Where to begin with soloing/Licks etc

[kynoch]

I am looking to break out in my bass playing and I am looking for some tip on Soloing and Licks....think basic....presume nothing I need its simple....any tips, help, advice, instructional videos (youtube) recommended books all welcome here...THANKS!!!!

[shakerattleroll]

At first, stay within the key. If you don't know keys, then begin with an instructional book to teach you those basics before soloing.

Personally, I would just watch youtubes or listen to some of your favorite solos (bass or otherwise) and then slowly begin to cop some of the ideas there.

[DudeistMonk]

The Pentatonic scale is your friend. You really can't play a wrong note. Blues scale is good too.

I've started practicing soloing over chord progressions as part of studying the progressions, it really helps your fretboard knowledge. Backing tracks help keep you on track and give you a basis for your solo. Also check out havic's soloing/phrasing videos I believe that his thread is still on the front page.

[tZer]

I wouldn't necessarily think in terms of licks or scales - both end up in solos without having to think about them.

Think as if you were going to start speaking. Think about saying little phrases that have really good points - short, sweet and very meaningful.

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions" <= Short, sweet, poetic and makes a point...
"I think that I shall never see, a poem as lovely as a tree" <= short, sweet, poetic, makes a point...


Make your music do that. Listen to a really good singer - Robert Plant - Ella Fitzgerald - listen to what they do with a vocal line - either as a part of a verse or chorus - or when they are improvising - they 'slide up to a pitch... hold it... then fall away from it using syllables (notes, to you and I) and hit a finishing vowel sound that they sustain... shake a little - maybe pull off at the end' - do that.

The thing is to have something to say. There's nothing worse than listening to a person talk who cannot figure out what it is they really want to say...

"I... ummm... well, I think... er... that is... uh..." = SHOOT ME NOW!

What to say? That's a good question - glad I asked it! ;-)

What song are you playing? What's the main melody of the hook? What is the song about?

Learn the melody - sit down one night and force yourself to learn the melody that the singer uses or the main melodic hook of the guitar or piano or sax... Anything 'quotable' is very useful to throw in. It proves you are really saying something and that you know what you're talking about - so to speak.

Knowing the key, chords, the 'safe notes' is very useful to prevent yourself from sounding like a broken, warped music box plinking out sour notes and unstructured riffs... - but it's the phrasing and 'sincerity' which which you express yourself that ultimately makes a solo meaningful - to you and to those listening.

Licks, riffs and tricks will happen naturally as a byproduct of you figuring out how to express your melodic, rhythmic and harmonic ideas. Don't rely on them to get you soloing - that'll only force you into a box that requires you know a lot of riffs and licks to solo.

[kesslari]

tZer - great post.

[ryco]

Originally Posted by tZer

I wouldn't necessarily think in terms of licks or scales - both end up in solos without having to think about them.

Nice post T!

As a very beginning the OP may want to try out playing pentatonic and the blues scale to get the sounds under his fingers and into his ear.

But tZer is right. These are boxes that your gonna want to break out of.
If you can, listen to the chord progression slowly and try different lines.

[tZer]

Thanks all - I'm sorta surprised myself - but that's a synopsis of what I've learned here from similar threads AND, for the 'philosophical side', Victor Wooten's book, "The Music Lesson" really emphasizes these ideas and puts a really clear light on a great way to conceptualize music in general.

Now one cannot emphasize enough the value of practice - scales, arpeggios, even riffs, licks and patterns - but from an angle of getting your fingers to respond to your brain in a more fluid way. The important thing about being musical is to express yourself emotionally - not mechanically.

A great thing to do is LISTEN to a lot of music - focus on the melodies and the most interesting expressions therein. Learn to love them and to sing them. You know a hooky phrase when you hear it - so when you hear it, repeat it and incorporate it into your mental archive of cool ways to make musical statements.

For me - listening to David Gilmour solo really emphasizes how having very lyrical ideas can be expressed through an instrument. Hell, while we're on that topic - the female vocal break in "Great big gig in the sky" - a prime example of how to let the music flow from you. Just imagine if she had a sore throat or was not warmed up or never developed the range to accommodate such a magical part? She was clearly responding to something bigger than her own ability to conjure up licks and riffs.

The key if for you not to get in the way (hence the practice - you don't want clunky fingers to get in the way of a beautiful statement, right?)

One of the greatest and most useful ideas is that there are no "bad notes" and even that "notes don't matter" - and finally - "You're always a 1/2 step from a good note - even though there are technically no 'bad notes' anyway".

I highly recommend his book. It has ZERO exercises, scales, riffs - it's all story. But a very good read filled with very useful ideas.

[HogieWan]

the best thing you can do, IMO, is sing a 2 or 3 note phrase and then try to play it on the bass. Keep doing this and make them longer as you progress. Once you get pretty good at that, you can start to play a line that you "sing" in your head

[Kyle Olin]

I say to you tZer, Well played, Well played... Probably some of the best advice I've ever heard, and I didn't even ask for it!

