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Da Bassics 11-27-2012 03:03 AM

YO whats up im new here but i need help
 
man how do i stop sounding so scalular man :smh:

how do i come up with grooves that arent simple and go somewhere? and what it the ''root'' defined as technically

Shakin-Slim 11-27-2012 03:10 AM

The root is the root note of any chord. The root of a Cmaj7 is C, the root of a Ddim is D, the root of Emin7flat5 is E.

Sounding scalar often comes from only knowing a little bit of theory (scales), and stretching them to cover everything. Spend time learning music theory and also use your ears very attentively to discern what works where, and when.

Da Bassics 11-27-2012 03:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shakin-Slim (Post 13501862)
The root is the root note of any chord. The root of a Cmaj7 is C, the root of a Ddim is D, the root of Emin7flat5 is E.

Sounding scalar often comes from only knowing a little bit of theory (scales), and stretching them to cover everything. Spend time learning music theory and also use your ears very attentively to discern what works where, and when.

yeah thats my problem i only know the basic majors and minors but i only know half of them by ear. what tips can you give for me to take a gigantic leap ahead . I have a million different ideas but cant relay them yet. what theory or techniques you suggest I learn or practice

MalcolmAmos 11-27-2012 03:49 AM

You asked what is a root, from that I take it you do need to start at the beginning. Here is your theory paper. First 30 pages is for beginners, start on page one and don't skip pages. Don't be in a hurry getting into pages 31 to 90. Hint - we learn theory from an easy chair, i.e. reading with our instrument handy.

Bass Guitar for Dummies is a good starting book. It will give you all the basics how to's. How to hold the beast, how to tune it, how to make sound and how to mute some of the sound, things like that. Plus the patterns and diagrams are great. Most of what I'm listing below came from Dummies.

www.studybass.com is a great free lesson site. Time spent here is time well spent.

The major scale box pattern is a friend. You know scales already and that is great. Our instrument is an accompaniment instrument in the rhythm section. We are to provide the beat, play chord tones that will harmonize with the melody, call attention to the chord changes, and don't step on the other guys toes. Yes, you learned how to make scales first, that's good as your fingers know where to go on the fretboard to find the notes you need, but, as our primary function is not to play melody lets now spend some time with how to harmonize the melody being played by others. To do that we first learn how to make bass lines. See a chord coming up in some fake chord or lead sheet music and know what chord tones will make a good bass line for that chord - in this piece of music. So get chord accompaniment down now, then you can worry about what to do when the band gives you a lead break, i.e. how to play the song's tune aka melody.

Sorry little theory is needed here. Harmonization - when the melody line and the chord line share some like notes we get harmonization, i.e. the two lines sound good together. The songwriter has figured all this out for us by listing what chords are needed to harmonize this portion of the melody. He/she does this in the bass clef or with fake chord or lead sheet music the chord name is listed instead of having a bass clef. Once you know what chord will harmonize this portion of the melody we play that chord's notes to get harmonization. Now hang on - one note per bar is enough, two notes per bar are better, but, three notes per bar are not really necessary - so just root on the first beat does give us harmonization. Little boring, so we throw in the 5th on the third beat, and if we have time we add some of the other chord tones on the second and forth beat to make it interesting. Yes fake chord or lead sheet music will be a friend.
Quote:

I found Online Bass Lessons at StudyBass.com and Ed's book "Building Walking Bass Lines" to be on track and both have great value. There is one more bass line book I would recommend, "Bass lines in minutes" by Kris Berg. "Bass Guitar for Dummies" is a good refresher book, as it has a little bit of everything you will be using. Your public library will probably have a copy.

My old standby chart of generic bass lines using the major scale box as a Rosetta stone may help:

Bass Patterns based upon the Major Scale box.

Code:

Major Scale Box.

G|---2---|-------|---3---|---4---| 1st string
D|---6---|-------|---7---|---8---|
A|---3---|---4---|-------|---5---|
E|-------|---R---|-------|---2---|4th string

Basic Chords Have a C major chord coming up. The root, 3rd and 5th scale degree of the C major scale is what needs playing. Have a C minor chord coming up - the root, flatted 3rd (b3) and the 5th scale degree is what is needed to play the Cm chord. Find a C note on your fretboard, place the major scale box's R on that C note and play the R-3-5 scale degrees from the box. For the rest of the story, read on.

