NHØP technique thread

[Chris Fitzgerald]

I just got done (re)watching the Kenny Drew Trio video with NHØP (with "Brewhouse Jazz" in the background), and was wondering a few things about Niels' technique. From what I can tell, the RH part of it seems to be a pretty straightforward outside-in three finger banjo roll, always starting from the ring and moving in towards the index. It also looks like it's a fairly "horizontal" technique, which makes it very appealing to me because I'd like to gain RH facility and speed at times but have never found the sound, feeling, or groove of the perpendicular RH technique. Since my LH can pretty much dust my RH speedwise, the path that Niels lit with the light of his greatness seems like an obvious one to explore.

Does anyone know of any existing materials out there specifically about Niels' technique, especially his RH technique (I saw him use a couple of "Simandl illegal" fingerings with the 3rd finger down low in his LH, but nothing earth shattering other than the grace with which he plays)? Youtube video links are good, but I'd also like to find any written material which might provide some further insight into what he's specifically doing, if possible including examples and exercises to get the journey started. If anybody knows anything, post it here!

Slightly off topic: in the Kenny Drew video, he seems to have a sort of mixing board built into a suitcase sitting open next to him. While I'm not the biggest fan of the tone he gets on this video (before anybody flames me for this, I am absolutely astounded by the musicality and technique), it would be interesting to hear his thoughts on tone and pickups, or any information about how he chased his version of THE SOUND.

[ep-98-z]

Chris,

Great thread idea!

I was watching the same DVD this weekend and have many of the same questions you have. Hopefully there is some information out there.

Amazing to watch his playing and he looks so relaxed at those blistering speeds that I almost can't believe it.

[BassmanDk]

Being a fellow dane, i saw him many times. And talk with him a couple of times and im constantly surrounded by some of his former students.

NHØP travelled with a custombuilt preamp made by a friend. He was always stuck playing some houseamp and this way he got some control back.
Can't remember the friends name.... Anybody?

[Chris Fitzgerald]

Here's what I've gotten so far from the video:

* The three finger technique is used only in passages which require extra speed/facilty from the RH; at other times, he plays with two fingers in a very traditional style.

* For ascending passages, he seems to use a straight r-m-i r-m-i r-m-i* approach to fingering regardless of the subdivision or accent pattern of the line. When he's playing triplets, the fingering matches the articulation. When he's playing 8ths or 16ths, the accent shifts from finger to finger with the grouping, which is what makes the technique so practice intensive.

* For descending passages, he does much the same except that he uses a "drop rake" technique when crossing to a lower string, in which case he uses the same finger that played the last note on the higher string, then continues the pattern.

By way of example, a two octave C major scale (up and down) played in first position up to the B and then upward along the G string would be fingered:

(ascending)
C...D...E...F...G...A...B...C...D...E...F...G...A. ..B...C
r...m...i... r...m...i... r...m...i... r...m...i... r...m...i

(descending)
C...B...A...G...F...E...D...C...B...A...G...F...E. ..D...C
r...m...i... r...m...i... r...m...i...r...m...m...i... r... r

Until I find some better info, I'll start by practicing major scales under this principle. Ideas, info, anyone? Bueller?




* (r=ring, m=middle, i=index)

[robgrow]

I have loved Niels playing ever since I first heard him in the early 70's. Frankly I've always been dazzled watching him. Kind of like watching a magician. Thanks Chris for posting your observations. I'm not sure how much I'll be able to incorporate any of this into my own playing, but it's great food for thought.

[Mark Carlsen]

Chris, may I suggest looking up his interview in a back issue of Bass Player mag. I seem to recall him talking about his famous bass, the pickup and preamp info and also a helpful daily exercise he did w. major scales in some manner.He did mention he saw Cecil McBee w. Charles Lloyd [Nicko] in 1966 and stole the three finger technique from him...

[MR PC]

Originally Posted by Mark Carlsen

Chris, may I suggest looking up his interview in a back issue of Bass Player mag. I seem to recall him talking about his famous bass, the pickup and preamp info and also a helpful daily exercise he did w. major scales in some manner.He did mention he saw Cecil McBee w. Charles Lloyd [Nicko] in 1966 and stole the three finger technique from him...

Isn't that the same interview in which he describes most bass solo's as sounding like a bug trying to get out of a jar? The man had a rare sense of humor!

[Zachmozach]

I don't know if it's even worth considering but I see NHOP's technique paralleling electric technique in a lot of ways especially with the RH. So maybe checking out Steve Bailey at least for practice ideas on the three finger thing might make some sense. I think there is a DVD out where he explains his use of the 3 finger thing on EB. It might help at least to get some of the accents for which fingers stuff together.

