What is this scale?

[Would'e?]

Hi all. I've just joined a new band and decided that now (after all these years) might be a good time to learn to do more than play entirely by ear which is how I've got by up to now.

So. I know next to nothing about theory, but I want to learn something as far as how it applies to my own bass lines. I know what works by ear, but I don't know why it works.

For example. One of the bass lines for one of the new band's first songs contains these notes: Ab, Bb, Db, Eb, Gb.

If I understand things correctly, that scale is essentially an Ab pentatonic minor with a flatted second. (B natural just doesn't work in the scale, it sounds totally off.) So what's the scale called? The best I have been able to come up with poking around a bit is a "non-harmonic pentatonic minor." Or could I just be confusing myself because the guitar chord progression begins in the middle of what is essentially an F# major pentatonic?

[fearceol]

Cant help directly, but a great site for basic theory is :

www.studybass.com

[Shovelbone]

Originally Posted by Would'e?

Hi all. I've just joined a new band and decided that now (after all these years) might be a good time to learn to do more than play entirely by ear which is how I've got by up to now.

So. I know next to nothing about theory, but I want to learn something as far as how it applies to my own bass lines. I know what works by ear, but I don't know why it works.

For example. One of the bass lines for one of the new band's first songs contains these notes: Ab, Bb, Cb, Db, Gb.

If I understand things correctly, that scale is essentially an Ab pentatonic minor with a flatted second. (B natural just doesn't work in the scale, it sounds totally off.) So what's the scale called? The best I have been able to come up with poking around a bit is a "non-harmonic pentatonic minor." Or could I just be confusing myself because the guitar chord progression begins in the middle of what is essentially an F# major pentatonic?

www.studybass.com is an excellent source for bass theory and also PACMAN has superb thread out here that addresses scales and theory as well.
Check out: Pacman's sure-fire scale practice method

Good luck!

[Fool]

could be a Cb major scale...
Just starting from Ab
Or an Ab Aeolian (which is from Cb Major, Or the enharmonic B major)
just without the Cb and Fb ...

BUT I could easily be wrong...

[Slax]

Not to sound completely dumb and ignorant, but isn't the Cb just a B?

Besides that, couldn't it just be a natural Ab minor scale? (Ab, Bb, B, Db, Eb, E, Gb Ab)

Where are the chords major and minor in the song? That'll be able to help us, help you further. ("Help me, help you... Help me, help you..." lol)

[bearfoot]

Most likely, Ab minor. Pentatonic if only those 5 tones are present.
The correct spelling for the third would be Cb, though it is obviously the exact same note as B if you are playing fretted.

[Would'e?]

There is no Cb. It's an Eb. Sorry my bad. Edited to correct.

The five notes that work over the progression are Ab, Bb, Db, Eb, and Gb.

I'm not sure what the progression actually is offhand, the guitarist is using some unfamiliar chord shapes and I am just trying to pick it up by ear.

I don't think it is Ab pentatonic minor. The fourth (the Db) wouldn't be present in that scale but a B natural (the third) would be there in the pentatonic form. B is a sour note over this progression.

The more I look at it, it seems like it must be an F# major pentatonic scale -- all the right notes are there -- but I get confused because the progression doesn't begin on an F#.

[mambo4]

It's probably Gb maj or Eb min, or one of Gb maj's other modes.
I contains exactly the notes of Eb min pent/Gb maj pent.

[Would'e?]

Right. Gb Major pentatonic (F# Major pentatonic). That's what I'm thinking.

It wouldn't be Eb minor pentatonic. That has no Ab in it and has an F and a C which my mystery scale doesn't. I think the mystery is solved though. Thanks guys. The link to studybass.com was helpful.

[sleepy_monkey]

Studybass.com is a great site...haven't seen that before...thanks for throwing that out there....

[jfv]

The answer is there is no ONE answer Unless your
music provides more context. However those are all
perfectly good notes for a walking bass line for Ab7,
which would put in in the key of Db.

Thinking in terms of minor pentatonics is a guitarist
disease There are 12 tones, learn to love them
all!

