ed safranski technique.

[jazzEADG]

I'm curious to hear anyone's opinions on his right hand form. I found a good example here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXJI9...eature=channel

he swiches between sort of a non-slapped rockabilly style and a more "traditional" jazz technique.

discuss.

[salcott]

I've seen a Pettiford clip where he's using that same technique; there was also a fine bassist named Bill Pemberton in NY who I used to see a lot when I first started at Condon's. He played like that as well-not snapping the string against the board, more of a strum, if that makes sense. I'm trying to figure out how to do it consistently-you get a nice thump when it works.

[Paul Warburton]

Most of these guys played a lot of big band stuff. Muscle city. No amps. Look at the side shot of Eddie in the clip. The strings are SO far away from the board you could drive a truck through. In this technique, a bit before Ray Brown came in with some refinement by anchoring his right thumb around and behind the board and pulling in towards the board, squeezing out the tone with the pull, it was just the best way to get projection with that high of a bridge. This was very common then.
No slapping sound because the strings were SO high off da board they never got a chance to bounce off the board.
Of course, Jimmy Blanton was ahead of just about everybody in terms of right-hand tonal refinement in an earlier period.
Yes sir, I remember those days, when men were men.

[salcott]

Safranski played with Kenton, whose band I can imagine producing a fair bit of sound at times.......

[Paul Warburton]

Right, man. Eddie was also credited with being one of the first jazz bassists to use double stops affectively....with Kenton.
And no, he didn't strum them with his thumb like some of us do now. He used that same technique shown in the clip.

[MR PC]

Earlier and different era than now. With action that high, my guess is that Eddie found the technique that worked to do the job for the music. He certainly projected well!

What a horrible era in terms of civil rights.....listen to the way the interviewer calls the men "boys". Scripted, no doubt.

[Paul Warburton]

Wrong again......The term "boys" in those days was actually a term of endearment. Kinda like youthful and fun. I was always proud to be one of the "boys" in the band. It wasn't "political" in those days. It was a black and white club.
And it wasn't "horrible", it was a brotherhood against all odds.
The clip also shows A "racially balanced" band. That ain't too damn horrible.

[MR PC]

No, not wrong.

My experience of life in that era was different than yours, Paul. I see and hear differently than you. I would never dream of telling you that your life experience was wrong. And I think I understand your point of view in terms of the era, because that way of dealing with social situations still exists in my gig world.

To bad there isn't more historical information about Eddie Safranski. I've always loved his bass sound when I've heard it. What was he up to?

[Gornick]

Man, I love Ed!

He has such a big sound! His stuff with Bird is perfect, and it's great to see him pop up on the threads! I never thought of looking him up on the Youtube ,to see his thing in action, but there it is. Damn I love Youtube!

As far as semantics, "boy" was definitely a common term of endearment amongst men (of any color) back in the day, and my day goes back to growing up in the 70's. I still use it, and it can be used with absolute endearment, and those who hear me use it know I mean it as such... there are other ways of using it where it is not so endearing.

Now, if you listen to this interviewer and hear how he is showing utmost respect to Billy and the "boys" and contrast that to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkvCDCOGzGc

then you might see my point. This always struck me as a bit more tense, not because of the "boys" comment, but Earl's demeanor in general. Leonard, in contrast, seems to be admist the gods themselves, with that grin of his, and damn right he shoulda!

But Earl? I always thought the way Bird looks at Earl in that exchange is flat out "damn, I gotta restrain myself, gotta stay cool, but I wanna take his ***** head off... ", and then when he blows that last phrase before Diz comes in, he puffs up that last gasp of air, mutherf****** lets that **** out, jesus, I cried the first time I saw that!!!! seriously, I left a message on the answering machine of that phrase and would call it just to hear it.

Oh, wait, is that Ed on bass?

