can't recommend this route highly enough....

kaih · #9 08-24-2007, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xEriatarka

What kind of statement is that? That has to be one of the worst generizations I've ever heard. In my honest opinion, the best bassists groove with their drummer, and visa-versa. Practicing with a drummer has always been my most efficient way practicing.

However, obviously not everyone's schedules always correspond with one another, so it can be a bit difficult. I have this same problem all the time. But that's what I get for going to school full time and work almost full time as well. I'd honestly just recommend getting a metronome. Playing with your drummer and a drum machine are two completely different feelings.

Hint: Its a joke

bthiemann80 · #10 08-27-2007, 02:22 PM

Alesis SR-16 has been my best friend for a few years now. Its super simple and easy to use too.

chicagodoubler · #11 08-28-2007, 12:17 AM

If you have a recent mac, you already have a killer metronome in Garage Band.

It's very important to work with groove subtlety. Try playing a scale with a hip hop shuffle (used to be called New Jack...) and see how important flexibility is.

There are many variations in what we call "swing," and we all know what the famous Ellington song says about not having it.

Recommendations- either using Reason or Garage Band (or Live, or Acid, or whatever...) try running stuff with different drum loops.

Killer. You'll start getting compliments from drummers in a week.

toaster2k3 · #12 08-29-2007, 01:50 AM

BOSS DR-3. Cheap and amazing.

manicbassman · #13 08-29-2007, 02:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 51m0n

Download hydrogen, it comes in windows and linux flavours, is free open source software and a very very capable easy to use drum machine.

Not only do I use it as a metronome, but also as a really nice fake drummer (it has swing/humanize and velocity humanize which used sparingly actually do a fab job of making it feel more real).

You can find a load of drum machines to load inot it or create your own (pm me if you want some that I've downloaded). If you want a truly fantastic old school drum kit I recommend its YamahaVintageDrumset, although the UltraAcoustic is brilliant too.

It also has sounds/kits based on all the usual electric kits out there.

It will run on any reasonably up to date machine and I can't recommend this route highly enough....

the only problem being in finding ready made patterns for it...

The only decent one I've found so far has been the "bluesbox" one, and even then I had to work on it.

Has anyone found a good source of free drum sheet/tab to create pattern sets from?

51m0n · #14 08-30-2007, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manicbassman

the only problem being in finding ready made patterns for it...

The only decent one I've found so far has been the "bluesbox" one, and even then I had to work on it.

Has anyone found a good source of free drum sheet/tab to create pattern sets from?

I just copy them off of CD's personally. It doesn't take so long to do - and you really get to learn what drummers are up to too, whixh certainly helps when making your own patterns up.

edfriedland · #15 09-01-2007, 10:59 AM

I like the Boss DR 770, I think it's discontinued though. You can tune individual drums, create your own kits from hundreds of drums... flexible, good sounds.

To the point of "get a metronome, not a drum machine...."

Firstly (and most obviously,) a drum machine will do what a metronome does, and give you greater tempo range.

Secondly, they are different tools for different tasks. I think every bass player should get a drum machine and learn to program drum grooves. Don't just use preset loops like Garage band, get in there and program the beat yourself! It's the next best thing to learning how to play drums (which I also think every bass player should do!)

If you can program an authentic drum beat, that means you KNOW every aspect of that beat. It makes sense then, that you would be able to play with that beat more effectively, right?

RE: metronome.... sure, you need to be able to lock in and groove with a straight click, to supply the feel internally. That said, I found it was easier to do that once I understood drum grooves.