[mutedeity]

Originally Posted by Would'e?

Hi all. I've just joined a new band and decided that now (after all these years) might be a good time to learn to do more than play entirely by ear which is how I've got by up to now.

So. I know next to nothing about theory, but I want to learn something as far as how it applies to my own bass lines. I know what works by ear, but I don't know why it works.

For example. One of the bass lines for one of the new band's first songs contains these notes: Ab, Bb, Db, Eb, Gb.

If I understand things correctly, that scale is essentially an Ab pentatonic minor with a flatted second. (B natural just doesn't work in the scale, it sounds totally off.) So what's the scale called? The best I have been able to come up with poking around a bit is a "non-harmonic pentatonic minor." Or could I just be confusing myself because the guitar chord progression begins in the middle of what is essentially an F# major pentatonic?

Basically what you have there is enharmonic to Gb Major pentatonic starting on the second degree. No it doesn't have a b2 even if you start on the Ab, Ab to Bb is a M2 interval and since Ab is the first degree and Bb is the second, it has a major 2nd.

On its own that scale is a pentatonic with the relative degrees {1, 2, 4, 5, b7}. If the chord played in the tonic position is F#Maj (or GbMaj as the case may be} it is a good bet that your scale is actually based more on F#/Gb Major pentatonic.

[bassybill]

Originally Posted by mambo4

It contains exactly the notes of Eb min pent/Gb maj pent.

Ding ding! Correct, sir.

Originally Posted by Would'e?

It wouldn't be Eb minor pentatonic. That has no Ab in it and has an F and a C which my mystery scale doesn't.

No, mambo4 has it right. Eb pentatonic minor = Eb, Gb, Ab, Bb, Db. It's the relative minor of Gb pentatonic major.

[Cloggy]

Eb min pentatonic.
No doubt whatsoever.

[mantelclock]

Originally Posted by Slax

Not to sound completely dumb and ignorant, but isn't the Cb just a B?

Cb is not B in the key of Ab minor. It is the third note of the scale. Generally speaking, though, you would call this scale G# minor, the relative minor scale to B major, in which case the scale would be G#, A#,B, C#, D#, E, F#, G#.

[steverosati]

Ab7 would work over those notes or Eb Dorian is nice too

[radmin]

The Short:
I also think it's Eb Minor Pentatonic.

The Long:
Those notes in that order are not any scale I have ever heard of. They are a lick based on a scale. The question then becomes which scale is it based on?

The notes could fit in a lot different scales.
The most obvious possibilities are Gb major pentatonic and Eb Minor Pentatonic as already stated.

I will go with Eb for a couple of reasons.

1.)The guitars probably tuned down a half step making E an Eb.

2.) E is a common key for guitar driven music.

Why pentatonic... They are more popular, they sound good, they are easier to play fast, and they are versitile. As a player I can live without Lydian. I can't live without Minor Pentatonic! Its everywhere.

[MurvintheWalrus]

Ab Pentatonic with a flattened second step, normally, that pen. would go Ab, B, Db, Eb, Gb

[mutedeity]

Originally Posted by Cloggy

Eb min pentatonic.
No doubt whatsoever.

What happens if the tonal centre is Gb? Still no doubt whatsoever? Also what happens if the tonic is Ab? Also consider that the scale is presented as starting in Ab, so it would be an enharmonic of the 3rd Mode of Eb minor pentatonic anyway.

[Cloggy]

The order of the notes he posted was based on Eb.(from the shape tone minor 3rd suggesting subdominant,dominant,submediant,tonic).Harmonicall y more likely than a pseudo dorian pentatonic,but even if it is then the basic scale is Eb m pent,or Gb pent.
Minors were once the norm,hence A being a natural minor and rather than C.No sharps or flats.
Noy very well put,but I'm in a rush!

In that context,no doubt.
As someone else pointed out,there is too little contextual info to pin it down beyond that.
Worst possible scenario is it is a mode of it.


Walrus...
The scale you present is Ab min pentatonic,and should be Cb not B.
A flat second in Ab is Bbb(A).