• Major Triad = R-3-5
• Minor Triad = R-b3-5
• Diminished Chord = R-b3-b5

7th Chords
• Maj7 = R-3-5-7
• Minor 7 = R-b3-5-b7
• Dominant 7 = R-3-5-b7
• diminished = R-b3-b5-b7
• Full diminished = R-b3-b5-bb7

See a chord and play it's chord tones. As every key will have three major, three minor and one diminished chord it's a good idea to get your major, minor and diminished bass line chord tones into muscle memory so when you see a chord your fingers just know what will work. Think of those R-3-5-b7 being little scales, practice them like you did your scales. Get the scale degree pattern for the major, minor and diminished seven chords into muscle memory. Now the song may only give you enough room for the root, or root five - adapt and get as many chord tones into your bass line as needed. Root on 1 and a steady groove from the other chord tones plus something to call attention to the chord change will keep you gigging.

Scales
• Major Scale = R-2-3-4-5-6-7 Home base
• Major Pentatonic = R-2-3-5-6 Leave out the 4 & 7
• Natural Minor Scale = R-2-b3-4-5-b6-b7 Major scale with the 3, 6 & 7 flatted.
• Minor Pentatonic = R-b3-4-5-b7 Leave out the 2 & 6.
• Blues = R-b3-4-b5-5-b7 Minor pentatonic with the blue note b5 added.
• Harmonic Minor Scale = R-2-b3-4-5-b6-7 Natural minor with a natural 7.
• Melodic Minor Scale = R-2-b3-4-5-6-7 Major scale with a b3.
Let the major scale be your home base then change a few notes and you have something different. No need to memorize a zillion patterns. Let the major scale pattern be your go to pattern - then adapt/adjust from there.


Generic Notes - for your bass line.
• The root, five and eight are generic and fit most any chord. Remember the diminished has a flatted 5. So R-5-8-5 is going to be a safe bass line for everything except a diminished chord.
• The 3 is generic to all major chords. So R-3-5-3 will fit under any major chord.
• The b3 is generic to all minor chords. And R-b3-5-8 will fit under any minor chord. Why the 8? Well the 8 is just another root in the next octave.
• The 7 is generic to all maj7 chords. Yep, R-3-5-7 fits nicely.
• The b7 is generic to all dominant seventh and minor seventh chords. G7 = R-3-5-b7 or Gm7 = R-b3-5-b7.
• The 6 is neutral and adds color, help yourself to 6’s. Love the sound of R-3-5-6 with a major chord.
• The 2 and 4 make good passing notes. Don’t linger on them or stop on them, keep them passing.
• In making your bass line help yourself to those notes, just use them correctly.
• Roots, fives, eights and the correct 3 & 7 will play a lot of bass.
Enough stuff here to keep you busy for three months. Get to work.

Have fun.

Sni77 11-27-2012 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Da Bassics (Post 13501870)
yeah thats my problem i only know the basic majors and minors but i only know half of them by ear. what tips can you give for me to take a gigantic leap ahead . I have a million different ideas but cant relay them yet. what theory or techniques you suggest I learn or practice

Don't expect giant leaps. Won't happen. Sorry. Keep lurking this forum and read as much as you can and actively listen as much as you can and play and practice as much as you can.
That's the only thing that will make you progress faster. Sounds like work? Yeah, because it is.

wabbit 11-27-2012 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sni77 (Post 13505718)
Don't expect giant leaps. Won't happen. Sorry. Keep lurking this forum and read as much as you can and actively listen as much as you can and play and practice as much as you can.
That's the only thing that will make you progress faster. Sounds like work? Yeah, because it is.

This x1000

If it was easy, everyone would do it.

scottfeldstein 11-27-2012 07:30 PM

I've been really diggin' Scott's bass lessons at scottsbasslessons.com. Even a beginner can get good instruction there.

HolmeBass 11-27-2012 09:48 PM

If you know your scales, try playing every other note in the scale. Think of any given scale, number the notes in the scale so you can transpose (move around to any key /scale) like this - in a C major scale, the root note is C. It is also the first note you play, so call it I (the Roman numeral 1- music uses Roman numerals to number the scales tones). The second note, D, is the II. The third, E, is III. Pretty easy, right? But the major scale has the same relationships between it's notes no matter which major scale you play, so let's say your doing the F major scale. You can still name the degrees of F major the same numbers- I is F, II is G, III is A, skipping a note, V is C. In Eb (E flat) the I is Eb, the II is F, the III is G, the V is Bb (B flat). Etcetera. Go through all 12 keys with your bass in your hands and write out all the notes of all the major scales. The rule is you can only use a given letter once in each scale, either natural, flatted, or sharped appropriately. F# (F sharp) major has F# as the I, G# as the II, A# as the III (NOT Bb, see?), B as the IV, C# as the V, D# as the VI (again, not Eb), E# as the VII (which is way weird, right, that's the same as an F!), and back to the octave F# as the VIII, or more correctly as the I again. I did all of F# because it's a tricky one, maybe the trickiest. You should do it as Gb (G flat) as an exercise. In general people pick the easiest one, with the fewest sharps or flats (accidentals), so for example Bb is much more common than A# as the way to name that scale. The time to worry about A# is still a long way away. The real take-home here is to get used to transposing to any key by using the numbers, but also to learn the names of the notes on the fingerboard. Don't cheat yourself out of learning this.