[MNAirHead]

I'll go a different route..

Bass solos and Drum solos suck..

Short is good.. an endless stream of notes sucks.

The best response I've had from mine are from commonly known themes.. quick popeye theme.. other cartoons etc go over well.. get it done within 5 seconds.. make them day dream like you have seven hours of better stuff in side you.

Solos are commonly long enough that folks often think you suck.

[tZer]

Originally Posted by MNAirHead

I'll go a different route..

Bass solos and Drum solos suck..

While I agree that bad bass solos and drum solos suck - I completely disagree with you on this point. If you honestly believe that, I think you have a self-fulfilling prophecy on your hands.

Originally Posted by MNAirHead

Short is good.. an endless stream of notes sucks.

The best response I've had from mine are from commonly known themes.. quick popeye theme.. other cartoons etc go over well.. get it done within 5 seconds.. make them day dream like you have seven hours of better stuff in side you.

Solos are commonly long enough that folks often think you suck.

I see what you mean - and I even understand where your "Bass solos and Drum solos suck" comment comes from.

But I remember seeing Steve Bailey on upright over 26 years ago with Dizzy Gillespie. I was a 'rocker' and when I walked into the auditorium and saw a big old white upright, I thought... "damn... this is gonna be lame from a bass-player's point of view" - in other words - no electric meant thunky, thuddy solos that dropped in energy. I was hoping to see a 'Stanley Clarke' type of bass player on electric since I was a full on Stanley addict at the time.

(NOTE: I am pretty sure it was Steve Bailey. Short, stocky white guy with long blond hair on a big, white upright. I didn't know who he was at the time and it didn't occur to me that it might have been him that night until years later when I discovered him along with Victor W)

I'll never forget how he blew my mind each and every time he soloed! It was every bit as entertaining for everyone as were the solos from Dizzy and Omar Hakim (on kit). He made me forget all about Stanley and completely changed my attitude about what could be done on an upright - hell - on a bass - period!

He not only had absolute mastery over his instrument (Steve), he also had LOTS to say and was able to say it every time he stepped up.

[Rickett Customs]

A good dose of theory will do.....and at least a good sense of melody.

[Krowser]

Originally Posted by tZer

I wouldn't necessarily think in terms of licks or scales - both end up in solos without having to think about them.

Think as if you were going to start speaking. Think about saying little phrases that have really good points - short, sweet and very meaningful.

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions" <= Short, sweet, poetic and makes a point...
"I think that I shall never see, a poem as lovely as a tree" <= short, sweet, poetic, makes a point...


Make your music do that. Listen to a really good singer - Robert Plant - Ella Fitzgerald - listen to what they do with a vocal line - either as a part of a verse or chorus - or when they are improvising - they 'slide up to a pitch... hold it... then fall away from it using syllables (notes, to you and I) and hit a finishing vowel sound that they sustain... shake a little - maybe pull off at the end' - do that.

The thing is to have something to say. There's nothing worse than listening to a person talk who cannot figure out what it is they really want to say...

"I... ummm... well, I think... er... that is... uh..." = SHOOT ME NOW!

What to say? That's a good question - glad I asked it! ;-)

What song are you playing? What's the main melody of the hook? What is the song about?

Learn the melody - sit down one night and force yourself to learn the melody that the singer uses or the main melodic hook of the guitar or piano or sax... Anything 'quotable' is very useful to throw in. It proves you are really saying something and that you know what you're talking about - so to speak.

Knowing the key, chords, the 'safe notes' is very useful to prevent yourself from sounding like a broken, warped music box plinking out sour notes and unstructured riffs... - but it's the phrasing and 'sincerity' which which you express yourself that ultimately makes a solo meaningful - to you and to those listening.

Licks, riffs and tricks will happen naturally as a byproduct of you figuring out how to express your melodic, rhythmic and harmonic ideas. Don't rely on them to get you soloing - that'll only force you into a box that requires you know a lot of riffs and licks to solo.

Shbam!

That's exactly it. When you play a solo you have to speak through your bass. Don't think: I gotta play a major 5 D at the power of 17 on a 4/4 time sig divided by the square root of every 3rd note of blablablabla.

In your head you have to hear music, or even better, I find it help if I actually do the bass with my mouth.

Buuulululubululululualalalalaalalllobolbloo pom pom pom pom
ding ding ping pa-ting ting fffwwiik fwaaaaaaaaaaaaaa -----

bulbulbubllulubo POW!

Oh yeah! Just go nuts, slow at first, and when you get a good pattern, go nuts.

Edit: Buckethead has a LOT of soul in his solos because he really conveys his emotions through his music. At some points you would literraly think he's signing with his guitar. He is one with his instrument.

Don't play the bass, BE the bass!