[Paul Warburton]

Originally Posted by Gornick

Man, I love Ed!
He has such a big sound! His stuff with Bird is perfect, and it's great to see him pop up on the threads! I never thought of looking him up on the Youtube ,to see his thing in action, but there it is. Damn I love Youtube!
As far as semantics, "boy" was definitely a common term of endearment amongst men (of any color) back in the day, and my day goes back to growing up in the 70's. I still use it, and it can be used with absolute endearment, and those who hear me use it know I mean it as such... there are other ways of using it where it is not so endearing.
Now, if you listen to this interviewer and hear how he is showing utmost respect to Billy and the "boys" and contrast that to this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkvCDCOGzGc
then you might see my point. This always struck me as a bit more tense, not because of the "boys" comment, but Earl's demeanor in general. Leonard, in contrast, seems to be admist the gods themselves, with that grin of his, and damn right he shoulda!
But Earl? I always thought the way Bird looks at Earl in that exchange is flat out "damn, I gotta restrain myself, gotta stay cool, but I wanna take his ***** head off... ", and then when he blows that last phrase before Diz comes in, he puffs up that last gasp of air, mutherf****** lets that **** out, jesus, I cried the first time I saw that!!!! seriously, I left a message on the answering machine of that phrase and would call it just to hear it.
Oh, wait, is that Ed on bass?

No man, It's Sandy Block. We went through this a while back here, and our buddy Ike Harris did the research. The drummer is Charlie Smith, an old 52nd streeter.
Gornick, you seem like a sensible, intelligent cat. I think you know what the deal is here. WE give words power. When the words M***** F***** came into being it was, by no means, meant to be a compliment. Many of us use it today, myownself included, as a term of endearment AND respect. (Ed Fuqua is a M****** F******).
That clip with Bird and Diz, as you know, caused a big stink even when it came out....rightfully so. People were fighting for their human rights and lives, even. Earl became a laughing stock because of it....rightfully so.
I'm old enough to have lived through this, sometimes ugly sometimes very beautiful, era....every which way...with my black heros. I went through that period, and I've mentioned this in these pages many times before, when I wished I could have been black just to be more like my heros.
I've been through the reverse deal too, because of my whiteness.....blah, blah...

Eddie was VERY famous. He won ALL the Metronome and Downbeat Magazine polls, pre-Ray Brown and Mingus.

I even remember the time when Paul Chambers and Red Mitchell (racially balanced great bassists) tied for New-Star Bassist of the year in Downbeat.
Funny, I can remember all this **** and not remember where the hell I put my glasses.

[Gornick]

You can't argue with experience! thanks paul

I don't know the complete history of language, but I do enjoy learning about it, the more the better! It's difficult when you take current mores and superimpose them on the past, I think. Definitely a problem with inflexible political correctness. I can guess a million times more in body language, facial expression and tone of voice than I can in actual words when watching those old clips. I first saw that Bird clip in the film Bird Now, I think, before the youtube thing, so my emotional attachment is longstanding.


I think I do remember that we concluded it wasn't Ed in the Bird clip, here on the forums. I would love to see more Ed though! here is a good clip of his right hand:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMwGigaQ0Kg

[Paul Warburton]

Your mention of body language is huge, IMO. Lookit Bird...dignity.

When Eddie isn't doing his full-out right hand thing, his regular plucking technique reminds of John Clayton's...(in the begining of your clip).

[ZonGuy]

I am glad Eddie Safranski casme up and I got to see the clip.

Many years ago, I showed a book of bass transcriptions to an old timer from NYC and when he saw Eddie's name in there, he broke out laughing, saying the guy was known as the "bear claw" and didn't belong with the others. I always wondered about that.

Now that I have seen the clip, I think he had a hell of a driving thump.

[Ike Harris]

BOYS, BOYS! . . .

[Paul Warburton]

Ouch.....

[Jake deVilliers]

Thanks for that video link Gornick! Fantastic to see the young Toshiko Akiyoshi playing with Thigpen et al. After seeing the way she was dressed and presented in 1958 its apparent that we have made some progress socially.

Crazy right hand on Safranski but I like his feel.

[Gornick]

That's funny, we just finished going back and forth on the political correct issue, and it comes back up.

I thought the same thing when i saw the Toshiko kimono! I haven't heard much of her stuff, though I think she has a regular big band in NY, and I have heard a little of it on the radio. need to look it up, she sounds great.

Ed's right hand does have a little John Clayton in it, or vice versa. That is an excellent feel, the kinda thing that makes me want to go gut for a minute to check it out!

[Jake deVilliers]

I have a couple of Toshiko Akiyoshi/Lew Tabacken big band records that just rock! I'm going to have to get way back in the closet and put them on the turntable...

[James Gibson]

the second i saw this clip, it reminded me of the technique you notice around the 00:34 mark in this famous video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TdMn3SBJdg

[James Gibson]

interesting to see the guitarist's amp laying on it's back, with what looks to be a microphone on top of the cone. obviously to act as a monitor to him and the rest of the band, just never seen that done before.

i'm too young though...