I think since I started playing classical guitar at a young age and only fairly recently switched to playing first EB bass and now primarily UB it is natural for me to use my ring if I want but I've never liked the sound and plain just can't play fast enough to need it. I think I'm still faster with two than three just barely but maybe some practice might change that. I should really post the rest of the NHOP videos I have on youtube though as that might be the most helpful.

[Wilbyman]

Hey Chris, I've been kind of messing with this tonight and it feels fairly natural once you play around with it. I wouldn't say it "comes naturally", but the circular nature of the outside-inside roll somehow feels less strenuous and more breath-like than the weed-whacking pulse of two fingers. I might just go along with it for a while.

W

[Chris Fitzgerald]

As I discovered last week, you have to be careful when you start practicing this technique, as the ring finger tends to blister easily. The past few days, I've been doing about 10 minutes of this in an effort to ease the poor fingertip into the grind. Also, one of my students says he has a copy of an article Neils wrote about the technique with a few basic exercises to get started. I'll report back when I see it.

[Alex Scott]

Does he put his thumb a little higher than his other fingers? I saw Eddie Gomez do this on the Oslo concert dvd with Bill Evans and it seems like it has a lot of technical advantage I was missing.

To explain, try this. on a table hit ring middle index over and over again and move your thumb back and forth from an under the fingerboard type position to a more pianistic position and see where the sweet spot lies.

[Niels Brown]

As far as the tone thing is concerned, a big part of it was his pickup system, which is acutally four individual magnetic pickups for each string, which can be turned to adjust the volume of each string. I believe the fact that it was a magnetic p'up system played a large factor into his sound. I'm not sure about what kind of amplification he was using. And of course, there's his bass and his hands, the most important parts...

[Alex Scott]

OH, a really good source is Wayne Darling, another bass player. I saw him at the convention and he gave a lecture on NHOP.

[Wilbyman]

How is anybody coming with this? I'm getting a nasty blister as Chris indicated but I am getting hooked on the "circular" feel of it. I am not using the "drop rake" as I feel this kind of impedes the flow a bit.

One thing I am trying to decide on is thumb placement...on electric, we tend to move the entire hand (floating thumb) to keep the attack consistent from string to string. It seems a little harder to do this on upright because of the big fingerboard radius.

[Kaspar Vadsholt]

I studied with Niels-Henning in the 90's.
He made me practise two-octave major scales, alternating index-second-third RH fingers. It's actually a quite simple exercise to get you going:
With the metronome set to 60-80bpm, start out playing a two octave E major scale up and down with eight notes, two on each step, e-e, f#-f#, g#-g# etc.
When you reach the bottom, go up and down the scale again, this time with only one note per step, thus doubling the speed of the left hand.
Now you double the speed of the right hand, playing 16th notes but preserving the speed of the left hand, thus again doubling the notes per step, e-e, f#-f# etc.
Lastly, the left hand doubles the speed, so you again play one note per step, this time with 16ths, up and down the scale.
Repeat the above in the key of F, and so on chromatically all the way up to up to and including Eb.

He called it "Bass Body Building"
Hope I made it clear, and it helps

[Kaspar Vadsholt]

By the way, I think he only used the Wilson pickup in later years, spiro reds, and a flexocor G,

[Mikey D]

I made a thread a while ago now about NHOP in general, and found a very similar post that Kaspar made a long time ago, so I made a basic sheet for scale practice.

Am I right in thinking that you said this is the only thing NHOP actually practiced on a regular basis?

Anyway, here is the sheet I made for my own reference: NHOP Practice

I find that it is easier to do right-middle-index, rather than, index-middle-ring as Kaspar states. And from what i can see in NHOP videos, this is the way he does it.

I find this comes very naturally (although I'm not very good at upright yet) as I have played with 3 and 4 fingers on electric for many years.

[oliebrice]

I saw Palle Danielsson play on sunday, and was interested to see he uses a 3 finger right hand technique, but without any obvious logic to when he uses which finger. He sometimes alternated first and second finger on a fast passage, and then played an isolated long note with the third!
Anyway, he played beautifully....

[Mikey D]

Originally Posted by oliebrice

I saw Palle Danielsson play on sunday, and was interested to see he uses a 3 finger right hand technique, but without any obvious logic to when he uses which finger. He sometimes alternated first and second finger on a fast passage, and then played an isolated long note with the third!
Anyway, he played beautifully....

With John Taylor? I saw the gig in birmingham...lovely playing all round. I really enjoyed Palle's playing and noticed how natural his right hand look playing with whatever finger he wanted at any time.

Nice, nice, very nice; Nice, Nice, very nice; Nice, nice, very nice --

[oliebrice]

[quote=Mikey D;5202153]With John Taylor? I saw the gig in birmingham.../QUOTE]

yeah, at the Vortex in London. Very special gig...