What is Swing?

[ElementFe]

I've seen this question asked in forum talk, but have yet to find an answer- I've been playing and loving music since I was a tot, and maybe in another fifty three years I'll be one of the big kids!
The term, "Swing" gets used a lot, and seems to have a very specific meaning to many people- can someone define it?
I know how it feels when something swings, sure, but this seems to also be a musical term like "coda" or "fortissimo" or "noise".
Thanks!
Andy G.

[Fergie Fulton]

Simple answer syncopation...as is the changing of a note value to be different from what is written in the context of those around it. Say you have a bass line in 4/4 and all the notes are 1/4 notes.... you don't always play each note as a quarter note you add and subtract from the notes to make it swing using 1/2, 1/4, 1/8th, 16th, 32nd, 64th notes and all dots in between.
How good you swing is how good you make your addition and subtraction to make it swing within the context of the score. Certain time sigs are called swing, but the reality is how the player interprets what is going on and conveys it.

Like groove, feel, emotion etc, swing is a feeling that some have in natural abundance, some can develop, and some never will.

[Martin89]

^Fergie has a very good definition.

I think the most textbook answer I can think of is not straight 8th's. the 8th notes(you'll hear it on the ride of a drumset) have a pattern of a longer then a shorter note. I think a teacher told me to picture 2 8th notes like a quarter-note triplet where the first 2 were tied and the last was by it self. This is very generic swing.

I hate to do this but if it helps you visualize it:
taa ta taa ta taa ta taa ta (one measure of 8th notes in 4/4; notes on the &s(ta) have slightly shorter feel)

uneven swing feel

[Jim Nazium]

To me, there are two (related, but different) uses of the word "swing" in music.

The first is, as Martin explained above, eighth notes that are not half a beat long (that would be "straight" or "even" eighths), but the first one is 2/3 of a beat and the second one is 1/3. Even that isn't quite accurate, depending on the tempo the first note can be a little less than 2/3 of a beat, but that's the general idea. A tune in the Real Book is either played with swing eighths or straight eighths.

The second way the word is used is much harder to define. It describes a quality, a rhythmic feeling, like "groove" or "in the pocket". "That tune really swings" is almost like saying "that girl is really hot"; you know it when you see it (or hear it), but exactly what makes it that way? I think a lot of it is having those 1/8th notes sit in just the right place, and having everyone in the band put them in the same place, so it's all tight.

That's my 2 cents...

[mambo4]

Hal Galper's master class discussion of rhythm & syncopation has much light to shed on Jazz syncopation.

I have a personal dislike for "either you got it or you don't " and "you Know it when you hear it" explanations: I believe they teach nothing.

[Martin89]

Like Jim Nazium said, it's not exactly my definition; it's just the easiest way to look at it. The main idea is that they are uneven, the extent is not exact(ie 2/3 1/3 pattern).

His second definition I believe is more of a result from Swing performed well. My advice would be to play around with it. Take a "swing" piece and play it straight and even then play it swing style as described here. Notice how it enhances the song. Heck, even take a song that isn't traditionally swing and vice versa.

[ElementFe]

Thanks, I think that the "syncopation" thing is what I was looking for, I appreciate the replies!
Usually, I can find good definitions by rooting around on the web, but in this case wasn't satisfied, and my teacher is out of touch for a bit.
Andy G.

Oh, and thanks, Mambo, for the link, great resource!

[Beginner Bass]

It can refer to several things:

1. "Swung" 8ths: This is when the beat is subdivided differently; instead of playing 2 8ths as notes of equal notes, they're subdivided as triplets, with the 1st 8th taking 2/3 of the beat, and the 2nd taking the last 3rd. At faster tempos, the 8ths tend to have less of a triplet feel, and are closer to straight. Swung 8ths are very common in jazz, blues, and early rock.
   (e.x. "The 8ths are swung, not straight.
2. "Swinging" typically associated with walking lines, in which the line propels the song, and consequently emphasizing the "swung" feel.
   (e.x. "Paul Chambers was really swinging on this track")
3. "Swing" music: Style of jazz most popular from the 1920's to 1940's.
   (e.x. "Benny Goodman was a prominent figure in the swing era."

[manbass]

Wynton answers your question:

Swing

[Fergie Fulton]

If you know the Glenn Miller classic, String of Pearls, then listen to some early Deep Purple albums and in particular drummer Ian Paice.....you'll be surprised how many times you can whistle or hum String of Pearls over the songs....now that's swing

[ElementFe]

Originally Posted by manbass

Wynton answers your question:

Swing

aw, sweet! love it...

This has a lot of the same stuff as I soaked up around the drummers from Kenya and west Africa, as far as layering different time signatures.
A the same time, what Mr. M is doing is so New Orleans, where the African feel was more...
Someone asked my teacher, "so we're counting one-two-three-four?" and his reply was so good: "No! It's ONE ONE ONE ONE ONE ONE ONE!"- with the other tempos and patterns over that- I guess Swing is a much easier, less driving feel.

[honeyiscool]

If you have to ask, you don't know what it is. Hehe.

Anyway, the idea behind a swing is of course the 2 to 1 rhythm, but it's not really 2 to 1, just like the waltz isn't a straight 1-2-3. And only with a lot of practice can you really know what actually makes the rhythm tick.

[Chris K]

Lots of theory on swing up here, but it don't mean a thing

Syncopation is all over contemporary music of whatever style, but it doesn''t mean it will make music swing. F.e. ragtime is full of syncopation, but I don't find that particularly swinging.
Folks in the old days, however, did.

Swing is music urging the audience to move, tap their feet, clap their hands, dance... You don't need syncopation for that. I'll swing ypu a walking bass line of straight quarter notes if you like.

[suraci]

I would say, a forum, a dictionary, nor any other intellectual means, is only the barest introduction to what swing is. To grasp the subtlety of swing, you must listen to it often.

I am not sure when swing began. It likely began in American bands in the early 20th Century.

Also swing has likely very slowly changed as decades pass.
To get an idea of what it is. I say listen to music that is marketed as swing from the 1930's then 1940's then 1950's and so on.

Certain names will come up in your adventure in swing.
Louis Armstrong
Nat King Cole
Earl Fatha Hines
Bix Beiderbeck
Count Basie
Duke Ellington
Coleman Hawkins
Lester "Prez " Young

A little more recently
Jimmy Smith
Groove Holmes
Charles Earland
Cannonball Adderley
Charlie Parker aka Bird ( 30' to 1955 )
Dizzy Gillespie

Those names cover many of the outstanding representatives of earlier swing pre 1950's.
Swing CAME from the earlier half of the 20th Century.
It is intimately associated with the American Black man. Without "him", there would be no such thing as swing as we now know it.

Just listen as much as you can. As times passes, you will either gravitate to it, or you will be indifferent to it. It is wonderful music... it may take time, so don't worry, it will hopefully, eventually come to you!

[ElementFe]

Once again, everybody knows when it's swinging and when it isn't- my question was, does the word have a specific meaning in musicology.
Thanks again for all the replies!
Andy

[suraci]

A word and a complex vibe, like swing.. is further apart than apples and oxen.
Like pointing at the moon and somehow confusing that with the moon.

Swing is an experience not at all definable with words. I don't care what academia proclaims to the contrary.
And I am not so sure we all know what it is, either.