So now playing *every other note* of a scale. Play I, III, V, and VII. Those notes together are a chord (a major 7 chord, but don't worry too much about that now). Now play II, IV, VI. That is also a chord, a minor chord, aka a minor triad. The major triad is just I, III, and V. Those are the simple building blocks of about 80% of pop rock, Americana, folk, etc. bass lines. When you play the notes of a chord separately like that, it is called an arpeggio.

Work on that, in the context of what others have written above, and by work I mean slowly figure out these things in all 12 keys all over your bass. Thinking about it is good, but actually doing it, over and over, is how you will learn this stuff.

After a few months, look up "chord inversions" on Google, and "blues scale". And all the while, work on learning your favorite songs by ear. Try to imagine what a baseline may look like on the fretboard when you hear it on the radio while you're driving around in your car.

scottfeldstein 11-27-2012 09:51 PM

Or just do a pentatonic scale instead of a regular major or minor.

Da Bassics 11-27-2012 10:46 PM

whoooooooooooooooooooooa its alot of info in here!! thanks ill comment back to everyone when i read. thanks again!!!!



on behalf of larry graham meshell nedegeocello jamerson jaco mark king pete catera tm stevens rapahael saadiq pino palladino
marcus miller vic wooten louis johnson i would like to say thanks:hyper::hyper::hyper::hiding::bassist:

Da Bassics 11-27-2012 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottfeldstein (Post 13506317)
Or just do a pentatonic scale instead of a regular major or minor.

you look like you know how to paint, grade good wine and make a mean cuisine. Am I accurate in my assumption?

scottfeldstein 11-27-2012 10:51 PM

Heh. It's the hat, right? I can't paint a lick, I drink wine if it's under $10 a bottle--but I can indeed cook. So there's that. :)

scottfeldstein 11-27-2012 10:57 PM

I really think you should check out Scott's bass lessons.

http://scottsbasslessons.com/online-video-bass-lessons

Da Bassics 11-27-2012 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottfeldstein (Post 13506509)
Heh. It's the hat, right? I can't paint a lick, I drink wine if it's under $10 a bottle--but I can indeed cook. So there's that. :)

:lol: can you help me with this?


http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f30/ca...at-key-936105/

Da Bassics 11-27-2012 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottfeldstein (Post 13506523)
I really think you should check out Scott's bass lessons.

http://scottsbasslessons.com/online-video-bass-lessons

thanks alot man. how long u been playing and what genre?

scottfeldstein 11-27-2012 11:24 PM

I started playing when I was about 14, kept at it until I was about...oh, early 30s. Then I didn't play a note for ten years. Now I'm back. But I know nothing about music, really. I pick up a little here and there, can't read a note. I've really been enjoying the video lessons on that site.

The song? Cool stuff. I can see where it's hard to nail down. It seems like Cm to me. What do you hear?

Rev J 11-28-2012 12:13 AM

Scott do you have 2 accounts so you can plug your site?

C/S,
Rev J

Sni77 11-28-2012 01:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rev J (Post 13506641)
Scott do you have 2 accounts so you can plug your site?

C/S,
Rev J

:D :p

Da Bassics 11-28-2012 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottfeldstein (Post 13506588)
I started playing when I was about 14, kept at it until I was about...oh, early 30s. Then I didn't play a note for ten years. Now I'm back. But I know nothing about music, really. I pick up a little here and there, can't read a note. I've really been enjoying the video lessons on that site.

The song? Cool stuff. I can see where it's hard to nail down. It seems like Cm to me. What do you hear?

Ive been playing it in Ab for like a year. marcus miller said Aflat and he said the keyboard uses a sus 2 other bassist said a flat one said f minor man some said a minor thats why i asked. on this other site man its like 3 pages deep everybody giving their opinion one person said c min and it sparked a debate. im not sure man lol thats why i asked. but ive been playing Ab the whole time

scottfeldstein 11-28-2012 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rev J (Post 13506641)
Scott do you have 2 accounts so you can plug your site?

C/S,
Rev J

I wish!


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