[kynoch]

Wow...Thanks.....I have been asked to do a solo in a cover of ¨"Bill Withers ain´t no sunshine"....I will be trying to incorporate some of these Ideas....I am gonna start by approaching and looking at the vocal melody...I will keep you posted.

Thanks again!!!!

[tZer]

Originally Posted by kynoch

Wow...Thanks.....I have been asked to do a solo in a cover of ¨"Bill Withers ain´t no sunshine"....I will be trying to incorporate some of these Ideas....I am gonna start by approaching and looking at the vocal melody...I will keep you posted.

Thanks again!!!!

That's is a GREAT way to approach a solo - and especially for that tune! That song is dark and brooding and the melody is really provocative.

Some practical suggestions, if I may;
1) Learn the melody in many places on the neck - up high - down low - in the middle.
2) Plan to take two or three rounds and start slowly and very true to form and let each subsequent pass expand.
3) Let things that happen as you play inspire you and follow your instincts. If it feels good to you, it'll feel good to someone else. You're not alone!

Let it flow!

[kynoch]

damn it....I have just spent hours on this and it still sucks....just seems really boring and pointless....I just can´t find the groove here....damn it!!!!

[tZer]

Relax... don't force it. Start with just being true to the melody. Play it with feeling. Add some expression by bending or sliding or vibrato. If you hit a 'funky note' bend it into shape and hold it - take ownership of that funky note and make it a note that belongs by doing it again - hit it, bend it, hold it and slide off of it. Now you've just added a nice interesting feature to your solo.

If you need to, put your instrument down and go do something that makes you feel good. Get a snack - go for a jog - get your head in a better place.

Do some variations on the melody - instead of starting on the same note - start it a 3rd above and alter the melody accordingly. Play with the phrasing a little by sustaining some notes while dropping others out altogether or making the riff quicker.

The point is for you to be expressive - but from a strictly mechanical perspective, you can play the melody with some subtle alterations and 'technically' your solo will be fine. But also remember that you are more than likely your own harshest critic so don't be too hard on yourself. Laugh at yourself a little and turn your funky notes into gold!

Keep working on the melody and try to "let yourself go" - close your eyes and feel it.

Don't give up - tapping into your expressive side is easier said than done if you haven't been doing it for a long time. Once you do, however, it's like riding a bike.

Relax - breathe - feel good - play!

[Kyle Olin]

Originally Posted by MNAirHead

I'll go a different route..

Bass solos and Drum solos suck..

Short is good.. an endless stream of notes sucks.

The best response I've had from mine are from commonly known themes.. quick popeye theme.. other cartoons etc go over well.. get it done within 5 seconds.. make them day dream like you have seven hours of better stuff in side you.

Solos are commonly long enough that folks often think you suck.

Cliff Burton, Pulling Teeth... Nuff said?

[derekd]

Originally Posted by MNAirHead

I'll go a different route..

Bass solos and Drum solos suck..

Short is good.. an endless stream of notes sucks.

The best response I've had from mine are from commonly known themes.. quick popeye theme.. other cartoons etc go over well.. get it done within 5 seconds.. make them day dream like you have seven hours of better stuff in side you.

Solos are commonly long enough that folks often think you suck.

I agree to an extent. I like the short but sweet idea for just about all solos, no matter the instrument. I really like quoting other tunes, and very much like quoting the melody, whether I am soloing as a bassist or on guitar.

Other than stuff by Wayman Tisdale or Marcus, I just don't hear that many bass solos that do it for me. Drums are the same, with the exception of jazz. Jazz drummers seem to be much more creative with less equipment for some reason.

I would rather hear any soloist do something clever, tastful, or just in your face groove than try to blow a bunch of notes. My $.02

[kynoch]

Originally Posted by tZer

Relax... don't force it. Start with just being true to the melody. Play it with feeling. Add some expression by bending or sliding or vibrato. If you hit a 'funky note' bend it into shape and hold it - take ownership of that funky note and make it a note that belongs by doing it again - hit it, bend it, hold it and slide off of it. Now you've just added a nice interesting feature to your solo.

If you need to, put your instrument down and go do something that makes you feel good. Get a snack - go for a jog - get your head in a better place.

Do some variations on the melody - instead of starting on the same note - start it a 3rd above and alter the melody accordingly. Play with the phrasing a little by sustaining some notes while dropping others out altogether or making the riff quicker.

The point is for you to be expressive - but from a strictly mechanical perspective, you can play the melody with some subtle alterations and 'technically' your solo will be fine. But also remember that you are more than likely your own harshest critic so don't be too hard on yourself. Laugh at yourself a little and turn your funky notes into gold!

Keep working on the melody and try to "let yourself go" - close your eyes and feel it.

Don't give up - tapping into your expressive side is easier said than done if you haven't been doing it for a long time. Once you do, however, it's like riding a bike.

Relax - breathe - feel good - play!

Thanks man... I am hearing what your saying....I will get on it again today....and Relax...and see what happens thanks for the advice...will keep all posted...thanks again!!!