intonation practice - Page 4

damonsmith · #61 04-24-2010, 01:30 PM

I don't think those funky strings are helping him, lucky for him A. he is Ron Carter and B. there is still some beauitful music there. Often, the guys who really came up in the unamplified gut world have a strange transition to the clarity of how the bass is reproduced now.
He is still an innovative and important bass player.

I believe the string choice kept him from arco practice. I believe I can hear that in his playing.

FMartin · #62 04-24-2010, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Fret

But talking about intonation: if my intonation was like that in a lesson I
will get slapped on the fingers.

I'd trade perfect intonation -if I had it- for half of Ron's sense of rythm, dynamics and plucking hand any day (not to mention getting to play with Herbie and Cobham!)... But that's just me.

Les Fret · #63 04-25-2010, 02:50 AM

yeah me too of course. Really like his playing and walking bass lines.
But the intonation on this clip is still way off.
In this clip it is compensated by musicality. Although it gets kind of boring after 4 minutes or so.

Jack Clark · #64 04-25-2010, 09:52 AM

Well, I held off as long as I could from listening to that Ron Carter youtube clip you guys have been talking about because I was afraid this was going to happen, and it did: I can't hear the bad intonation on it. Guess I've got no ear.

This is not good news.

Is it in a particular part or throughout?

PsychoScout · #65 04-25-2010, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nickchalk

Does anybody know any good excersices for intonation practice (apart from scales and general practice)?

use a bow

PsychoScout · #66 04-25-2010, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Fret

But talking about intonation: if my intonation was like that in a lesson I
will get slapped on the fingers.

that's silly, you need those.... I only get slapped on my butt if my intonation sucks

PsychoScout · #67 04-25-2010, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Clark

Well, I held off as long as I could from listening to that Ron Carter youtube clip you guys have been talking about because I was afraid this was going to happen, and it did: I can't hear the bad intonation on it. Guess I've got no ear.

This is not good news.

Is it in a particular part or throughout?

perhaps he's playing an arabic version? perhaps you were brought up listening to arabic scales?

morris33333 · #68 04-25-2010, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Ludlam

I use Cakewalk Home Audio 9. It is very simple to create a program of tonics drones to play scales over. Plus, it has an available metronome. Additionally, I use the software for accompaniment. It does have some drawbacks, but I can program a string quartet or piano, etc. It is pretty limitless. I think the software is under $100.

"Audacity" is freeware sound editing software you can generate drone pitches with. Use the "generate" menu. http://audacity.sourceforge.net/
Runs on windows & mac.

It's pretty good for recording too, though Cakewalk may well be better...

Les Fret · #69 04-25-2010, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Clark

Well, I held off as long as I could from listening to that Ron Carter youtube clip you guys have been talking about because I was afraid this was going to happen, and it did: I can't hear the bad intonation on it. Guess I've got no ear.

This is not good news.

Is it in a particular part or throughout?

The good news is that when you can not hear it you don't have to worry about your own bad intonation anymore!

When you listen to the beginning of the clip you already hear it. To be honest; he is never really on it in this solo.

Don Higdon · #70 04-25-2010, 12:49 PM

The clip is exhibit A in why I hate amps.

damonsmith · #71 04-25-2010, 01:55 PM

Yeah, I think he needs to be listened to with the historical context in mind. I am not sure if you are aware Les, his intonation has been brought up a lot.
I think it has even helped raise the standards of playing!
He still has to be listened to as someone who pushed boundries and innovated. The instrument was not as out front when he was comming up and he is one of several who pushed it forward.

Myself, I hate those strings more than amps.

adarrell · #72 04-25-2010, 08:29 PM

Practicing NEXT to a piano always helps too.You can do the painstaking but very effective, "play a note on the piano then play it on the bass" exercise, doing that through all the scales. Just wrapping your ear around the 12 notes that are "fixed" in western music will help you play any instrument that allows you the grace of being able to play a little flat or sharp. Playing piano or guitar, developing your ear in general will make the physical aspect of finding pitches on the bass a lot less strenuous.

Les Fret · #73 04-26-2010, 02:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Higdon

The clip is exhibit A in why I hate amps.

don't think you can 'blame' it on the amp or strings. With an amp you should be able to hear yourself better so it is easier to get good intonation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by damonsmith

Yeah, I think he needs to be listened to with the historical context in mind. I am not sure if you are aware Les, his intonation has been brought up a lot.
I think it has even helped raise the standards of playing!

Can you explain that 2nd and last sentence?
Just to say it again, don't want any confusion: I really really like Ron Carter. He is in my top 5 list of best jazz bassplayers.

Don Higdon · #74 04-26-2010, 07:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Fret

don't think you can 'blame' it on the amp or strings. With an amp you should be able to hear yourself better so it is easier to get good intonation.

I don't "blame" the bad intonation on the amp or strings.
If it will make things clearer, in addition to his intonation, I don't like the quality of his sound, which is a consequence of his set-up, which includes using the amp, rather than the bass, to generate the sound.

PsychoScout · #75 04-26-2010, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Fret

don't think you can 'blame' it on the amp or strings. With an amp you should be able to hear yourself better so it is easier to get good intonation.

Can you explain that 2nd and last sentence?
Just to say it again, don't want any confusion: I really really like Ron Carter. He is in my top 5 list of best jazz bassplayers.

hey, I love Paul Chambers, even though his intonation often sucked as well

damonsmith · #76 04-26-2010, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adarrell

Practicing NEXT to a piano always helps too.

Assuming the piano has been tuned recently. Otherwise it just helps you get in tune with THAT piano in it's current state.

bejoyous · #77 04-26-2010, 01:13 PM

I use an electronic keyboard with a very pure organ patch for my drone. I use a stick of wood to hold down a key to play the drone.

Also, holding a note on the bass and singing/humming scales is a good way to improve your ear.

When I wasn't playing bass for a few years, I sang in a church choir. When I went back to bass playing, my intonation was better than ever.

Raka · #78 05-03-2010, 02:57 PM

While I spent a lot of time years ago studying scales (I used to study violin) using computer generated scales as reference (playing unison), I found to my regret that this was not the optimal system. You can make progress, I did, but for me best thing was octaves. Playing octaves is very demanding for the hand shape, which is crucial for playing. I mean, with the hear you locate the hand in octaves, and when you have a good hand position you can improve "easily" the intonation.
Now that I'm starting with the double bass, I can not directly pass this to intonation